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Thread: Red alert 2: Command & Conquer the means of production thread

  1. #1
    Movember '11 Best Facial Hair, Best 'Tache Movember 2011Movember 2012Donor helgur's Avatar
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    Red alert 2: Command & Conquer the means of production thread

    Post move edit: Made a new thread as the posts in the coronavirus thread got a little off topic. Think I got all of the posts. Let me know if there's something I missed

    Quote Originally Posted by Zekk Pacus View Post
    We had a guy on state television debate program pretty much echoing the same sentiments (not as directly offcourse, but he argued that our economy is worth more than the human lives we might loose, if we just let it run it's course and not take the precautions we are now). I'm not even shocked. It's pretty apparent where the end game of capitalism lies. This is just history repeating itself, and people being so ingrained to this system that they actually are openly embracing Social Darwinism and thinking it is perfectly A-OK.

    The economic crisis of the 20'ies and 30'ies saw the US government (as most other governments around the world) take the sensible route and bring private ownership into the public fold in order to save the economy (there was this other country which went the complete opposite way, but I digress). With the pressure the economy is under and four more years of Trump (god forbid) this is going to be one hell of a ride.
    Last edited by helgur; March 24 2020 at 12:27:27 AM.

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    Donor Pattern's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by helgur View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Zekk Pacus View Post
    We had a guy on state television debate program pretty much echoing the same sentiments (not as directly offcourse, but he argued that our economy is worth more than the human lives we might loose, if we just let it run it's course and not take the precautions we are now). I'm not even shocked. It's pretty apparent where the end game of capitalism lies. This is just history repeating itself, and people being so ingrained to this system that they actually are openly embracing Social Darwinism and thinking it is perfectly A-OK.

    The economic crisis of the 20'ies and 30'ies saw the US government (as most other governments around the world) take the sensible route and bring private ownership into the public fold in order to save the economy (there was this other country which went the complete opposite way, but I digress). With the pressure the economy is under and four more years of Trump (god forbid) this is going to be one hell of a ride.
    Something something gulags killed more etc etc

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    Jack Coutu's Avatar
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    You would think a decent economist would understand more than the limited variables they are inputting into their calculations. If you let it run rampant, alot more people WILL die, and most of the wealth being wiped out right now is magic stock money. I am like many other people fucked financially, but that's not what a dude like that is speaking of at the moment, and to be so dumb as to think tens or hundreds of millions dying wouldn't have massive economic consequences is fucking nuts.

    In other words, that dude has a hard on for capitalistic bullshit and should get a fucking clue. If all you care about is numbers too that extent, at least have a grasp on them.

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    Liare's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zekk Pacus View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by helgur View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Zekk Pacus View Post
    We had a guy on state television debate program pretty much echoing the same sentiments (not as directly offcourse, but he argued that our economy is worth more than the human lives we might loose, if we just let it run it's course and not take the precautions we are now). I'm not even shocked. It's pretty apparent where the end game of capitalism lies. This is just history repeating itself, and people being so ingrained to this system that they actually are openly embracing Social Darwinism and thinking it is perfectly A-OK.

    The economic crisis of the 20'ies and 30'ies saw the US government (as most other governments around the world) take the sensible route and bring private ownership into the public fold in order to save the economy (there was this other country which went the complete opposite way, but I digress). With the pressure the economy is under and four more years of Trump (god forbid) this is going to be one hell of a ride.
    people like this is why you can unironically make the argument that Lenin and Mao did just one thing wrong, they where far too lenient.
    Viking, n.:
    1. Daring Scandinavian seafarers, explorers, adventurers, entrepreneurs world-famous for their aggressive, nautical import business, highly leveraged takeovers and blue eyes.
    2. Bloodthirsty sea pirates who ravaged northern Europe beginning in the 9th century.

    Hagar's note: The first definition is much preferred; the second is used only by malcontents, the envious, and disgruntled owners of waterfront property.

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    Alistair's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Liare View Post
    people like this is why you can unironically make the argument that Lenin and Mao did just one thing wrong, they where far too lenient.
    Nice to see the bloodthirsty E-revolutionaries of FHC continue to promote mass murder (and mass murderers) as their own favored Final Solution to the Capitalist Problem.


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    Quote Originally Posted by Alistair View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Liare View Post
    people like this is why you can unironically make the argument that Lenin and Mao did just one thing wrong, they where far too lenient.
    Nice to see the bloodthirsty E-revolutionaries of FHC continue to promote mass murder (and mass murderers) as their own favored Final Solution to the Capitalist Problem.
    considering he's literately making an argument in favour of doing just that your argument is rather flat.

    or maybe it's okay because it's poor, old and sick people he wants to see die so that the numbers on his bank account aren't quite as badly affected ?

    the correct response to somebody advocating mass murder is not "look at this guy, pfft!" it's to reach out and punch his face in.
    Viking, n.:
    1. Daring Scandinavian seafarers, explorers, adventurers, entrepreneurs world-famous for their aggressive, nautical import business, highly leveraged takeovers and blue eyes.
    2. Bloodthirsty sea pirates who ravaged northern Europe beginning in the 9th century.

    Hagar's note: The first definition is much preferred; the second is used only by malcontents, the envious, and disgruntled owners of waterfront property.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Alistair View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Liare View Post
    people like this is why you can unironically make the argument that Lenin and Mao did just one thing wrong, they where far too lenient.
    Nice to see the bloodthirsty E-revolutionaries of FHC continue to promote mass murder (and mass murderers) as their own favored Final Solution to the Capitalist Problem.
    It requires less mass murder than the final capitalist solution to the socialist problem. Maybe we simply aren't ambitious enough?
    Look, the wages you withheld from the workmen who mowed your fields are crying out against you. The cries of the harvesters have reached the ears of the Lord of Hosts. You have lived on earth in luxury and self-indulgence. You have fattened yourselves for slaughter.

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    Donor erichkknaar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Keckers View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Alistair View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Liare View Post
    people like this is why you can unironically make the argument that Lenin and Mao did just one thing wrong, they where far too lenient.
    Nice to see the bloodthirsty E-revolutionaries of FHC continue to promote mass murder (and mass murderers) as their own favored Final Solution to the Capitalist Problem.
    It requires less mass murder than the final capitalist solution to the socialist problem. Maybe we simply aren't ambitious enough?
    You just aren’t couching it in enough unprovable pseudomath
    meh

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    Liare's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by erichkknaar View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Keckers View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Alistair View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Liare View Post
    people like this is why you can unironically make the argument that Lenin and Mao did just one thing wrong, they where far too lenient.
    Nice to see the bloodthirsty E-revolutionaries of FHC continue to promote mass murder (and mass murderers) as their own favored Final Solution to the Capitalist Problem.
    It requires less mass murder than the final capitalist solution to the socialist problem. Maybe we simply aren't ambitious enough?
    You just aren’t couching it in enough unprovable pseudomath
    chippity choppity, the math says i get to take your property!
    Viking, n.:
    1. Daring Scandinavian seafarers, explorers, adventurers, entrepreneurs world-famous for their aggressive, nautical import business, highly leveraged takeovers and blue eyes.
    2. Bloodthirsty sea pirates who ravaged northern Europe beginning in the 9th century.

    Hagar's note: The first definition is much preferred; the second is used only by malcontents, the envious, and disgruntled owners of waterfront property.

  10. #10
    Malcanis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alistair View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Liare View Post
    people like this is why you can unironically make the argument that Lenin and Mao did just one thing wrong, they where far too lenient.
    Nice to see the bloodthirsty E-revolutionaries of FHC continue to promote mass murder (and mass murderers) as their own favored Final Solution to the Capitalist Problem.
    Did he advocate a different kind of mass death than your favourite brand?
    Quote Originally Posted by Isyel View Post
    And btw, you're such a fucking asshole it genuinely amazes me on a regular basis how you manage to function.

  11. #11
    Alistair's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Malcanis View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Alistair View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Liare View Post
    people like this is why you can unironically make the argument that Lenin and Mao did just one thing wrong, they where far too lenient.
    Nice to see the bloodthirsty E-revolutionaries of FHC continue to promote mass murder (and mass murderers) as their own favored Final Solution to the Capitalist Problem.
    Did he advocate a different kind of mass death than your favourite brand?
    See, that's the thing: I don't have a "favorite" brand of mass murder. I'm against all forms of it.

    Crazytalk, given this place, I know.


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    The kind where everyone lives happily ever after at the end (except the landlords)
    Look, the wages you withheld from the workmen who mowed your fields are crying out against you. The cries of the harvesters have reached the ears of the Lord of Hosts. You have lived on earth in luxury and self-indulgence. You have fattened yourselves for slaughter.

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    Liare's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alistair View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Malcanis View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Alistair View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Liare View Post
    people like this is why you can unironically make the argument that Lenin and Mao did just one thing wrong, they where far too lenient.
    Nice to see the bloodthirsty E-revolutionaries of FHC continue to promote mass murder (and mass murderers) as their own favored Final Solution to the Capitalist Problem.
    Did he advocate a different kind of mass death than your favourite brand?
    See, that's the thing: I don't have a "favorite" brand of mass murder. I'm against all forms of it.

    Crazytalk, given this place, I know.
    the reasoned approach went off the table the second "poor people dying in droves so i can make more money" was put on it.

    you do not reason with people who place so little value on human life, you simply make sure they can't actually act on their obvious psychopathy with whatever means is available.
    Viking, n.:
    1. Daring Scandinavian seafarers, explorers, adventurers, entrepreneurs world-famous for their aggressive, nautical import business, highly leveraged takeovers and blue eyes.
    2. Bloodthirsty sea pirates who ravaged northern Europe beginning in the 9th century.

    Hagar's note: The first definition is much preferred; the second is used only by malcontents, the envious, and disgruntled owners of waterfront property.

  14. #14
    Liare's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Spartan Dax View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Liare View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Alistair View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Malcanis View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Alistair View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Liare View Post
    people like this is why you can unironically make the argument that Lenin and Mao did just one thing wrong, they where far too lenient.
    Nice to see the bloodthirsty E-revolutionaries of FHC continue to promote mass murder (and mass murderers) as their own favored Final Solution to the Capitalist Problem.
    Did he advocate a different kind of mass death than your favourite brand?
    See, that's the thing: I don't have a "favorite" brand of mass murder. I'm against all forms of it.

    Crazytalk, given this place, I know.
    the reasoned approach went off the table the second "poor people dying in droves so i can make more money" was put on it.

    you do not reason with people who place so little value on human life, you simply make sure they can't actually act on their obvious psychopathy with whatever means is available.
    That's all fine and dandy but the fact remains that economic hardship also leads to deaths, depression, spousal abuse, violent crime etc. Where is the point where the financial damages start killing more people than the virus? This is true for all countries, not just the US obviously.
    this is a actual discussion one might have, it is however not the argument that was presented.

    incidentally, the economic hardship you point to can be cushioned significantly by continued government intervention in the economy. but that requires that the lot in charge aren't total psychotic cunts, bringing us right back to where my post started.
    Viking, n.:
    1. Daring Scandinavian seafarers, explorers, adventurers, entrepreneurs world-famous for their aggressive, nautical import business, highly leveraged takeovers and blue eyes.
    2. Bloodthirsty sea pirates who ravaged northern Europe beginning in the 9th century.

    Hagar's note: The first definition is much preferred; the second is used only by malcontents, the envious, and disgruntled owners of waterfront property.

  15. #15
    Malcanis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alistair View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Malcanis View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Alistair View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Liare View Post
    people like this is why you can unironically make the argument that Lenin and Mao did just one thing wrong, they where far too lenient.
    Nice to see the bloodthirsty E-revolutionaries of FHC continue to promote mass murder (and mass murderers) as their own favored Final Solution to the Capitalist Problem.
    Did he advocate a different kind of mass death than your favourite brand?
    See, that's the thing: I don't have a "favorite" brand of mass murder. I'm against all forms of it.

    Crazytalk, given this place, I know.
    Sorry, I guess I missed your outrage at the notion that it's best for the economy to just make people keep working and accept the losses.
    Quote Originally Posted by Isyel View Post
    And btw, you're such a fucking asshole it genuinely amazes me on a regular basis how you manage to function.

  16. #16
    Alistair's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Liare View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Alistair View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Malcanis View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Alistair View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Liare View Post
    people like this is why you can unironically make the argument that Lenin and Mao did just one thing wrong, they where far too lenient.
    Nice to see the bloodthirsty E-revolutionaries of FHC continue to promote mass murder (and mass murderers) as their own favored Final Solution to the Capitalist Problem.
    Did he advocate a different kind of mass death than your favourite brand?
    See, that's the thing: I don't have a "favorite" brand of mass murder. I'm against all forms of it.

    Crazytalk, given this place, I know.
    the reasoned approach went off the table the second "poor people dying in droves so i can make more money" was put on it.

    you do not reason with people who place so little value on human life, you simply make sure they can't actually act on their obvious psychopathy with whatever means is available.
    IMO you can't reason with them, same as you can't reason with guys like you.

    Both sets of extremists jerking off over their favorite brand of political or economic mass murder need sidelines to the fringes where they belong.

    Let's be honest, we have posters here who want the world economy to collapse, no matter how many die because of it, because they think their long awaited Revolution will happen then, brining in the great Collectivist Utopia they think is right around the corner.
    Last edited by Alistair; March 23 2020 at 10:20:09 PM.


  17. #17
    Liare's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alistair View Post
    IMO you can't reason with them, same as you can't reason with guys like you.

    Both sets of extremists jerking off over their favorite brand of political or economic mass murder need sidelines to the fringes where they belong.
    not wanting to see people sacrificed on the altar of profits is a extremist position. you heard it it here first folks, so please line up for mandatory euthanasia once your body can no longer serve your corporate masters. it's the moderate option after all!

    incidentally, it's your view that is rapidly becoming the fringe one precisely because it's fundamentally hollow. when your underlying position is "we should listen to and reason with people regardless of how abhorrent their views are" what you're actually doing is you are legitimizing the position by proxy. lesser-evilism doesn't work when it comes to moral value arguments like this precisely because your premise is that we should accept evil, in the shape of a obvious moral wrong, in the first place.

    and when it comes "should people die so i can make money" there is a right and wrong moral position with no scope for wiggle-room between them.

    incidentally, there are so many things wrong with the whole line of reasoning in the first place, placing a monetary value on human life, ranking the value of human life on that basis, the explicit monstrous narcissism required to reach such a position in the first place.
    Viking, n.:
    1. Daring Scandinavian seafarers, explorers, adventurers, entrepreneurs world-famous for their aggressive, nautical import business, highly leveraged takeovers and blue eyes.
    2. Bloodthirsty sea pirates who ravaged northern Europe beginning in the 9th century.

    Hagar's note: The first definition is much preferred; the second is used only by malcontents, the envious, and disgruntled owners of waterfront property.

  18. #18
    Movember '11 Best Facial Hair, Best 'Tache Movember 2011Movember 2012Donor helgur's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Liare View Post
    people like this is why you can unironically make the argument that Lenin and Mao did just one thing wrong, they where far too lenient.
    You might want to phone in to your local municipality waterworks and ask them to stop serving cheap Danish beer through the tapwater. I mean yeah, cunts like the one I quoted can fuck off. But saying Mao was too lenient when he mass murdered tens of millions of people is a proper wewlad

  19. #19
    Keckers's Avatar
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    [QUOTE=Alistair;1887204][QUOTE=Liare;1887189]
    Quote Originally Posted by Alistair View Post
    Let's be honest, we have posters here who want the world economy to collapse, no matter how many die because of it, because they think their long awaited Revolution will happen then, brining in the great Collectivist Utopia they think is right around the corner.
    Capitalism collapses all the time. The whole point is moving onto something more stable which doesn't trample over everyone who actually works while it waxes and wanes.

    We've seen in the past few weeks that those who benefit the most from this system have absolutely no problem making decisions which benefit themselves while others die.

    How many ventilators do you think are being commandeered and hoarded right now by the wealthiest members of society?
    Look, the wages you withheld from the workmen who mowed your fields are crying out against you. The cries of the harvesters have reached the ears of the Lord of Hosts. You have lived on earth in luxury and self-indulgence. You have fattened yourselves for slaughter.

  20. #20
    Liare's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by helgur View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Liare View Post
    people like this is why you can unironically make the argument that Lenin and Mao did just one thing wrong, they where far too lenient.
    You might want to phone in to your local municipality waterworks and ask them to stop serving cheap Danish beer through the tapwater. I mean yeah, cunts like the one I quoted can fuck off. But saying Mao was too lenient when he mass murdered tens of millions of people is a proper wewlad
    i wasn't referring to the cultural revolution or the great leap forward, but rather the land reforms.

    they left that bit to the local communities by the way.

    Maoist china is a mindfuck and a half, and a excellent argument against investing significant power in the individual. he was without doubt one of the greatest military minds of the 20th century, but that doesn't mean he didn't run China most of the way into the ground.
    Last edited by Liare; March 23 2020 at 11:00:06 PM.
    Viking, n.:
    1. Daring Scandinavian seafarers, explorers, adventurers, entrepreneurs world-famous for their aggressive, nautical import business, highly leveraged takeovers and blue eyes.
    2. Bloodthirsty sea pirates who ravaged northern Europe beginning in the 9th century.

    Hagar's note: The first definition is much preferred; the second is used only by malcontents, the envious, and disgruntled owners of waterfront property.

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