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Thread: (UK EURO THREAD) UK POLITICS MK2

  1. #3341

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    Quote Originally Posted by Rodj Blake View Post
    I can see why someone might think that.
    :thinking:

  2. #3342
    Keckers's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by elmicker View Post
    I'm not talking about Shai Masot - though the fact the top results for those stories come from 'electronicinfitada.com' should be telling you how much weight to place on those stories. I'm talking about a constant, overwhelming subtext and often outright blatant antisemitism that is pervasive on the old core of the hard left. For fuck's sake just a week or so ago we had a vote of no confidence called in an MP for being "a disruptive Zionist". Labour still has a backlog of antisemitism disciplinary cases hundreds deep because it refuses to look at them. The immediate reaction of anyone from the church of Corbyn to any criticism is something along the lines of "well, she's just a jew so it must be israeli zionist agitprop". It's blatant and the party leadership has done _nothing_ to deal with it.
    It's a problem that has bubbled under the surface for so long because the Labour Party (ironically) has an old boys network problem filled with crusty old lefties with a culture problem. Replacing the 'old' hard left with the 'young' hard left should've been pushed for years ago. The youngsters are typically way less racist.
    Quote Originally Posted by Paul Mason
    It is absurd that we are capable of witnessing a 40,000 year old system of gender oppression begin to dissolve before our eyes yet still see the abolition of a 200 year old economic system as an unrealistic utopia.

  3. #3343
    Movember 2012 Stoffl's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Keckers View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Duckslayer View Post

    Bullshit. There is a rather large minority of muslims that to a man fucking hate israel (for legit reasons and stupid retardo "i believe in my specific sky fairy" nonsense).
    I hate right wing apartheid ethno-states as much as the next man but Israel existing doesn't mean the global Jewish community is a bunch of fifth columnists undermining western governments to install a new world order.
    Duckslayers still right though

    MI8m8

  4. #3344

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    Quote Originally Posted by Duckslayer View Post
    Nothing includes Labour adopting the International Holocaust Remembrance Alliance's definition, and accompanying examples, of anti-Semitism. They were crying cos they didnt include all the examples, now they do.
    You're skimming over how this took months of fighting to implement over the loud lecturing of the hard left how they were better placed to define antisemitism than, say, actual jewish people
    Who the fuck are "they"?
    And yes, I do mean "nothing". Adopting a definition is doing nothing if you then do everything in your power to avoid enforcing it.


    Be a decent state, get decent feedback
    This is your thrice daily reminder that we're not talking about the fascist apartheid ethnostate of Israel. We're talking about the champagne socialist wank fantasy that is Corbyn's labour.

  5. #3345

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    Quote Originally Posted by elmicker View Post
    I'm not talking about Shai Masot - though the fact the top results for those stories come from 'electronicinfitada.com' should be telling you how much weight to place on those stories. I'm talking about a constant, overwhelming subtext and often outright blatant antisemitism that is pervasive on the old core of the hard left. For fuck's sake just a week or so ago we had a vote of no confidence called in an MP for being "a disruptive Zionist". Labour still has a backlog of antisemitism disciplinary cases hundreds deep because it refuses to look at them. The immediate reaction of anyone from the church of Corbyn to any criticism is something along the lines of "well, she's just a jew so it must be israeli zionist agitprop". It's blatant and the party leadership has done _nothing_ to deal with it.
    Yeah, absolutely _nothing_...

    Except...

    https://labourlist.org/2019/02/elimi...jennie-formby/


    Incidentally, it turns out that most of the Labour members being complained about aren't actually members.

  6. #3346

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    Quote Originally Posted by Keckers View Post
    ...The youngsters are typically way less racist.
    Quite, except now they've been brought up in that world and have become addicted to the fact that sticking #FreePalestine on a tweet gets you those sweet Owen Jones reps so you get nonsense like the Young Labour ranting about how people with opposing political views are "traitors" and declaring a palestinian victory because an MP has left the party

    it's fucking nuts
    Last edited by elmicker; February 20 2019 at 11:15:38 AM.

  7. #3347

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    Quote Originally Posted by Rodj Blake View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by elmicker View Post
    I'm not talking about Shai Masot - though the fact the top results for those stories come from 'electronicinfitada.com' should be telling you how much weight to place on those stories. I'm talking about a constant, overwhelming subtext and often outright blatant antisemitism that is pervasive on the old core of the hard left. For fuck's sake just a week or so ago we had a vote of no confidence called in an MP for being "a disruptive Zionist". Labour still has a backlog of antisemitism disciplinary cases hundreds deep because it refuses to look at them. The immediate reaction of anyone from the church of Corbyn to any criticism is something along the lines of "well, she's just a jew so it must be israeli zionist agitprop". It's blatant and the party leadership has done _nothing_ to deal with it.
    Yeah, absolutely _nothing_...

    Except...

    https://labourlist.org/2019/02/elimi...jennie-formby/


    Incidentally, it turns out that most of the Labour members being complained about aren't actually members.
    Words not deeds: The modern labour party in a nutshell.

  8. #3348
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    Quote Originally Posted by elmicker View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Keckers View Post
    ...The youngsters are typically way less racist.
    Quite, except now they've been brought up in that world and have become addicted to the fact that sticking #FreePalestine on a tweet gets you those sweet Owen Jones reps so you get nonsense like the Young Labour ranting about how people with opposing political views are "traitors" and declaring a palestinian victory because a Jewish MP has left the party

    it's fucking nuts
    So you dont want to free palestine?

  9. #3349
    Duckslayer's Avatar
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    I sure am glad the anti racist party that is forming right now didnt immediately refer to non whites as people with a funny tinge, btw. CLASSIC JEWS AMIRITE

  10. #3350

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    Quote Originally Posted by Duckslayer View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by elmicker View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Keckers View Post
    ...The youngsters are typically way less racist.
    Quite, except now they've been brought up in that world and have become addicted to the fact that sticking #FreePalestine on a tweet gets you those sweet Owen Jones reps so you get nonsense like the Young Labour ranting about how people with opposing political views are "traitors" and declaring a palestinian victory because a Jewish MP has left the party

    it's fucking nuts
    So you dont want to free palestine?
    Short of a united Ireland I can't think of a single geopolitical outcome I'd want more. However I don't think one will free the palestinian people by hounding your local MP with antisemitic rhetoric on twitter.

  11. #3351
    Duckslayer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by elmicker View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Duckslayer View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by elmicker View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Keckers View Post
    ...The youngsters are typically way less racist.
    Quite, except now they've been brought up in that world and have become addicted to the fact that sticking #FreePalestine on a tweet gets you those sweet Owen Jones reps so you get nonsense like the Young Labour ranting about how people with opposing political views are "traitors" and declaring a palestinian victory because a Jewish MP has left the party

    it's fucking nuts
    So you dont want to free palestine?
    Short of a united Ireland I can't think of a single geopolitical outcome I'd want more. However I don't think one will free the palestinian people by hounding your local MP with antisemitic rhetoric on twitter.
    noone thinks that strawman.

  12. #3352

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    Quote Originally Posted by Duckslayer View Post
    noone thinks that strawman.
    This is a thing that actually happened.

  13. #3353
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    Quote Originally Posted by elmicker View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Duckslayer View Post
    noone thinks that strawman.
    This is a thing that actually happened.
    somebody stated they were sending anti semitic abuse to their mp with the express goal of that somehow freeing palestine?


    Idontbelieveyou.jpg

  14. #3354

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    I think you're confused Duck. That or you can't read.

  15. #3355

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    Quote Originally Posted by elmicker View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Rodj Blake View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by elmicker View Post
    I'm not talking about Shai Masot - though the fact the top results for those stories come from 'electronicinfitada.com' should be telling you how much weight to place on those stories. I'm talking about a constant, overwhelming subtext and often outright blatant antisemitism that is pervasive on the old core of the hard left. For fuck's sake just a week or so ago we had a vote of no confidence called in an MP for being "a disruptive Zionist". Labour still has a backlog of antisemitism disciplinary cases hundreds deep because it refuses to look at them. The immediate reaction of anyone from the church of Corbyn to any criticism is something along the lines of "well, she's just a jew so it must be israeli zionist agitprop". It's blatant and the party leadership has done _nothing_ to deal with it.
    Yeah, absolutely _nothing_...

    Except...

    https://labourlist.org/2019/02/elimi...jennie-formby/


    Incidentally, it turns out that most of the Labour members being complained about aren't actually members.
    Words not deeds: The modern labour party in a nutshell.
    What deeds would satisfy you?

    I doubt if any any deed short of disbanding the party would satisfy you.

  16. #3356
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    Quote Originally Posted by Duckslayer View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by elmicker View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Keckers View Post
    ...The youngsters are typically way less racist.
    Quite, except now they've been brought up in that world and have become addicted to the fact that sticking #FreePalestine on a tweet gets you those sweet Owen Jones reps so you get nonsense like the Young Labour ranting about how people with opposing political views are "traitors" and declaring a palestinian victory because a Jewish MP has left the party

    it's fucking nuts
    So you dont want to free palestine?
    I don't want the left constantly hamstringing itself while the tories ruin the country. If you give a shit about Palestine you get into power and start directing foreign policy to influence the international community.
    Quote Originally Posted by Paul Mason
    It is absurd that we are capable of witnessing a 40,000 year old system of gender oppression begin to dissolve before our eyes yet still see the abolition of a 200 year old economic system as an unrealistic utopia.

  17. #3357
    Duckslayer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by elmicker View Post
    I think you're confused Duck. That or you can't read.
    No, you're the compressor! I can paint whenever i want to

  18. #3358
    Duckslayer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Keckers View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Duckslayer View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by elmicker View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Keckers View Post
    ...The youngsters are typically way less racist.
    Quite, except now they've been brought up in that world and have become addicted to the fact that sticking #FreePalestine on a tweet gets you those sweet Owen Jones reps so you get nonsense like the Young Labour ranting about how people with opposing political views are "traitors" and declaring a palestinian victory because a Jewish MP has left the party

    it's fucking nuts
    So you dont want to free palestine?
    I don't want the left constantly hamstringing itself while the tories ruin the country. If you give a shit about Palestine you get into power and start directing foreign policy to influence the international community.
    So, abandon all principals to gain power, then switch them back on when you're there? Like New Labnour did?

  19. #3359

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    Quote Originally Posted by Rodj Blake View Post
    What deeds would satisfy you?
    Step 1: Get in a time machine and go back to mid-2016
    Step 2: Change the byline of that article to Jeremy Corbyn
    Step 3: Publish it then.

    The ship has sailed, Rodj, and you know that because you're not stupid. Forcefully resisting any attempts at dialogue or change for years on end makes it very, very hard to do anything to fix the problems that come about.

    A good start would be to start burning down the ridiculous backlog of disciplinary cases with full transparency on the outcomes, with a particular emphasis on the backlog facing the NCC. The reality is it will take years to repair the reputational damage already done. Fundamentally people have to start accepting that:
    1) It's really not OK to assume someone is a zionist just because they're Jewish, or once stood near some Jewish people
    2) Criticising Corbyn does not make one a class traitor
    3) The default position of drawing the wagons around the Dear Leader and letting the attack dogs off the leash is not a sensible one for a party that wants to be taken seriously as a party of government.

    Fixing cultural problems takes time, sustained effort and most importantly it takes will. Corbyn doesn't have time, he is incapable of sustained effort and he almost certainly lacks the will because he really doesn't give a shit.

  20. #3360

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    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rP8ee0_bIuw

    abso fucking top Galloway scenes earlier, if you fancy an early afternoon giggle

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