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Thread: (UK EURO THREAD) UK POLITICS MK2

  1. #19341

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    At the moment, it's 8.91.

  2. #19342
    Movember '12 Best Facial Hair Movember 2012Donor Lallante's Avatar
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    Which makes 15 such a random, arbitrary, absurd number. Why not 20? 40? infinity

    A better pledge would be "a substantial increase in minimum wage above inflation" or "pegging minimum wage to an index based on the real minimum cost of living so anyone working 35 hours a week can afford to live comfortably".

    You know, something with an actual principle not just arbitrary gesture purity tests

  3. #19343

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    I'd guess it's 15 because in the USA it's $15 & whether right or left we play second fiddle to the Americans.

  4. #19344
    Movember '12 Best Facial Hair Movember 2012Donor Lallante's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lancehot View Post
    I'd guess it's 15 because in the USA it's $15 & whether right or left we play second fiddle to the Americans.
    that was my thought too

  5. #19345
    Keckers's Avatar
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    Presumably some focus group liked 15 so in their infinite political imagination they went with that.
    Look, the wages you withheld from the workmen who mowed your fields are crying out against you. The cries of the harvesters have reached the ears of the Lord of Hosts. You have lived on earth in luxury and self-indulgence. You have fattened yourselves for slaughter.

  6. #19346
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    I'm unfortunately on the fence in relation to an absolute minimum wage figure at all. Personally I would much prefer to see a redistribution of wealth based on productivity and usefulness to scociety (yeah and unlimited free unicorns for everyone). The simple issue is that when you define a minimum wage, current capitalist priciples mean that the cost of required items (like food and housing) will increase in order to maintain profit margin to cover said minimum worker wage increase, and the cost of unrequired items (like jewlery, tech and those wastrel cunts who work in advertising and PR) will increase, just becasue they can, which negates the entire point of bringing the less well off a minimum wage.

    In the uk we may also need to look at changing the law so that business is beholden to the interest of customers, not share holders, but thats another shitshow.
    Shitting up eve for .... well, longer than most of you scumbags.

  7. #19347
    Super Chillerator Global Moderator teds :D's Avatar
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    15 per hour is what, 28k ish before tax? while it's nice for the man that he gets to write his letter and stick it on twitter, that's a massive massive jump in pay, and ignoring the private sector a huuuuuge increase in public sector spending

  8. #19348

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    Quote Originally Posted by mewninn View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Siv View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Rodj Blake View Post
    Andy McDonald has resigned from the Labour front bench, citing Starmer's broken promises.

    I can see why starmer would do this - The press are right wing owned and would be declaring that labour will result in job losses and businesses close. The letter reads like he is looking for an excuse to resign, I'm not saying the right didn't do the same but its not productive either way
    "Our opponents might say bad things about it" is the weakest reason not to pursue something

    Min wage hikes have become popular anywhere, even in the US. And there's an actual limit to how much the media can manufacture consent by hosting weepy business owners for interviews. Its become a theme now that whenever a state leg passes a min wage increase, the public tunes out the crying of the media and everything turns out fine. They've heard the same arguments for 30 years, so its become a bit like white noise at this point. This problem only exists in the mind of neurotically risk-averse centrists
    Not your opponents, the media. Stubbornly refusing to accept this and playing into their hands is how you end up like the previous election in which Labour was seen as out of control with spending despite the manifesto being fully costed and the Tories manifesto having no costings. Throwing lazy insults won't change this.

    While I liked Labours previous manifesto and don't actually consider it that radical, we need to accept the overton window has shifted, much like Cameron did to win his election with his big society and the shift of policy towards the centre to win the vote.

    Also the left really need to all get behind PR, it is mental that the majority of votes go towards left/centre parties and a right wing government is returned with FPTP.

  9. #19349

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    Quote Originally Posted by El Capitano View Post
    At the moment, it's 8.91.
    And Tory policy would mean it's likely to be about 10.50 in 2024.

    So Labour's policy is actually stingier than the Tories'.
    Last edited by Rodj Blake; September 30 2021 at 09:02:58 AM.

  10. #19350

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    Quote Originally Posted by teds :D View Post
    15 per hour is what, 28k ish before tax? while it's nice for the man that he gets to write his letter and stick it on twitter, that's a massive massive jump in pay, and ignoring the private sector a huuuuuge increase in public sector spending
    A huge increase that would at least in part be offset by reduced UC payments and increased tax revenues.

  11. #19351
    NoirAvlaa's Avatar
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    It probably brings it more in line to what the boomers were being paid 50 years ago. Also "but everything will get more expensive so there's no point" arguements are terrible.
    Quote Originally Posted by Djan Seriy Anaplian View Post
    Also that didn't sound like abloo bloo to me, PM me and we can agree on a meeting spot and settle this with queensberry rules, that's a serious offer btw. I've been a member of this community since 2005 and i've never met a more toxic individual.

  12. #19352
    Keckers's Avatar
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    Our economy is structured very differently now though. Most people work in non-productive jobs sending emails and updating spreadsheets which society won't miss if they stopped doing it. If all the country's marketing execs went on strike the only difference you'd see is less spam email. It's not like we're relying on national steel production to make anything.
    Look, the wages you withheld from the workmen who mowed your fields are crying out against you. The cries of the harvesters have reached the ears of the Lord of Hosts. You have lived on earth in luxury and self-indulgence. You have fattened yourselves for slaughter.

  13. #19353

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    Quote Originally Posted by Keckers View Post
    Our economy is structured very differently now though. Most people work in non-productive jobs sending emails and updating spreadsheets which society won't miss if they stopped doing it. If all the country's marketing execs went on strike the only difference you'd see is less spam email. It's not like we're relying on national steel production to make anything.
    Indeed. And as it turns out, the jobs we do actually rely on (supermarket staff, care home workers, cleaners, etc) are the ones that would most benefit from an increase in the minimum wage.

  14. #19354

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    Quote Originally Posted by Lallante View Post
    Which makes 15 such a random, arbitrary, absurd number. Why not 20? 40? infinity

    A better pledge would be "a substantial increase in minimum wage above inflation" or "pegging minimum wage to an index based on the real minimum cost of living so anyone working 35 hours a week can afford to live comfortably".

    You know, something with an actual principle not just arbitrary gesture purity tests
    Because the media doesn't have the attention span for "pegging minimum wage to an index based on the real minimum cost of living so anyone working 35 hours a week can afford to live comfortably"

  15. #19355
    Duckslayer's Avatar
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    HOW DARE THEY PLEDGE TO PAY POOR PEOPLE THAT MUCH!

    weird cunts you lot

  16. #19356
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    Quote Originally Posted by Duckslayer View Post
    HOW DARE THEY PLEDGE TO PAY POOR PEOPLE THAT MUCH!

    weird cunts you lot
    Nobody said anything like that

    Based on this and the conference I'm pretty sure Labour spend almost no time thinking about policy. That's deeply worrying.


    Poland treats me like shit and I hate them as a result of it

  17. #19357

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  18. #19358
    Movember 2011Movember 2012 Nordstern's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rodj Blake View Post
    Couldn't have happened to a more deserving person.
    "Holy shit, I ask you to stop being autistic and you debate what autistic is." - spasm
    Quote Originally Posted by Larkonis Trassler View Post
    WTF I hate white people now...
    Johns Hopkins CSSE COVID-19 Dashboard

  19. #19359
    Lowa [NSN]'s Avatar
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    So, how goes the resource wars?
    Quote Originally Posted by Tarminic View Post
    I would create a dragon made out of vaginas. Then I would create a dragon made out of dicks. Then I would have them fight to the death.

  20. #19360

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    No fuel shortage around here. The cynic in me imagines the whole thing was cooked up by the Tories & their petrol buddies as a way to get the competition act suspended.

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