Countering Tornados a.k.a. welcome to metagaming~

[Ruri]

Ultimately whether it was triage or not is besides the point.....I was mainly pointing out all the pathetic whining over how all those "cowards" wouldn't fight your 15-20 tornado + scimitar + CARRIER (triage or not it has shield reps) gang with only 5-10 people per group and 3 other groups of similar size potentially waiting to jump in the middle and help kill them while they engaged you.....

Cling to semantics,minor details, and random insults if you must to make yourselves feel better, but if that is your idea of a fair fight, you really have absolutely no right to act shocked when people don't take you up on it.....

In truth we were disappointed when we showed up at our POCO coming out of reinforced and the 40-odd people in local were not there to finish it off. We then gave out props to the HAC gang that warped to our carrier and engaged despite terrible odds, and only lost one ship while deaggressing. We fully expected to be fighting outnumbered, which Tornados are great at if they make it to the fight. Shit happens, we understand this, but we also feel that it's poor form to spend all that effort to reinforce someone's structures if you're a) not going to finish the job and b) not doing it to get a fight.

As another FWIW, the quality of our local smack (and our posting :V) is p. disappointing sometimes, I feel like it doesn't really represent us very well. If I could I would mandate that every person would have to wear a top hat and monocle in real life before they're allowed to type in local, which would encourage them to be more gentlemanly and fabulous; sadly all I can do is watch, and shake my head.

[Ripper548]

Ultimately whether it was triage or not is besides the point.....I was mainly pointing out all the pathetic whining over how all those "cowards" wouldn't fight your 15-20 tornado + scimitar + CARRIER (triage or not it has shield reps) gang with only 5-10 people per group and 3 other groups of similar size potentially waiting to jump in the middle and help kill them while they engaged you.....

Cling to semantics,minor details, and random insults if you must to make yourselves feel better, but if that is your idea of a fair fight, you really have absolutely no right to act shocked when people don't take you up on it.....

In truth we were disappointed when we showed up at our POCO coming out of reinforced and the 40-odd people in local were not there to finish it off. We then gave out props to the HAC gang that warped to our carrier and engaged despite terrible odds, and only lost one ship while deaggressing. We fully expected to be fighting outnumbered, which Tornados are great at if they make it to the fight. Shit happens, we understand this, but we also feel that it's poor form to spend all that effort to reinforce someone's structures if you're a) not going to finish the job and b) not doing it to get a fight.

As another FWIW, the quality of our local smack (and our posting :V) is p. disappointing sometimes, I feel like it doesn't really represent us very well. If I could I would mandate that every person would have to wear a top hat and monocle in real life before they're allowed to type in local, which would encourage them to be more gentlemanly and fabulous; sadly all I can do is watch, and shake my head.

Fair enough - I can understand the dissapointment......but so far as I can tell it doesn't even seem like you guys are sure who it WAS who reinforced the POCO....which is probably why all the random smack etc. has been rather vague/unfocused.....

I agree whoever hit your POCO probably owed you a fight....but the rest of the involved parties just happened to get caught in the wrong place at the wrong time, so all the whining/namecalling about them is rather futile and childish.....

v0v

Edit: Also, to be fair to whoever did reinforce the POCO.....I must admit that were I them - even if I had some trap prepared to spring on you, I would have been VERY hesitant to escalate enough to kill your chimera + whatever other caps you subsequently dropped with, apparently, *5* PL spais watching in local.......Thats a good way to welp a cap fleet.

[Tyrus Tenebros]

While ripper appears to have something of a point regarding the actual words in the OP and the related battle scenario, the thread was blissfully unaware of it and really actually quite productive until the last page of shitstorming from both sides.


TL;DR of this thread is:


Try to warp a group of bombers in to the middle of the nado gang and scram/web as many as you can with Loki-or-claymore boosted Afterburning bombers, and pray you focus fire.

[Rampro.]

While ripper appears to have something of a point regarding the actual words in the OP and the related battle scenario, the thread was blissfully unaware of it and really actually quite productive until the last page of shitstorming from both sides.


TL;DR of this thread is:


Try to warp a group of bombers in to the middle of the nado gang and scram/web as many as you can with Loki-or-claymore boosted Afterburning bombers, and pray you focus fire.

You could do that with any ship type really

[Daneel Trevize]

Well bombers are cloaky to not give the game away until at 0km, are frigs for being very hard to hit, and their bonused torps apply decent damage to mwd-ing BCs at ranges good for anything short of BS weapons/HMs.

[Ripper548]

Well, to stay on topic this time:

Range isn't going to be an issue....The closer you can hug the tornado gang the better. If you try to out-snipe a tornado gang in a frig gang or really any gang other than a larger tornado gang or a heavily buffer fit BS sniper gang you are just committing suicide.

The problem with most of these counters I'm seeing is that they all seem to rely on the tornados making a fundamental mistake - like hanging around in 1 spot long enough for a cloaky ship to get a warp-in.....or jumping through a gate without a scout.....or just plain being too stupid to either burn directly away or simply warp off when they see a frig gang flying towards them.

The tornado is a very vulnerable ship...but its also a very versatile ship...and I would say a good tornado fleet is one of the hardest to *reliably* counter in the entire game (which is why, as many people have already said, they are so good for fighting outnumbered). I'm sure its possible to counter them....but I don't know that I've seen any practical solutions for *general use* so far aside from a "bigger tornado gang" or a "bs sniper gang" or just harassment tactics with bombers, etc.

[Daneel Trevize]

I was talking about applying DPS to those tackled Tornados while they're trying to 'starburst'. Getting DPS onto the primary while tackling & hugging a different tier3/generally maintaining good transversal on the rest is going to need longer damage projection than most frigates can muster, or blaster cruisers.

[Rampro.]

ul probably want to kill the rapiers first