Prometheus (quasi-prequel to Alien)

[filingo]

My old man is going to see it tonight at imax.
Will report his thoughts if anyone cares.

bruce snr reviews best reviews

[filingo]

http://www.fxguide.com/featured/prom...wed-vfx-space/

[Fallout]

Ok I saw this movie today and it was pretty good.

  Spoiler:

Some of this might be completely fucking wrong but its my guess of things, I also haven't read through the thread.

- The guy who kills himself at the start of the film, if he is on Earth accidentally creates the human race? Seems to give a reason for the engineers to want them gone.

- I guess its established that the planet is a bioweapon research/storage place for the engineers?

- Seemingly the race of aliens create these research planets on barren worlds all over the place, like the one on the planet in Alien but create different weapons on each place?

- The alien at the end was the first ever evolution of the aliens in the original film? I think I remember someone saying in either Alien or Aliens that the aliens have evolved to be the perfect predators (or maybe it was in a AVP game not sure). The reason this kind of makes sense to me is cause the original squid was some huge impractical thing and then when it impregnated the engineer the result was a better form of alien.

- The only thing that doesn't make sense is the alien carving thing on the wall at some point.

[Paradox]

Ok I saw this movie today and it was pretty good.

  Spoiler:

Some of this might be completely fucking wrong but its my guess of things, I also haven't read through the thread.

- The guy who kills himself at the start of the film, if he is on Earth accidentally creates the human race? Seems to give a reason for the engineers to want them gone.

Yep, some people have even gone far enough to name him "Prometheus" as in the original Prometheus from Greek Mythology

- I guess its established that the planet is a bioweapon research/storage place for the engineers?

That and a forward operating base for a fleet of interstellar bombers (so cool) and it's probably for other things too but I think it's mostly a military base

- Seemingly the race of aliens create these research planets on barren worlds all over the place, like the one on the planet in Alien but create different weapons on each place?

I don't think we have an answer to that, LV426 might have just been a planet that that one ship crashed on, it might not have been used by the Engineers. I don't think we know.

- The alien at the end was the first ever evolution of the aliens in the original film? I think I remember someone saying in either Alien or Aliens that the aliens have evolved to be the perfect predators (or maybe it was in a AVP game not sure). The reason this kind of makes sense to me is cause the original squid was some huge impractical thing and then when it impregnated the engineer the result was a better form of alien.

It can't be the first Xenomorph because there's a giant image of a Xenomorph carved into the mural in the middle of the ship, it must have been a larval form like a chestburster that looked different than the ones we see in Alien because it had a non-human host. It might be a prototype version of the black goo I suppose, I don't really know.

- The only thing that doesn't make sense is the alien carving thing on the wall at some point.

Yeah that's a bit weird, part of it is an Engineer with his chest ripped open signifying self-sacrifice or something, self-sacrifice seems to be central to their culture which might be why they hate humans now (we stopped caring about it)

[Nu11u5]

http://www.fxguide.com/featured/prom...wed-vfx-space/

Impressed.

[Gesadt]

Ok I saw this movie today and it was pretty good.

  Spoiler:

Some of this might be completely fucking wrong but its my guess of things, I also haven't read through the thread.

- The guy who kills himself at the start of the film, if he is on Earth accidentally creates the human race? Seems to give a reason for the engineers to want them gone.
i too think it was earth. but reason why engineers changed their minds about us remain ambiguous

- I guess its established that the planet is a bioweapon research/storage place for the engineers?
yea

- Seemingly the race of aliens create these research planets on barren worlds all over the place, like the one on the planet in Alien but create different weapons on each place?
or it could be a ship from Prometheus planet (remember there are many of em there) but with more refined or final version of what black goo dna experimentation leads to

- The alien at the end was the first ever evolution of the aliens in the original film? I think I remember someone saying in either Alien or Aliens that the aliens have evolved to be the perfect predators (or maybe it was in a AVP game not sure). The reason this kind of makes sense to me is cause the original squid was some huge impractical thing and then when it impregnated the engineer the result was a better form of alien.
i think its Ash in Alien who remarks that the Xenomporph is a perfect lifeform. and the alien at the end of movie is and evolutionary step towards it i guess.

- The only thing that doesn't make sense is the alien carving thing on the wall at some point.
i guess engineers already knew what black goo crossbreeding can eventually lead to - perfect life form. maybe they also worshiped it.

[Ralara]

Can we stop with the spoiler tags now?

[Paradox]

It would ruin it for the Germans

[Nu11u5]

Can we stop with the spoiler tags now?

It hasn't even been out for a week yet in the US, and it doesn't come to Germany until September.

Maybe we should just change the title to '*spoilers*'.

[Fallout]

Ok I saw this movie today and it was pretty good.

  Spoiler:

Some of this might be completely fucking wrong but its my guess of things, I also haven't read through the thread.

- The guy who kills himself at the start of the film, if he is on Earth accidentally creates the human race? Seems to give a reason for the engineers to want them gone.

Yep, some people have even gone far enough to name him "Prometheus" as in the original Prometheus from Greek Mythology

- I guess its established that the planet is a bioweapon research/storage place for the engineers?

That and a forward operating base for a fleet of interstellar bombers (so cool) and it's probably for other things too but I think it's mostly a military base

- Seemingly the race of aliens create these research planets on barren worlds all over the place, like the one on the planet in Alien but create different weapons on each place?

I don't think we have an answer to that, LV426 might have just been a planet that that one ship crashed on, it might not have been used by the Engineers. I don't think we know.

- The alien at the end was the first ever evolution of the aliens in the original film? I think I remember someone saying in either Alien or Aliens that the aliens have evolved to be the perfect predators (or maybe it was in a AVP game not sure). The reason this kind of makes sense to me is cause the original squid was some huge impractical thing and then when it impregnated the engineer the result was a better form of alien.

It can't be the first Xenomorph because there's a giant image of a Xenomorph carved into the mural in the middle of the ship, it must have been a larval form like a chestburster that looked different than the ones we see in Alien because it had a non-human host. It might be a prototype version of the black goo I suppose, I don't really know.

- The only thing that doesn't make sense is the alien carving thing on the wall at some point.

Yeah that's a bit weird, part of it is an Engineer with his chest ripped open signifying self-sacrifice or something, self-sacrifice seems to be central to their culture which might be why they hate humans now (we stopped caring about it)

  Spoiler:

Ah I didn't notice the engineer on the wall carving, I guess the alien could just be an earlier version or an engineer type.

- Does the film ever explain what killed the engineers in the ship I don't think it did?

- Also are the snake things that kill those guys created from the worms in the dirt that the black stuff leaked onto?

[Paradox]

Ok I saw this movie today and it was pretty good.

  Spoiler:

Some of this might be completely fucking wrong but its my guess of things, I also haven't read through the thread.

- The guy who kills himself at the start of the film, if he is on Earth accidentally creates the human race? Seems to give a reason for the engineers to want them gone.

Yep, some people have even gone far enough to name him "Prometheus" as in the original Prometheus from Greek Mythology

- I guess its established that the planet is a bioweapon research/storage place for the engineers?

That and a forward operating base for a fleet of interstellar bombers (so cool) and it's probably for other things too but I think it's mostly a military base

- Seemingly the race of aliens create these research planets on barren worlds all over the place, like the one on the planet in Alien but create different weapons on each place?

I don't think we have an answer to that, LV426 might have just been a planet that that one ship crashed on, it might not have been used by the Engineers. I don't think we know.

- The alien at the end was the first ever evolution of the aliens in the original film? I think I remember someone saying in either Alien or Aliens that the aliens have evolved to be the perfect predators (or maybe it was in a AVP game not sure). The reason this kind of makes sense to me is cause the original squid was some huge impractical thing and then when it impregnated the engineer the result was a better form of alien.

It can't be the first Xenomorph because there's a giant image of a Xenomorph carved into the mural in the middle of the ship, it must have been a larval form like a chestburster that looked different than the ones we see in Alien because it had a non-human host. It might be a prototype version of the black goo I suppose, I don't really know.

- The only thing that doesn't make sense is the alien carving thing on the wall at some point.

Yeah that's a bit weird, part of it is an Engineer with his chest ripped open signifying self-sacrifice or something, self-sacrifice seems to be central to their culture which might be why they hate humans now (we stopped caring about it)

  Spoiler:

Ah I didn't notice the engineer on the wall carving, I guess the alien could just be an earlier version or an engineer type.

- Does the film ever explain what killed the engineers in the ship I don't think it did?

Not directly but it's probably the same thing that killed the crew of the Prometheus, Zombified guys that were exposed to the black goo.

- Also are the snake things that kill those guys created from the worms in the dirt that the black stuff leaked onto?

Yep, I have no idea what they fed on that made them that big but that's almost certainly why they showed us.

Directors cut might clarify a lot of this.

[Brullig]

Going to see it tonight, pretty excited. Hopefully not setting expectations too high. Probably 3D, non-IMAX

[Gesadt]

a lot of ppl seem to be hung up on the fact that these black-goo-borne creatures grow up seemingly without any food around. correct me if im wrong but didnt Xenomorph in Alien got fully grown before he made his first kill (harry dean stanton)?

[Nu11u5]

:spacemagic:

That, or the creatures are capable of cellular atomic fusion that can create all the necessary building blocks from their ambient environment.

Or, you know, spacemagic. Stop asking questions.

[Gesadt]

i didnt. i was merely pointing out that its not some sort of "plot hole" as people seem to think it is, since it already has a precedent.

[Lancehot]

Lancehot, did you actually watch the movie?

Yes. Apparently, however, I was too busy not getting it. As far as I'm concerned, it was Mission to Mars with some alien references thrown in (& a less interesting ensemble of characters). Everyone seems to be going on about how deep & clever & full of hidden meanings it is. But, as far as I saw it, there were only two "interesting" philosophical aspects to what allegedly is a "thinking" film: Ancient astronauts theory & the moral/ethical questions surrounding advanced android intelligence.

The first can be summed up as Biologist: You're going to reject 3 centuries of Darwinism because of some wall paintings? Archaeologist: Yes. The end. No effort is put into debating or developing an explanation for us being the genetically identical offspring of the Engineers. They find a head magically preserved for some reason. Its genetics match ours. That's it. As for the why they created us, that frankly seemed barely to get elaborated on except in the disappointed drunk ramblings of the guy who David infects, & then in a wonderful bit of plot exposition from the captain who randomly seems to have figured out exactly what the moon was & what the aliens had planned. Doesn't explain why the aliens seemed to want us to go to their military installation for 30+ thousand years before they decided they wanted to unleash the ooze on us. But whatever.

The David stuff might have been interesting on its own but because he's sharing a film with, an overly large cast of boring but screen hogging characters, his motivations are never developed beyond he's a robot & killing people is what robots do in Sci-fi. He infects the guy initially it seems because he some greater plan ("all things from small beginnings" I believe were his words) But what that plan is never seems to materialize because his interest (& that of the film in general) in the alien ooze offspring seems to evaporate the moment Weyland wakes up. Then its all "children want to kill their parents" because robots always want to kill their creators. Yes there's the whole humans have souls despite being made (in a rather convoluted way) by the engineers but androids don't because they're made by humans thing. But again little energy seemed to be exerted in exploring that apparent paradox beyond a few short & boring bits of dialogue.

Oh, & I recall there being some stuff about where God fits into the picture where humans were made by aliens (Elizabeth relying unquestioningly on the whole First Cause argument to make her faith & finding aliens compatible), but I ignored that because it's simply a case of lazy writing.

[Gesadt]

Lancehot, did you actually watch the movie?

Everyone seems to be going on about how deep & clever & full of hidden meanings it is. But, as far as I saw it, there were only two "interesting" philosophical aspects to what allegedly is a "thinking" film: Ancient astronauts theory & the moral/ethical questions surrounding advanced android intelligence.

no need for hyperbole.i dont think any of the meaning are particularly deep or hidden. movie is called Prometheus for chrissake.


No effort is put into debating or developing an explanation for us being the genetically identical offspring of the Engineers.

opening scene?

As for the why they created us, that frankly seemed barely to get elaborated on except in the disappointed drunk ramblings of the guy who David infects

why does it have to be elaborated. movie made its point on leaving things ambiguous.

then in a wonderful bit of plot exposition from the captain who randomly seems to have figured out exactly what the moon was & what the aliens had planned.

doesn't seem to be much of a stretch upon seeing bunch of black goo containers (and witnessing what it does) to figure out it some sort of payload with nefarious purpose. also he doesn't know what they have planned its Shaw wh tells him ship is headed for Earth (starmap)

Doesn't explain why the aliens seemed to want us to go to their military installation for 30+ thousand years before they decided they wanted to unleash the ooze on us. But whatever.

just cause something is left ambiguous != plot hole. deal with it. also you assume they wanted us to go there. it might as well been a warning to stay the fuck way. hence Shaw's line "we were so wrong" as to the purpose of the mission. as well as David quoting Lawrence of Arabia when they arrive at the planet "There is nothing in the desert and no man needs nothing". plus Weyland "we have nothing to learn from them" right before dieing.

T He infects the guy initially it seems because he some greater plan ("all things from small beginnings" I believe were his words) But what that plan is never seems to materialize because his interest (& that of the film in general) in the alien ooze offspring seems to evaporate the moment Weyland wakes up.

he doesn't have a "plan". same as android Ash in Alien he wants to run tests and experiment and human life is of secondary concern. Not to mention scene where Vickers confronts David and asks what did Weyland tell you. Where David responds "He said try harder". and indeed he does. all to the purpose of what Weyland wants, which is meeting live engineer i guess. thats why david wakes him up,- hes found a live one.


Then its all "children want to kill their parents" because robots always want to kill their creators. Yes there's the whole humans have souls despite being made (in a rather convoluted way) by the engineers but androids don't because they're made by humans thing. But again little energy seemed to be exerted in exploring that apparent paradox beyond a few short & boring bits of dialogue.

i agree theres a bit too many themes and ideas running through, as a result end product seem a bit jumbled. (killing your parents line might be a clue as to what David said to the engineer, thus making him hostile)

overall yes, you should pay bit more attention. not that the movie isn't flawed mind you. lots of things are ambiguous and not everything need to be. this is not 2001 after all. i cant blame the movie for trying though.

[ctrlchris]

My old man is going to see it tonight at imax.
Will report his thoughts if anyone cares.

bruce snr reviews best reviews

Hold tight ro-pong.
Bruce snr review incoming.

will be big tings im expecting.

[Qwert]

[Keorythe]

Ok I saw this movie today and it was pretty good.

  Spoiler:

Some of this might be completely fucking wrong but its my guess of things, I also haven't read through the thread.

- The guy who kills himself at the start of the film, if he is on Earth accidentally creates the human race? Seems to give a reason for the engineers to want them gone. It might have been an accident, it might have been intentional, or it might have been un-sanctioned. The latter would give more weight to them wanting us dead.

- I guess its established that the planet is a bioweapon research/storage place for the engineers? Not really. All of the storage facilities were ships, not static buildings. It may have been a staging point where other bombers would rally before a coordinated flight. Especially when you consider that the Engineers had cryosleep/hibernation pods which means no FTL drives.

- Seemingly the race of aliens create these research planets on barren worlds all over the place, like the one on the planet in Alien but create different weapons on each place? The ship in the movie Alien was exposed and broadcasting a distress signal or "stay away" beacon. This points more to a crash landing. There was also only one. On top of it all, nothing shown suggests that any research was ongoing. Everything we saw pointed to cargo containment only.

- The alien at the end was the first ever evolution of the aliens in the original film? I think I remember someone saying in either Alien or Aliens that the aliens have evolved to be the perfect predators (or maybe it was in a AVP game not sure). The reason this kind of makes sense to me is cause the original squid was some huge impractical thing and then when it impregnated the engineer the result was a better form of alien. Note that the squid was more than likely a mutated spermazoid. That is unless the black goo went and made his testicles put out super sperm that found their way into her ovaries, yanked out an ovam, and then fertilized it. From what we know of xenomorphs, if created in the usual way they take on attributes of the owner. But the creation of this odd xenomorph was highly irregular. In fact the only time we saw a human exposed and changed by the goo was when the pussy geologist showed up at the front of the Prometheus and proceeded to go apeshit on everyone. We don't know if he would have tried to impregnate someone or was still in the process of a total change. There is a good chance that he had in fact died from the acid first/melting helmet first and the mutation was only partial.

- The only thing that doesn't make sense is the alien carving thing on the wall at some point. Not really. Think of it as a skull and crossbones painted on the side of a combat vehicle or some other form of war art. That wouldn't be out of place at all.

@Lancehot - I hope you realize that little cliffhangers like this leave open the possibility of further movies as a new franchise. Something of which Scott has an interest?