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Thread: US Politics Thread, 2.0

  1. #5741
    Movember 2011 RazoR's Avatar
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    impressive mental gymnastics, alistair

    you vast real world experience doesn't help you understand basic cause and effect, yet anyone who is not as decrepit are just meddling kids that don't know any better
    Last edited by RazoR; November 10 2019 at 03:27:35 PM.

  2. #5742
    mewninn's Avatar
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    The typical Trump and Brexit voter has decades of "real world experience" on The Kids

    It doesn't seem to be worth much in the end

  3. #5743

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    Quote Originally Posted by mewninn View Post
    The typical Trump and Brexit voter has decades of "real world experience" on The Kids

    It doesn't seem to be worth much in the end

  4. #5744
    Liare's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ruri View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Lachesis VII View Post
    And the actual bad stuff was left out, per Vindman.
    I mean, in this version we have: Ukraine saying they're ready to buy more Javelins and Trump responding immediately with the "I'd like you to do us a favor though," specific references to investigating the Bidens, and the only slightly veiled threats to Ambassador Yovanovitch. Vindman filled in some blanks, but the meat of the extortion is right there on the page, and it reads exactly like a conversation between some city politician and a mob boss.

    Quote Originally Posted by Spartan Dax View Post
    Well of course he did. He already had the screws tightened on him with Trump withholding aid and it's not like Trump is hard to figure out.
    I know that for most of the people doing it it's performative, hold-my-nose-and-get-it-over-with sucking up, what I actually find most grotesque about it is that it works so well.
    welcome to the great game, it's been like this for hundreds of years.

    the only difference is that A : Trump is doing the asking, rather than delegating it to some disposable flunkey and B : he's trying to create dirt on somebody part of the in-group rather than the out-group, had he asked the Ukraine to generate dirt on say, Sanders or Ocasio-Cortez we'd never even have heard about it beyond the established media regurgitating transparent bullshit wholesale.
    Viking, n.:
    1. Daring Scandinavian seafarers, explorers, adventurers, entrepreneurs world-famous for their aggressive, nautical import business, highly leveraged takeovers and blue eyes.
    2. Bloodthirsty sea pirates who ravaged northern Europe beginning in the 9th century.

    Hagar's note: The first definition is much preferred; the second is used only by malcontents, the envious, and disgruntled owners of waterfront property.

  5. #5745
    Keckers's Avatar
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    Small government is just a dog whistle for less progressive politics and more poor black people, more white supremacy and more blaming the poors for systemic poverty.

    It's just conservatives being annoyed less people are suffering.
    Last edited by Keckers; November 10 2019 at 04:53:22 PM.
    Look, the wages you withheld from the workmen who mowed your fields are crying out against you. The cries of the harvesters have reached the ears of the Lord of Hosts. You have lived on earth in luxury and self-indulgence. You have fattened yourselves for slaughter.

  6. #5746
    Liare's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Keckers View Post
    Small government is just a dog whistle for less progressive politics and more poor black people, more white supremacy and more blaming the poors for systemic poverty.

    It's just conservatives being annoyed less people are suffering.
    conservatism, a infantile disorder tbh.
    Viking, n.:
    1. Daring Scandinavian seafarers, explorers, adventurers, entrepreneurs world-famous for their aggressive, nautical import business, highly leveraged takeovers and blue eyes.
    2. Bloodthirsty sea pirates who ravaged northern Europe beginning in the 9th century.

    Hagar's note: The first definition is much preferred; the second is used only by malcontents, the envious, and disgruntled owners of waterfront property.

  7. #5747
    Malcanis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alistair View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by mewninn View Post
    There's like a million Alistair posts with some extremely snide insult about someone's age lol
    Yep, there is. And it was wrong to do so tbqh. People can learn...
    There's a fairly consistent pattern here, where you don't accept that some subclass of crappy behaviour should actually be considered a real problem until you get it done to you.
    Quote Originally Posted by Isyel View Post
    And btw, you're such a fucking asshole it genuinely amazes me on a regular basis how you manage to function.

  8. #5748
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    Quote Originally Posted by Liare View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Ruri View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Lachesis VII View Post
    And the actual bad stuff was left out, per Vindman.
    I mean, in this version we have: Ukraine saying they're ready to buy more Javelins and Trump responding immediately with the "I'd like you to do us a favor though," specific references to investigating the Bidens, and the only slightly veiled threats to Ambassador Yovanovitch. Vindman filled in some blanks, but the meat of the extortion is right there on the page, and it reads exactly like a conversation between some city politician and a mob boss.

    Quote Originally Posted by Spartan Dax View Post
    Well of course he did. He already had the screws tightened on him with Trump withholding aid and it's not like Trump is hard to figure out.
    I know that for most of the people doing it it's performative, hold-my-nose-and-get-it-over-with sucking up, what I actually find most grotesque about it is that it works so well.
    welcome to the great game, it's been like this for hundreds of years.

    the only difference is that A : Trump is doing the asking, rather than delegating it to some disposable flunkey and B : he's trying to create dirt on somebody part of the in-group rather than the out-group, had he asked the Ukraine to generate dirt on say, Sanders or Ocasio-Cortez we'd never even have heard about it beyond the established media regurgitating transparent bullshit wholesale.
    So when did former American presidents demand help in their domestic political campaigns in exchange for military aide that they had no legal authority to hold up? The closest thing in recent memory I'm aware of is Iran-Contra, where there was just barely enough of a sliver of a degree of separation between Reagan and the apparatus that sold weapons in exchange for a favorable headline to use against Carter that his smile carried him through the whole crisis on the backs of his followers.
    This is worse than I thought, there's no butter in my coffee!

    Quote Originally Posted by QuackBot
    Do you even lift? Do you even post.

  9. #5749
    mewninn's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ruri View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Liare View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Ruri View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Lachesis VII View Post
    And the actual bad stuff was left out, per Vindman.
    I mean, in this version we have: Ukraine saying they're ready to buy more Javelins and Trump responding immediately with the "I'd like you to do us a favor though," specific references to investigating the Bidens, and the only slightly veiled threats to Ambassador Yovanovitch. Vindman filled in some blanks, but the meat of the extortion is right there on the page, and it reads exactly like a conversation between some city politician and a mob boss.

    Quote Originally Posted by Spartan Dax View Post
    Well of course he did. He already had the screws tightened on him with Trump withholding aid and it's not like Trump is hard to figure out.
    I know that for most of the people doing it it's performative, hold-my-nose-and-get-it-over-with sucking up, what I actually find most grotesque about it is that it works so well.
    welcome to the great game, it's been like this for hundreds of years.

    the only difference is that A : Trump is doing the asking, rather than delegating it to some disposable flunkey and B : he's trying to create dirt on somebody part of the in-group rather than the out-group, had he asked the Ukraine to generate dirt on say, Sanders or Ocasio-Cortez we'd never even have heard about it beyond the established media regurgitating transparent bullshit wholesale.
    So when did former American presidents demand help in their domestic political campaigns in exchange for military aide that they had no legal authority to hold up? The closest thing in recent memory I'm aware of is Iran-Contra, where there was just barely enough of a sliver of a degree of separation between Reagan and the apparatus that sold weapons in exchange for a favorable headline to use against Carter that his smile carried him through the whole crisis on the backs of his followers.
    Nixon did the same by telling the south to walk out of peace negotiations until he was in office. This was far worse than anything Trump has done so far

    Also the question you're asking is way too narrow. Better one is "When did a president subvert America's security or position to advance their narrow self-interest?" And the answer you'd come back with is: many. Probably far more than we know, but starting with just Nixon, Reagan and the Bushes as the most recent examples

  10. #5750
    Liare's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ruri View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Liare View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Ruri View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Lachesis VII View Post
    And the actual bad stuff was left out, per Vindman.
    I mean, in this version we have: Ukraine saying they're ready to buy more Javelins and Trump responding immediately with the "I'd like you to do us a favor though," specific references to investigating the Bidens, and the only slightly veiled threats to Ambassador Yovanovitch. Vindman filled in some blanks, but the meat of the extortion is right there on the page, and it reads exactly like a conversation between some city politician and a mob boss.

    Quote Originally Posted by Spartan Dax View Post
    Well of course he did. He already had the screws tightened on him with Trump withholding aid and it's not like Trump is hard to figure out.
    I know that for most of the people doing it it's performative, hold-my-nose-and-get-it-over-with sucking up, what I actually find most grotesque about it is that it works so well.
    welcome to the great game, it's been like this for hundreds of years.

    the only difference is that A : Trump is doing the asking, rather than delegating it to some disposable flunkey and B : he's trying to create dirt on somebody part of the in-group rather than the out-group, had he asked the Ukraine to generate dirt on say, Sanders or Ocasio-Cortez we'd never even have heard about it beyond the established media regurgitating transparent bullshit wholesale.
    So when did former American presidents demand help in their domestic political campaigns in exchange for military aide that they had no legal authority to hold up? The closest thing in recent memory I'm aware of is Iran-Contra, where there was just barely enough of a sliver of a degree of separation between Reagan and the apparatus that sold weapons in exchange for a favorable headline to use against Carter that his smile carried him through the whole crisis on the backs of his followers.
    well, you've got flat out fabrication of intelligence for the Iraq war that in turn carried Bush Jr. trough two presidencies, the Nayirah testimony used by his dad, the Panama Invasion, that is ironically smeared with shit from Iran-Contra to such a extend that it's functionally a part of that specific farce.

    side note, anybody claiming the Iraq wars had no domestic implications are full of shit.

    then of course there is Nixon intentionally tanking negotiations with North Vietnam to strengthen his electoral campaign, i would argue that EVERY president has engaged in this sort of fuckery to a extend.
    Viking, n.:
    1. Daring Scandinavian seafarers, explorers, adventurers, entrepreneurs world-famous for their aggressive, nautical import business, highly leveraged takeovers and blue eyes.
    2. Bloodthirsty sea pirates who ravaged northern Europe beginning in the 9th century.

    Hagar's note: The first definition is much preferred; the second is used only by malcontents, the envious, and disgruntled owners of waterfront property.

  11. #5751
    Donor Spaztick's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Isyel View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by mewninn View Post
    The typical Trump and Brexit voter has decades of "real world experience" on The Kids

    It doesn't seem to be worth much in the end

  12. #5752
    mewninn's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Liare View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Ruri View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Liare View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Ruri View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Lachesis VII View Post
    And the actual bad stuff was left out, per Vindman.
    I mean, in this version we have: Ukraine saying they're ready to buy more Javelins and Trump responding immediately with the "I'd like you to do us a favor though," specific references to investigating the Bidens, and the only slightly veiled threats to Ambassador Yovanovitch. Vindman filled in some blanks, but the meat of the extortion is right there on the page, and it reads exactly like a conversation between some city politician and a mob boss.

    Quote Originally Posted by Spartan Dax View Post
    Well of course he did. He already had the screws tightened on him with Trump withholding aid and it's not like Trump is hard to figure out.
    I know that for most of the people doing it it's performative, hold-my-nose-and-get-it-over-with sucking up, what I actually find most grotesque about it is that it works so well.
    welcome to the great game, it's been like this for hundreds of years.

    the only difference is that A : Trump is doing the asking, rather than delegating it to some disposable flunkey and B : he's trying to create dirt on somebody part of the in-group rather than the out-group, had he asked the Ukraine to generate dirt on say, Sanders or Ocasio-Cortez we'd never even have heard about it beyond the established media regurgitating transparent bullshit wholesale.
    So when did former American presidents demand help in their domestic political campaigns in exchange for military aide that they had no legal authority to hold up? The closest thing in recent memory I'm aware of is Iran-Contra, where there was just barely enough of a sliver of a degree of separation between Reagan and the apparatus that sold weapons in exchange for a favorable headline to use against Carter that his smile carried him through the whole crisis on the backs of his followers.
    well, you've got flat out fabrication of intelligence for the Iraq war that in turn carried Bush Jr. trough two presidencies, the Nayirah testimony used by his dad, the Panama Invasion, that is ironically smeared with shit from Iran-Contra to such a extend that it's functionally a part of that specific farce.

    side note, anybody claiming the Iraq wars had no domestic implications are full of shit.

    then of course there is Nixon intentionally tanking negotiations with North Vietnam to strengthen his electoral campaign, i would argue that EVERY president has engaged in this sort of fuckery to a extend.
    I'd also add the shady technology transfers to China that happened under the Clinton admin

  13. #5753
    Alistair's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Malcanis View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Alistair View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by mewninn View Post
    There's like a million Alistair posts with some extremely snide insult about someone's age lol
    Yep, there is. And it was wrong to do so tbqh. People can learn...
    There's a fairly consistent pattern here, where you don't accept that some subclass of crappy behaviour should actually be considered a real problem until you get it done to you.
    Also fairly consistent, that you and others here think engaging in those behaviors to anyone right of them is justifiable and should be encouraged. Civility is not a thing when it comes to folks you disagree with politically. You have all made that very clear.

    We just had a poster call (not ironically IMO, given how often he does it) for literal mass hangings of anyone who supports smaller government. And another, one of our resident unironic Communists, who openly supports discrimination, racism and sexism and ageism because older white males apparently all deserve it, because apparently we're all to blame for every single social ill today and ever.

    Stereotyping "those people" you so clearly hate is ok when it's you folks who do it.

    And this place loves it all. It never calls them out. But I dismiss a few of you kids once in a while when you're talking out your asses, and I'm the worst thing on FHC. Well, to be fair, the worst thing left outside the diminishing circle jerk of far-leftists on this now mostly dead forum.

    Honestly, I wish you all get exactly the kind of government you all pretty much seem to want. Good luck, and god speed!

    P.S. Save the insults, I've been coming here materially less and less, for good reason, and I think I've had my fill finally.

    Good luck with the Revolution!


  14. #5754
    mewninn's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alistair View Post
    P.S. Save the insults, I've been coming here materially less and less, for good reason, and I think I've had my fill finally.
    Has the Alistair Parliament finally agreed to leave FHC?

  15. #5755
    Lowa [NSN]'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by erichkknaar View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Alistair View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by erichkknaar View Post
    Anyone that wants "smaller government" and all that other conservative nonsense, is basically saying " I hate where I live, I hate my form of government, and the way of life my country enjoys, and I want to destroy the country, our way of life, and I want to harm all the people living in the country with me..."
    Pretty sure that's not what they're saying, but ok.

    And we need to start treating them like the domestic enemies they are...
    So what should that treatment be then?
    I'm pretty sure that's exactly what they are saying. I can tell from watching 20 years of their treasonous, Anti-American actions and words.

    How we should treat them? Well. I've always advocated for direct, teachable moments, but I suppose a mass hanging on the national mall is probably better than most of these cunts deserve.
    Again, go ahead then. Teach them a lesson. Stop typing, walk out that door and start stringing them up.

    And again, you wont. You wont do jack fuckin shit so just stop typing like you would.
    Quote Originally Posted by Tarminic View Post
    I would create a dragon made out of vaginas. Then I would create a dragon made out of dicks. Then I would have them fight to the death.

  16. #5756
    Ruri's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Liare View Post
    side note, anybody claiming the Iraq wars had no domestic implications are full of shit.
    Well of course they did, and I think I made my opinion on W's war(s) p. clear a few pages back. But W didn't need the 2nd Iraq War to boost his political fortunes, he was already riding high off of 9/11. He decided to cash in those high poll numbers to fulfill his own and basically the entire Neocon Establishment's decade-old wet dream of deposing Hussein, which is exactly the opposite of what Trump did with Zelenskyy - dangling the prospect that he would be overrun by Russian tanks unless he helped improve Trumps domestic political situation.

    So if we broaden it out then yes, every president makes decisions on foreign policy while considering how those decisions will impact their own politics, and sometimes that comes right up to the line of being a shakedown (something Republican presidents seem uniquely prone too for some reason that I'm sure is just a total coincidence). But Trump's blatant, naked quid pro quo for something that was only of personal benefit to himself, in the face of aggression from a hostile foreign power that he seems disturbingly aligned with, and his sidelining of the levers of actual diplomacy in favor of his personal fixers Giuliani and Barr, is why this stands out as an abuse of power and not just "politics as normal."
    This is worse than I thought, there's no butter in my coffee!

    Quote Originally Posted by QuackBot
    Do you even lift? Do you even post.

  17. #5757
    Lachesis VII's Avatar
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    So uh, can we maybe talk about something marginally more pleasant?


  18. #5758
    Malcanis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alistair View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Malcanis View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Alistair View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by mewninn View Post
    There's like a million Alistair posts with some extremely snide insult about someone's age lol
    Yep, there is. And it was wrong to do so tbqh. People can learn...
    There's a fairly consistent pattern here, where you don't accept that some subclass of crappy behaviour should actually be considered a real problem until you get it done to you.
    Also fairly consistent, that you and others here think engaging in those behaviors to anyone right of them is justifiable and should be encouraged. Civility is not a thing when it comes to folks you disagree with politically. You have all made that very clear.

    We just had a poster call (not ironically IMO, given how often he does it) for literal mass hangings of anyone who supports smaller government. And another, one of our resident unironic Communists, who openly supports discrimination, racism and sexism and ageism because older white males apparently all deserve it, because apparently we're all to blame for every single social ill today and ever.

    Stereotyping "those people" you so clearly hate is ok when it's you folks who do it.

    And this place loves it all. It never calls them out. But I dismiss a few of you kids once in a while when you're talking out your asses, and I'm the worst thing on FHC. Well, to be fair, the worst thing left outside the diminishing circle jerk of far-leftists on this now mostly dead forum.

    Honestly, I wish you all get exactly the kind of government you all pretty much seem to want. Good luck, and god speed!

    P.S. Save the insults, I've been coming here materially less and less, for good reason, and I think I've had my fill finally.

    Good luck with the Revolution!
    Isn't this about the 6th time you've flounced off because you've been forced to reconsider some prejudice?

    See you in a few weeks mate. Have a good Thanksgiving.
    Quote Originally Posted by Isyel View Post
    And btw, you're such a fucking asshole it genuinely amazes me on a regular basis how you manage to function.

  19. #5759

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    Quote Originally Posted by Lachesis VII View Post
    So uh, can we maybe talk about something marginally more pleasant?

    How does one Butte dial a phone pw?
    Makes No sense to me.
    Phone is open, No need for pw. How do you txt or app and send by accident. Pr stunt again


    Verstuurd vanaf mijn LENNY2 met Tapatalk
    Schopenhauer:

    All truth passes through three stages.
    First, it is ridiculed.
    Second, it is violently opposed.
    Third, it is accepted as being self-evident..

  20. #5760

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    How does one Butte dial a phone pw?
    Makes No sense to me.
    Phone is open, No need for pw. How do you txt or app and send by accident. Pr stunt again


    Verstuurd vanaf mijn LENNY2 met Tapatalk
    Schopenhauer:

    All truth passes through three stages.
    First, it is ridiculed.
    Second, it is violently opposed.
    Third, it is accepted as being self-evident..

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