hate these ads?, log in or register to hide them
Page 37 of 37 FirstFirst ... 2734353637
Results 721 to 736 of 736

Thread: LOL- Magic man thread (AP Champs)

  1. #721

    Join Date
    April 12, 2011
    Posts
    1,689
    Quote Originally Posted by SAI Peregrinus View Post
    Well, she has a bursty kit with some CC. She's not meant to be tanky or sustained damage like Ryze or Anivia, she's an assassin. So you want items that give AP, Mpen, and improve that burst damage, while helping her survive to escape if needed. CDR can be nice to get her ult ready for another go sooner.

    So Morellos fits, it has stats she likes and helps you kill through heals. Abyssal Scepter, Hourglass, DFG, Deathcap, Twin Shadows, and Void Staff can all work. Liandry's works nicely.

    So based on the items in the game and the skills/type of champ she is, it should work fine.
    DFG is the most efficent nuke item in the AP game. I'm surprised it's not picked much considering the lethal nature of it's active.

  2. #722
    Movember 2012 Zekk Pacus's Avatar
    Join Date
    April 11, 2011
    Posts
    7,163
    Does it actually outdamage a deathcap, considering deathcap gives you the same level of AP plus the passive? That's the reason it's not picked up that often by the way - given it's new cost and stats it's just a massive AP item in a game that already has a massive AP item.
    'I'm pro life. I'm a non-smoker. I'm a pro-life non-smoker. WOO, Let the party begin!'

  3. #723
    Ask me about midgets Donor Mendolorian Girl's Avatar
    Join Date
    April 9, 2011
    Posts
    2,924
    Quote Originally Posted by Zekk Pacus View Post
    Does it actually outdamage a deathcap, considering deathcap gives you the same level of AP plus the passive? That's the reason it's not picked up that often by the way - given it's new cost and stats it's just a massive AP item in a game that already has a massive AP item.
    what? it's a nuke item. It basically adds another ability to your arsenal, with the added bonus of also giving you some AP. Any AP assassin should be getting DFG tbh.
    irony1
    ˈīrənē/

    noun

    Quote Originally Posted by Smuggo View Post
    Just goes to show how lowbrow the tastes of the British public are.

  4. #724
    Donor
    Join Date
    April 11, 2011
    Location
    The Netherlands
    Posts
    1,027
    Quote Originally Posted by Mendolorian Girl View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Zekk Pacus View Post
    Does it actually outdamage a deathcap, considering deathcap gives you the same level of AP plus the passive? That's the reason it's not picked up that often by the way - given it's new cost and stats it's just a massive AP item in a game that already has a massive AP item.
    what? it's a nuke item. It basically adds another ability to your arsenal, with the added bonus of also giving you some AP. Any AP assassin should be getting DFG tbh.
    Only assassins though, reason why not all AP champs pick up DFG is the range of the active, much like why you shouldn't pick up lichbane on lux.

  5. #725
    Movember 2012 Zekk Pacus's Avatar
    Join Date
    April 11, 2011
    Posts
    7,163
    Quote Originally Posted by Mendolorian Girl View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Zekk Pacus View Post
    Does it actually outdamage a deathcap, considering deathcap gives you the same level of AP plus the passive? That's the reason it's not picked up that often by the way - given it's new cost and stats it's just a massive AP item in a game that already has a massive AP item.
    what? it's a nuke item. It basically adds another ability to your arsenal, with the added bonus of also giving you some AP. Any AP assassin should be getting DFG tbh.
    Well, it's 15% of HP which is an okay nuke, but the really strong part of it is the passive that follows. 20% extra on all magic damage is nice, but...does it outdamage a deathcap? This is my question. Ignore the 15% flat damage part of the active for a second...does the 20% increased damage out-damage a deathcap which increases your AP by 30%?

    Bare in mind, as ever, slot efficiency. Most mages will build dcap and zhonyas - that's two needlessly large rod items, both of which are expensive. Would you trade either for DFG? I like DFG, it's really strong on Ahri and DFG/Lich Bane Fizz is an absolute terror. But it's not always the right choice.
    'I'm pro life. I'm a non-smoker. I'm a pro-life non-smoker. WOO, Let the party begin!'

  6. #726
    Vortex's Avatar
    Join Date
    April 11, 2011
    Posts
    1,701
    Quote Originally Posted by Zekk Pacus View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Mendolorian Girl View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Zekk Pacus View Post
    Does it actually outdamage a deathcap, considering deathcap gives you the same level of AP plus the passive? That's the reason it's not picked up that often by the way - given it's new cost and stats it's just a massive AP item in a game that already has a massive AP item.
    what? it's a nuke item. It basically adds another ability to your arsenal, with the added bonus of also giving you some AP. Any AP assassin should be getting DFG tbh.
    Well, it's 15% of HP which is an okay nuke, but the really strong part of it is the passive that follows. 20% extra on all magic damage is nice, but...does it outdamage a deathcap? This is my question. Ignore the 15% flat damage part of the active for a second...does the 20% increased damage out-damage a deathcap which increases your AP by 30%?

    Bare in mind, as ever, slot efficiency. Most mages will build dcap and zhonyas - that's two needlessly large rod items, both of which are expensive. Would you trade either for DFG? I like DFG, it's really strong on Ahri and DFG/Lich Bane Fizz is an absolute terror. But it's not always the right choice.
    Well that question really comes down to base damage, AP scaling ratios, your 4 second burst window, and how much AP deathcap has to work on. Even ignoring details like range of the active effect, its going to get really tricky really quickly to demonstrate which one is going to be better for any one champion. It gets even worse to try to model gold equivalency vs. the other options - for example, would an equivalent cost of mpen items be even stronger? There was that article a while back that modeled mpen vs. deathcap and found that deathcap often added less real damage than some mpen items did.

    So its a really tricky question to answer, and half of it is going to come down to playstyle preferences.

  7. #727
    Movember 2012 Zekk Pacus's Avatar
    Join Date
    April 11, 2011
    Posts
    7,163
    Yeah that's the thing - DFG is really only an effective item for those that can 3-button kill someone with it. So LeBlanc, Veigar, Ahri, Fizz. Situationally Syndra but to be honest her ult will kill squishies from about 60% of HP so there's not really any reason to buy it when you need other stuff. Still relatively good on Mordekaiser if your micro's good. Probably still good on AP Poppy but lol AP Poppy.

    And yes, certain champs have low ratios but high base damage, so on those champions MPen is more effective than stacking AP.
    'I'm pro life. I'm a non-smoker. I'm a pro-life non-smoker. WOO, Let the party begin!'

  8. #728
    Voulture's Avatar
    Join Date
    April 10, 2011
    Posts
    3,131
    Range on dfg is retardly low in comparison to most range nukes ap champs got. So if you take only it's base stats, without valuing the active, or even assuming you will half waste it during a fight or use it completely not optimal way... well, that's not super cost ratio efficient. Also, apart from deathcap and void staff, all good ap caster items benefit into your defense or mobility stats or even some utility ones. DFG gives none of those and does not give you enough firepower to be exchanged with dcap or void.

  9. #729

    Join Date
    April 12, 2011
    Posts
    1,689
    Quote Originally Posted by Voulture View Post
    Range on dfg is retardly low in comparison to most range nukes ap champs got. So if you take only it's base stats, without valuing the active, or even assuming you will half waste it during a fight or use it completely not optimal way... well, that's not super cost ratio efficient. Also, apart from deathcap and void staff, all good ap caster items benefit into your defense or mobility stats or even some utility ones. DFG gives none of those and does not give you enough firepower to be exchanged with dcap or void.
    Eh, the DFG still works nicely as a niche pick for burst champs, who by and large aren't so popular right now. Changing the CDR on the item might help bring it out of nichedom.

  10. #730
    Movember 2012 Zekk Pacus's Avatar
    Join Date
    April 11, 2011
    Posts
    7,163
    EU LCS people have been building it on Ahri. Only problem I have with doing that is it might force you to ult sooner than you really want to for the second/third ticks of damage, but DFG into Abyssal is a lot of damage.
    'I'm pro life. I'm a non-smoker. I'm a pro-life non-smoker. WOO, Let the party begin!'

  11. #731

    Join Date
    April 12, 2011
    Posts
    1,689
    Quote Originally Posted by Zekk Pacus View Post
    EU LCS people have been building it on Ahri. Only problem I have with doing that is it might force you to ult sooner than you really want to for the second/third ticks of damage, but DFG into Abyssal is a lot of damage.
    It's murderous on Fizz.

    It's surprisingly effective on Vlad (double %damage amps), and of course works on the master of 1v1's Malz (not that anyone uses him anyhow).

  12. #732
    Movember 2012 Zekk Pacus's Avatar
    Join Date
    April 11, 2011
    Posts
    7,163
    Yeah, if I am playing Fizz I like Lich Bane into DFG and then tbh you can just go full tank as that's more than enough damage. You also don't waste any of the DFG time because of how Shark works - you can fire out the shark, if you hit, DFG them and burst all your other shit, if not....fuck it go in anyway.
    'I'm pro life. I'm a non-smoker. I'm a pro-life non-smoker. WOO, Let the party begin!'

  13. #733

    Join Date
    April 9, 2012
    Location
    Pit of depravity
    Posts
    6,495
    I tend to build DFG on Gragas (mt favourite mid champ) still. At lower ELO where I currently am, people simply dont seem to realise the sheer amaount of burst he kicks out. I almost always burst enemy AP champs in 1 combo (sometimes even without DGF, but it's nice to be sure)., and the DFG lets me wreck even tankier champs before running away.

    Incidentally, I bloody love Gragas. He has everything I generally want from an AP champ, and he is rare enough that he really does catch a lot of (bad) players off guard.

  14. #734
    XenosisReaper
    Guest
    DFG on Evelyn is hilarious if you can get fed to fuck

    That said, I'm so used to DFG I've managed to trigger Hourglass by accident 3 times when I forgot I didn't have DFG, letting the enemy get away while I sit there like a pillock

    ;_;

  15. #735

    Join Date
    April 12, 2011
    Posts
    1,689
    Quote Originally Posted by XenosisReaper View Post
    DFG on Evelyn is hilarious if you can get fed to fuck

    That said, I'm so used to DFG I've managed to trigger Hourglass by accident 3 times when I forgot I didn't have DFG, letting the enemy get away while I sit there like a pillock

    ;_;

    Never change failheap,

    Never.

  16. #736
    SAI Peregrinus's Avatar
    Join Date
    December 13, 2011
    Posts
    1,691
    Quote Originally Posted by XenosisReaper View Post
    DFG on Evelyn is hilarious if you can get fed to fuck

    That said, I'm so used to DFG I've managed to trigger Hourglass by accident 3 times when I forgot I didn't have DFG, letting the enemy get away while I sit there like a pillock

    ;_;
    I structure my item slots to prevent that:
    Slot 1 is offensive items, 2 is defensive items, 3 is green wards, 4 is pink wards, 5 & 6 are variable.
    So DFG is on 1, Hourglass is on 2. Early game health potions go on 2.

Bookmarks

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •