[Devblog] Tech is fine l2p

[Baarhyn]

Yeah, they tried the same with ferrogel earlier, but failed miserably in it, mainly due to the low yield of the alchemy reactions.

Current volume for platech in jita is around 200k units per day (most of that stuff doesn't even go thru jita but is reacted on site to materials) to satisfy that volume of jita trading by alchemy would require 416 alchemy towers running....

Sounds like a challenge

[Madner Kami]

Sounds like a challenge

As much a challenge as it is to attempt to have 5 or 6 alts with 6 PI planets each, maintaining them daily and trying to survive that for longer then a month without burning out...

But let's have a more detailed look at the numbers:

Assuming you buy your raw materials from Jita and sell them in Jita again, you currently can gain a profit of up to 12k ISK per unit of normal PlaTech, so a normal reaction hour will net you 2*200*12,000=4,800,000 ISK/h.
To achieve the same profit with Alchemy PlaTech, you'd have to get a per-unit profit of 4,800,000/2*10=240,000 ISK. Let that number sink in for a moment.

Or let's look at it that way:
With current prices, a normal Platinum Technite producer, if buying from and selling to Jita, gains 4.8m ISK/h, as established above.
The same producer (assuming he has only one tower) produces Alchemy Platinum Technite now and he calculates the following: 100*2*2,798=559,600 ISK for Cobalt plus 5*2*4,734=47,340 ISK for Platinum plus 683,000 ISK for fuel equals 1,289,940 ISK investment and what he gains is 20 units of PlaTech, equalling a profit of 210,040 ISK/h. Yes, you're reading right. He could do a few highsec anoms and earn more in the same time it takes him to transport the stuff. Granted, PlaTech prices are a bit low today, but I think you get the idea.

And there's another way to look at it, too, from a logistics-PoV, which kinda was already mentioned before:
A normal reaction demands 2*100*(1+0,8)+200=560m³ of items to create 400 units of PlaTech, so 1.4m³ per PlaTech unit.
An Alchemy PlaTech reaction demands 2*100*0,4+2*5*1+200=290m³ to create 20 units of PlaTech, so 14.5m³ per PlaTech unit. So to substitute a normal hour of PlaTech production, you'd need 14.5m³*400=5,800m³ of transportition capacity (and 20 towers instead of 1)...

Or let's have a look at the fuel-cost:
With a large tower and normal PlaTech reaction: Each ISK spend on fuel, increases the price for a unit of normal PlaTech by 0.0025 ISK (1/400).
With the same tower running Alchemy PlaTech reactions: Each ISK spend on fuel, increases the price of a unit of Alchemy PlaTech by 0.05 ISK (1/20).
And as is obvious, you need 20 towers to substitute one normal reaction tower. Any larger scale Alchemy PlaTeching would have a tremendous effect an fuel-prices and, ultimately, Alchemy PlaTech is self-defeating because of exactly that.

It's just not going to work. You'll earn less, you'll need more transportation, your production volumes are abysmal. The only real reason to actually do PlaTech Alchemy is, because you have no Technetium available at all. I can't recall that happening very often, unless you're completely cut-off from Jita.

[depili]

Yeah, running alchemy just makes no sense.

[cheeba]

dunno if this has been linked yet, but its a good article:

http://jestertrek.blogspot.de/2012/0...-new-boss.html

[RoemySchneider]

someone tell him how alchemy works, though, plz


i'm surprised to see people actually consider alchemy entirely cosisting of bought material.... discussing alchemy 'directly' on cobalt moons gets you to the same conclusion much more quickly and without hundreds of ifs -.-

[depili]

someone tell him how alchemy works, though, plz


i'm surprised to see people actually consider alchemy entirely cosisting of bought material.... discussing alchemy 'directly' on cobalt moons gets you to the same conclusion much more quickly and without hundreds of ifs -.-

Well, if you mine all the stuff by yourself it's actually decent as the fuel and materials will be free!

(no it won't, you will get 1,6M per hour "profit" then from the dual reactor stick...)

[RoemySchneider]

*ponder*

did anyone invest into platinum? i think that's the real (short term) bucket of joy here.... and will be unaffected if ccp decide to troll the tech-substitution to something else than cobalt

edit:
hurrr, i had memorized events in the correct order but someone on TS threw me off
* alchemy happened end of 2008. to see its effects on T2 prices, see QEN 3/2009, pdf-page 21. back then, dysp/prom was still king and thus ferrofluid is a good enough indicator, especially in context with alchemy -.-
* end of 2009 brought us the reshuffle in 'favor' of technetium. i am ashamed to admit that i've never touched alchemy since and had completely forgotten about the alchemy buff that happened alongside that disaster.
so... now i'm slightly confused if this 'new' alchemy will revert to the old 20:1 as stated in this devblog - or if it will adopt the current 5:1 ratio...

[Lusulpher]

Everyone is busy buying platinum...


Also, CCP taking another step in the correct direction. A step so tiny, their heel will still crush their toes.

[Madner Kami]

*ponder*

did anyone invest into platinum? i think that's the real (short term) bucket of joy here.... and will be unaffected if ccp decide to troll the tech-substitution to something else than cobalt

Shht, don't spill the beans.

/2m Platinum-Crew checking in, albeit by accident and not intend (counting zeros @6am doesn't work, I tell you)

[Jarnis]

In case someone hadn't noticed, CCP Fozzie updated the original thread and the new alchemy reactions will start at 10/1 ratio instead of 20/1.

Still not a "real" solution, mostly due to the massive quantity of POSes needed to do alchemy at the scale needed, but closer to what it should be. If you can be assed to run a massive farm of towers, I guess in theory there is ISK to be made now (subject to raw moongoo price fluctuations, of course)