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Thread: [PVP] Machariel

  1. #21
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    Re: Machariel

    Quote Originally Posted by Sponk
    Quote Originally Posted by Platypus King
    Is it ok to buy a mach with Gal BS at 4?
    Always.
    What about not having T2 Large ACs?

  2. #22
    Dodgy Past's Avatar
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    Re: Machariel

    Quote Originally Posted by Durzel
    Quote Originally Posted by Sponk
    Quote Originally Posted by Platypus King
    Is it ok to buy a mach with Gal BS at 4?
    Always.
    What about not having T2 Large ACs?
    I'd feel very embarrassed not to have T2 guns on a DPS ship, though I tend to make it a habit to train T2 weapons before the ship skill to avoid this happening.

    As to Gal BS 4, well personally I fall into that club and while I think it should be improved I think other skills are far more important such as all the navigation / cap skills since the speed / agility is what makes the ship stand out despite those not being tied to the ship bonuses.

  3. #23
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    Re: Machariel

    I was only half-serious... not being able to use 800mm Repeating Artillery II is pretty much what's stopping me flying this ship.

  4. #24
    Pacefalm's Avatar
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    Re: Machariel

    If you can afford the ship you can buy RF AC's too which have all the good stuff of t2 AC apart from the obvious no Barrage. But your falloff isn't bad regardless so not having t2 ammo isn't your biggest worry, should be next on your list though once you're actually in the thing.
    Quote Originally Posted by QuackBot View Post
    I'm doing my best. Well. Not really.

  5. #25
    Super Moderator DonorGlobal Moderator whispous's Avatar
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    Re: Machariel

    Quote Originally Posted by Pacefalm
    If you can afford the ship you can buy RF AC's too which have all the good stuff of t2 AC apart from the obvious no Barrage. But your falloff isn't bad regardless so not having t2 ammo isn't your biggest worry, should be next on your list though once you're actually in the thing.

    THE WHOLE POINT OF MINMATAR

  6. #26
    Pacefalm's Avatar
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    Re: Machariel

    Quote Originally Posted by whispous
    Quote Originally Posted by Pacefalm
    If you can afford the ship you can buy RF AC's too which have all the good stuff of t2 AC apart from the obvious no Barrage. But your falloff isn't bad regardless so not having t2 ammo isn't your biggest worry, should be next on your list though once you're actually in the thing.

    THE WHOLE POINT OF MINMATAR
    Quote Originally Posted by Pacefalm
    But your falloff isn't bad regardless so not having t2 ammo isn't your biggest worry,
    Quote Originally Posted by QuackBot View Post
    I'm doing my best. Well. Not really.

  7. #27
    Tordin Varglund's Avatar
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    Re: Machariel

    Unless ur flying in a gang id say its unlikely barrage will be your best choice of ammo in 90% of the situations anyway. That said, id still wait.
    Quote Originally Posted by LeonM View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by W0lf Crendraven View Post
    Im serious.
    That's the sad part.

  8. #28

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    Re: Machariel

    When I was learning to fly the mach in smalls gangs, I initially started out by fitting an un-scripted sebo and using barrage, hanging around the 50-100km range, until I became comfortable with the ship's handling. Now that I'm used to it, I stick around 30-50km (point range -> heated+linked point range) and use close range ammo. I don't bother carrying barrage anymore.

  9. #29

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    Re: Machariel

    Quote Originally Posted by Djakku
    What "level of pimpage" is acceptable on a Mach? Take a small gang for example, Mach fitted with an active shield like the fits above. Do you really really benefit from the x-type booster and mwd for the isk? or do you get similar results with say a b-type or even dread guristas etc etc. ?

    I know the stats are greater with more expensive modules in t'old EFT, but Im talking mostly to the veteran mach pilots who have lost one or two here, where is the cut-off point where the extra isk spent isn't worth the performance?

    Or is it even just "pack as much isk into it or gtfo tbh"?

    I already take it Crystals, 30km point, faction gyro's and neut, t2 rigs are an essential...
    i quote Djakku hoping some veteran will answer him and add one question: Snake or Crystals?

  10. #30
    Helen's Avatar
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    Re: Machariel

    How much you jizz on a Mach is really down to how much ISK you got.
    I preferred it with Snakes with passive shield tank mainly so I had EHP to survive those fucking alphafleets and gtfo.

  11. #31

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    Re: Machariel

    crystals. if you are in a situation where you have enough enemies to alpha your battleship and you arent at 150km+ with arties you really shouldnt be in a mach.

    my pvp course is on hold atm until after AT unless you make me an offer I cant resist. sorry

  12. #32

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    Re: Machariel

    Just wondering if anyone would be willing to share their experiences with armour Mach vs. shield Mach?
    Do you guys prefer one greatly over the other?

    These two fits posted by 2ippy seem to have fairly similar stats, most notable difference being the slight trade between speed and ehp that armour gives.
    If armour tanking is considered, would halo implants for some degree of sig tanking be a viable alternative to slaves, or is it slaves or gtfo?

    Quote Originally Posted by 2ippy
    [Machariel, Armor Mach]
    [spoiler:288pr4mp]Damage Control II
    Centus A-Type Large Armor Repairer
    Centus A-Type Large Armor Repairer
    Corpum A-Type Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane
    Corpum A-Type Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane
    Republic Fleet Gyrostabilizer
    Republic Fleet Gyrostabilizer

    Core X-Type 100MN MicroWarpdrive
    Imperial Navy Heavy Capacitor Booster, Navy Cap Booster 800
    Federation Navy Stasis Webifier
    Federation Navy Stasis Webifier
    Republic Fleet Warp Disruptor

    Dual 650mm Repeating Artillery II, Republic Fleet EMP L
    Dual 650mm Repeating Artillery II, Republic Fleet EMP L
    Dual 650mm Repeating Artillery II, Republic Fleet EMP L
    Dual 650mm Repeating Artillery II, Republic Fleet EMP L
    800mm Repeating Artillery II, Republic Fleet EMP L
    800mm Repeating Artillery II, Republic Fleet EMP L
    800mm Repeating Artillery II, Republic Fleet EMP L
    True Sansha Heavy Energy Neutralizer

    Large Auxiliary Nano Pump II
    Large Auxiliary Nano Pump I
    Large Nanobot Accelerator I


    Ogre II x4
    Warrior II x5[/spoiler:288pr4mp]With slaves and ganglinks:
    144k EHP, 21.5K Armor
    1120 DPS W/ Ogre's
    Tank: 2200/2600
    1502 m/s

    [Machariel, Machariel active beast]
    [spoiler:288pr4mp]Damage Control II
    Republic Fleet Gyrostabilizer
    Republic Fleet Gyrostabilizer
    Republic Fleet Tracking Enhancer
    Republic Fleet Tracking Enhancer
    Nanofiber Internal Structure II
    Nanofiber Internal Structure II

    Gist X-Type 100MN MicroWarpdrive
    Dread Guristas Invulnerability Field
    Pith X-Type X-Large Shield Booster
    Heavy Capacitor Booster II, Navy Cap Booster 800
    Republic Fleet Warp Disruptor

    800mm Repeating Artillery II, Republic Fleet EMP L
    800mm Repeating Artillery II, Republic Fleet EMP L
    800mm Repeating Artillery II, Republic Fleet EMP L
    800mm Repeating Artillery II, Republic Fleet EMP L
    800mm Repeating Artillery II, Republic Fleet EMP L
    800mm Repeating Artillery II, Republic Fleet EMP L
    800mm Repeating Artillery II, Republic Fleet EMP L
    True Sansha Heavy Energy Neutralizer

    Large Anti-EM Screen Reinforcer II
    Large Anti-Thermal Screen Reinforcer II
    Large Anti-Kinetic Screen Reinforcer II


    Hammerhead II x5
    Warrior II x5
    Vespa EC-600 x5[/spoiler:288pr4mp]
    With crystals and ganglinks:
    94k EHP, 13k shields
    1049 dps W/ Hammerheads
    about 2000/2500 dps omnitank
    1700m/s
    These are the two fits in question.

  13. #33

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    Machariel

    Always fly with snakes I fly in low sec so big alpha fleets aren't a concern.

    Doing 3k overheated getting off gates while people try to chase you down is priceless.

  14. #34
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    Re: Machariel

    Quote Originally Posted by whispous
    Quote Originally Posted by Pacefalm
    If you can afford the ship you can buy RF AC's too which have all the good stuff of t2 AC apart from the obvious no Barrage. But your falloff isn't bad regardless so not having t2 ammo isn't your biggest worry, should be next on your list though once you're actually in the thing.

    THE WHOLE POINT OF MINMATAR
    With EMP you're already at locking range, barrage is a whopping 110ish KM. Also wouldn't best named be the cheaper way to do the T2 equivalent for stats? Haven't checked because I trained T2 guns before I trained minnie battleship due to me not being a lazy twat.

  15. #35
    Sparkus Volundar's Avatar
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    Re: Machariel

    Quote Originally Posted by Tellenta
    With EMP you're already at locking range, barrage is a whopping 110ish KM. Also wouldn't best named be the cheaper way to do the T2 equivalent for stats? Haven't checked because I trained T2 guns before I trained minnie battleship due to me not being a lazy twat.
    I might have missunderstood the bit about stats but If using T2 guns you are probably gonna have at least 11% more alpha than best named guns. +5% from the weapon skill to 5 requirement and +6% from getting the spec skill to Lv3, which is pretty fast.

    Sparks
    Now I have a T2 gun. Ho, ho, ho.

    SHC '10 and proud.

  16. #36

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    Re: Machariel

    Quote Originally Posted by Sparkus Volundar
    I might have missunderstood the bit about stats but If using T2 guns you are probably gonna have at least 11% more alpha than best named guns. +5% from the weapon skill to 5 requirement and +6% from getting the spec skill to Lv3, which is pretty fast.
    Sparks
    I've been looking at the stats for best named (800mm heavy 'scout' repeating artillery) and T2 (800mm Repeating Artillery II) on Evelopedia and I can't see any differences between them, beyond the increased cpu/pg requirements of the T2 guns.

    Am I right in assuming that, other than required skills for T2 guns increasing damage (and access to T2 ammo, which on a Mach is arguably not that useful) there is no difference between best named and T2?

    Would it not be in our best interest (provided people are not interested in T2 ammo) to just fit best named guns for the decreased fitting costs and train the T2 skills anyway?

  17. #37
    Donor Rudolf Miller's Avatar
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    Re: Machariel

    Quote Originally Posted by Naomi
    Quote Originally Posted by Sparkus Volundar
    I might have missunderstood the bit about stats but If using T2 guns you are probably gonna have at least 11% more alpha than best named guns. +5% from the weapon skill to 5 requirement and +6% from getting the spec skill to Lv3, which is pretty fast.
    Sparks
    I've been looking at the stats for best named (800mm heavy 'scout' repeating artillery) and T2 (800mm Repeating Artillery II) on Evelopedia and I can't see any differences between them, beyond the increased cpu/pg requirements of the T2 guns.

    Am I right in assuming that, other than required skills for T2 guns increasing damage (and access to T2 ammo, which on a Mach is arguably not that useful) there is no difference between best named and T2?

    Would it not be in our best interest (provided people are not interested in T2 ammo) to just fit best named guns for the decreased fitting costs and train the T2 skills anyway?
    technically t2 guns get a 2% per level ROF boost. so if you are crazy you get a 10% rof boost over meta 4

  18. #38
    Donor Shiodome's Avatar
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    Re: Machariel

    no, because the specialisation skills say "...+2% bonus per skill level to the damage of large turrets requiring large autocannon specialization" so the bonus doesn't apply to meta 0-4, or meta 6+. or to rephrase it, the spec skill only applies to turrets that have the spec skill as a requirement. (refering to naomi)

  19. #39

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    Re: Machariel

    Quote Originally Posted by Shiodome
    no, because the specialisation skills say "...+2% bonus per skill level to the damage of large turrets requiring large autocannon specialization" so the bonus doesn't apply to meta 0-4, or meta 6+. or to rephrase it, the spec skill only applies to turrets that have the spec skill as a requirement. (refering to naomi)
    Ah, I missed that. Thanks Shiodome .

    So if some one were to buy a Machariel before having access to T2 larges (some one was talking about doing this) it would be best to fit meta 4.
    10% damage is nothing to be sneezed at, but it's probably something you could delay if you were working on other mach-related skills.

  20. #40

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    Re: Machariel

    Quote Originally Posted by Naomi
    Quote Originally Posted by Shiodome
    no, because the specialisation skills say "...+2% bonus per skill level to the damage of large turrets requiring large autocannon specialization" so the bonus doesn't apply to meta 0-4, or meta 6+. or to rephrase it, the spec skill only applies to turrets that have the spec skill as a requirement. (refering to naomi)
    Ah, I missed that. Thanks Shiodome .

    So if some one were to buy a Machariel before having access to T2 larges (some one was talking about doing this) it would be best to fit meta 4.
    10% damage is nothing to be sneezed at, but it's probably something you could delay if you were working on other mach-related skills.
    no, if you cant wait for the skill to finish buy faction guns, its already too expensive a ship to gimp yourself and create a lol mail. fly tempests to get practice

    my pvp course is on hold atm until after AT unless you make me an offer I cant resist. sorry

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