Discussion: Removing player to player standings from the game.

[Artjay]

Proposal - simply remove the ability for players to set standings to each other. This would not affect how standings with NPC factions work.

OK so as an idea this initially sounds pretty retarded, but think it through for a second.

The goal of this would be to nerf the fuck out of nullsec mega coalitions, meaning that coordinating with each other would be almost impossibly tough, with friendly-on-friendly killings happening constantly, there would be almost no way to keep the peace between two neighbouring allies trying to work together. Hopefully this would force people who want to actively work together into one alliance/corp, assuming there would be a natural limit to how big an alliance could get in terms of logistical and cultural difficulties/differences, nullsec would become a lot more fragmented, and frankly interesting. I think this would apply to lowsec and npc null too as well as sov null.

Obviously this would have a challenging impact on lots of people, in all aspects of the game, but personally I think it would really make being in an alliance more meaningful for non-nullsec residents, and hopefully be the shake-up nullsec needs to becoming more dynamic and interesting for small-medium alliances who aspire to be independent.

Thoughts?

[root]

Hi

I think your idea would help a bit, but then some people will find other ways to make mega coaltions. I dont think there will be ever a good way to stop that.
And as you already mentioned, this will change the game for a lot of people, but only make it "better" for a small part.

I am in a lowsec corp with ~20 active members, I don't care how big the L0L.L0L allianz and coalitions are, but all our Alts (Scout, booster, transport) are out of corp with +10 standing. New applicants are +5 for a period of time until they get in corp.

TL;DR: I dont see the advantage compared to the loss of comfort.

[Mike deVoid]

IIRC they brought standings in because the goons were using an out of game tool to allow them to identify enemies in local. Remove standings and you'll force someone to come up with a tool to replicate the functionality. So regardless of theoretical benefit this idea is a bit of a non-starter.

[Cue1*]

You can't fix the blob. It's just not possible, people will always find ways to make the blob work. The best option is to make the gameplay itself discourage blob play.

[xanral]

Not a fan as it would make it harder for me in a solo/small gang environment and I don't have the time/interest in making/maintaining my own little program to get around it.

Blobbing is more of a human nature thing than anything else imo. I'd be more in favor of players combating the player created issue. Get a small group together to seed coalitions with "spies" meant to start diplomatic incidents (killing blues, smack talk, theft etc). Anything to erode trust. Hardly a new idea but get enough people doing it and it could have a detrimental effect as drama can lower morale way out of proportion to what actually happened. Even if it doesn't accomplish its task of straining relations to the breaking point you should get plenty of "free" kills that are blob free with the tiniest bit of planning.

Given that scenario only helps if you're the attacker so you can pick out your target(s) ahead of time or as a revenge mechanic. I've seen it work on small coalitions before.

[Marlona Sky]

There just needs to be downsides to being blue to everyone for ten regions instead of 'lack of targets'. Things like upgrading your sov/pos/station/whatever hurts your neighbors shit. Blue or not. Things to create internal drama and hatred. Thus standings being reset and a fight going down.

[OrangeAfroMan]

You can't fix the blob. It's just not possible, people will always find ways to make the blob work. The best option is to make the gameplay itself discourage blob play.

This.

Also i wouldn't be able to addressbook and -10 falcon pilots to identify later

[Sofia Roseburn]

IIRC they brought standings in because the goons were using an out of game tool to allow them to identify enemies in local. Remove standings and you'll force someone to come up with a tool to replicate the functionality. So regardless of theoretical benefit this idea is a bit of a non-starter.

BACON wasn't a Goon invention, it was used by practically anyone serious about botting and/or ratting semi-AFK.

[cerui]

IIRC they brought standings in because the goons were using an out of game tool to allow them to identify enemies in local. Remove standings and you'll force someone to come up with a tool to replicate the functionality. So regardless of theoretical benefit this idea is a bit of a non-starter.

:nitpickingcunt: you mean they brought in standings showing up in local

[Mike deVoid]

Well I couldn't remember the details since I only read about it, bit it's an example of functionality that CCP became obliged to include I'm the game because there were already effective hacks being used by the players since they wanted it so badly already. See also, warptozero

[Ampoliros]

it's a nonstarter

you're not removing or significantly nerfing the ability of people to cooperate; you're making it frustrating via making the UI obtuse and inefficient. It is the exact opposite of the direction the game needs to go in. As much as it pains me to say, Marlona's suggestion is a hell of a lot better; reward players and corps/alliances for acting in their own self-interest.

[KathDougans]

IIRC they brought standings in because the goons were using an out of game tool to allow them to identify enemies in local. Remove standings and you'll force someone to come up with a tool to replicate the functionality. So regardless of theoretical benefit this idea is a bit of a non-starter.

Was this the thing with cached portraits, using edited portraits that highlighted reds, so known enemies would show up in local memberlist ?

[Marlona Sky]

IIRC they brought standings in because the goons were using an out of game tool to allow them to identify enemies in local. Remove standings and you'll force someone to come up with a tool to replicate the functionality. So regardless of theoretical benefit this idea is a bit of a non-starter.

Was this the thing with cached portraits, using edited portraits that highlighted reds, so known enemies would show up in local memberlist ?

I remember that. Was a long time ago.

I just wish there was more local conflicts where bat phoning a blue from the other side of the galaxy was simply impractical. Even more so is for entities wanting to handle it themselves instead of going to pick a fight, getting a black eye and then running back to mommy and daddy to help them. Seems like almost every possible conflict in null turbo escalates to the same two or three super coalitions it has been for years.

[Cue1*]

IIRC they brought standings in because the goons were using an out of game tool to allow them to identify enemies in local. Remove standings and you'll force someone to come up with a tool to replicate the functionality. So regardless of theoretical benefit this idea is a bit of a non-starter.

Was this the thing with cached portraits, using edited portraits that highlighted reds, so known enemies would show up in local memberlist ?

I remember that. Was a long time ago.

I just wish there was more local conflicts where bat phoning a blue from the other side of the galaxy was simply impractical. Even more so is for entities wanting to handle it themselves instead of going to pick a fight, getting a black eye and then running back to mommy and daddy to help them. Seems like almost every possible conflict in null turbo escalates to the same two or three super coalitions it has been for years.

Mechanics that are designed to hurt or hamper the blob have been proven to not work. This is clearly obvious in W-space. Go attack Nova and I'll bet money that within a day or two the fight will be one sided, A-Harm+allies numbering above 100 against whatever 30 or so you could fit through.

If you want more local conflicts then there needs to be a way to promote alliances to not have blues. I don't mean a way to punish them for having blues, I mean a way to promote those smaller alliances to not need blues, or a way to give benefits to those who have fewer blues.

[RoemySchneider]

remove corps and alliances and everything that comes with it vOv

[Ophichius]

remove corps and alliances and everything that comes with it vOv

Burn. It. All. Down.

-O

[RoemySchneider]

well, i believe you know your friends and/or at least you can memorize a handful of names for that small gang you're flying with that night.

and it's those small gangs we all crave for, no? -.-



as soon as corp/alliance tickers come into play (read: overview), the blobbing starts vOv

[Amanto]

IIRC they brought standings in because the goons were using an out of game tool to allow them to identify enemies in local. Remove standings and you'll force someone to come up with a tool to replicate the functionality. So regardless of theoretical benefit this idea is a bit of a non-starter.

BACON wasn't a Goon invention, it was used by practically anyone serious about botting and/or ratting semi-AFK.

This was waaaaaaaaaaaay before BACON, and did something totally different

[Suitonia]

Would fuck over NRDS pretty hard too.

[Marlona Sky]

Would fuck over NRDS pretty hard too.

Cool.