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Thread: (UK EURO THREAD) UK POLITICS MK2

  1. #10321
    Mashie Saldana's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bartholomeus Crane View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Mashie Saldana View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Bartholomeus Crane View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Sandzibar View Post
    https://twitter.com/bbcquestiontime/...51546940608514

    Is 80k the standard wage for morons these days or something?
    In my personal experience, often, this more the wage goes up, the more moron the arguments get for not having to pay a fair share of taxes.
    What is your definition of fair share of taxes? Is the goal that everyone ends up with the same amount of money after taxes regardless of income to start with?

    Fuck that why even bother working.
    No, but thanks for trying ...

    I just happen to think that the rich paying proportionally less taxes than the (working) poor is ridiculous. I also just happen to think that people having so much wealth that they can't possibly spend it all in 5 lifetimes is ludicrous. In other words: no, I do not think that billionaires should (be allowed) to exists.

    I guess I'm just one of those extremists who believes that a fair tax system should be proportional to wealth or income. The broadest shoulders should carry the heaviest load as opposed to one (tax) rule for the rich, and another one for the rest, and all that.
    And how about those at salary levels between Benefit Street and the billionaires? As in normal people. It is a massive difference in tax if you earn 20/40/60k. Those at 20k pay just over a tenth of what someone at 60k is.

    30 years ago it was less than 1 million paying the higher tax rate, today that is closer to 4.5 million. That rate should have gone up with inflation, unfortunately it didn't.
    How to tell the difference between Machine Learning and AI:
    If it is written in Python it is most likely Machine Learning.
    If it is written in PowerPoint it is most likely AI.

  2. #10322
    Mashie Saldana's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bartholomeus Crane View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Mashie Saldana View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Bartholomeus Crane View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Sandzibar View Post
    https://twitter.com/bbcquestiontime/...51546940608514

    Is 80k the standard wage for morons these days or something?
    In my personal experience, often, this more the wage goes up, the more moron the arguments get for not having to pay a fair share of taxes.
    What is your definition of fair share of taxes? Is the goal that everyone ends up with the same amount of money after taxes regardless of income to start with?

    Fuck that why even bother working.
    No, but thanks for trying ...

    I just happen to think that the rich paying proportionally less taxes than the (working) poor is ridiculous. I also just happen to think that people having so much wealth that they can't possibly spend it all in 5 lifetimes is ludicrous. In other words: no, I do not think that billionaires should (be allowed) to exists.

    I guess I'm just one of those extremists who believes that a fair tax system should be proportional to wealth or income. The broadest shoulders should carry the heaviest load as opposed to one (tax) rule for the rich, and another one for the rest, and all that.
    And how about those at salary levels between Benefit Street and the billionaires? As in normal people. It is a massive difference in tax if you earn 20/40/60k. Those at 20k pay just over a tenth of what someone at 60k is.

    30 years ago it was less than 1 million paying the higher tax rate, today that is closer to 4.5 million. That rate should have gone up with inflation, unfortunately it didn't.
    How to tell the difference between Machine Learning and AI:
    If it is written in Python it is most likely Machine Learning.
    If it is written in PowerPoint it is most likely AI.

  3. #10323

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mashie Saldana View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Bartholomeus Crane View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Mashie Saldana View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Bartholomeus Crane View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Sandzibar View Post
    https://twitter.com/bbcquestiontime/...51546940608514

    Is 80k the standard wage for morons these days or something?
    In my personal experience, often, this more the wage goes up, the more moron the arguments get for not having to pay a fair share of taxes.
    What is your definition of fair share of taxes? Is the goal that everyone ends up with the same amount of money after taxes regardless of income to start with?

    Fuck that why even bother working.
    No, but thanks for trying ...

    I just happen to think that the rich paying proportionally less taxes than the (working) poor is ridiculous. I also just happen to think that people having so much wealth that they can't possibly spend it all in 5 lifetimes is ludicrous. In other words: no, I do not think that billionaires should (be allowed) to exists.

    I guess I'm just one of those extremists who believes that a fair tax system should be proportional to wealth or income. The broadest shoulders should carry the heaviest load as opposed to one (tax) rule for the rich, and another one for the rest, and all that.
    And how about those at salary levels between Benefit Street and the billionaires? As in normal people. It is a massive difference in tax if you earn 20/40/60k. Those at 20k pay just over a tenth of what someone at 60k is.

    30 years ago it was less than 1 million paying the higher tax rate, today that is closer to 4.5 million. That rate should have gone up with inflation, unfortunately it didn't.
    There's a massive difference in what you can afford between those income brackets. Someone on 20k can get by, but won't be able to do anything fun. They'll also be paying a higher proportion of tax than you think as consumption taxes (VAT, fuel and alcohol duty, etc) disproportionately affect low earners.

    Considering the median salary is something like 27k (and that's not gone up for a decade) someone on 60k is doing pretty well for themselves. If you're getting that, give yourself a pat on the back - and relax because your income tax won't go under a Corbyn government.

  4. #10324
    Duckslayer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rodj Blake View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Mashie Saldana View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Bartholomeus Crane View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Mashie Saldana View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Bartholomeus Crane View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Sandzibar View Post
    https://twitter.com/bbcquestiontime/...51546940608514

    Is 80k the standard wage for morons these days or something?
    In my personal experience, often, this more the wage goes up, the more moron the arguments get for not having to pay a fair share of taxes.
    What is your definition of fair share of taxes? Is the goal that everyone ends up with the same amount of money after taxes regardless of income to start with?

    Fuck that why even bother working.
    No, but thanks for trying ...

    I just happen to think that the rich paying proportionally less taxes than the (working) poor is ridiculous. I also just happen to think that people having so much wealth that they can't possibly spend it all in 5 lifetimes is ludicrous. In other words: no, I do not think that billionaires should (be allowed) to exists.

    I guess I'm just one of those extremists who believes that a fair tax system should be proportional to wealth or income. The broadest shoulders should carry the heaviest load as opposed to one (tax) rule for the rich, and another one for the rest, and all that.
    And how about those at salary levels between Benefit Street and the billionaires? As in normal people. It is a massive difference in tax if you earn 20/40/60k. Those at 20k pay just over a tenth of what someone at 60k is.

    30 years ago it was less than 1 million paying the higher tax rate, today that is closer to 4.5 million. That rate should have gone up with inflation, unfortunately it didn't.
    There's a massive difference in what you can afford between those income brackets. Someone on 20k can get by, but won't be able to do anything fun. They'll also be paying a higher proportion of tax than you think as consumption taxes (VAT, fuel and alcohol duty, etc) disproportionately affect low earners.

    Considering the median salary is something like 27k (and that's not gone up for a decade) someone on 60k is doing pretty well for themselves. If you're getting that, give yourself a pat on the back - and relax because your income tax won't go under a Corbyn government.

  5. #10325
    Movember 2012 Zekk Pacus's Avatar
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    I'm a simple man. I see Stewart Lee, I plusrep.
    'I'm pro life. I'm a non-smoker. I'm a pro-life non-smoker. WOO, Let the party begin!'

  6. #10326

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    Quote Originally Posted by Rodj Blake View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Mashie Saldana View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Bartholomeus Crane View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Mashie Saldana View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Bartholomeus Crane View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Sandzibar View Post
    https://twitter.com/bbcquestiontime/...51546940608514

    Is 80k the standard wage for morons these days or something?
    In my personal experience, often, this more the wage goes up, the more moron the arguments get for not having to pay a fair share of taxes.
    What is your definition of fair share of taxes? Is the goal that everyone ends up with the same amount of money after taxes regardless of income to start with?

    Fuck that why even bother working.
    No, but thanks for trying ...

    I just happen to think that the rich paying proportionally less taxes than the (working) poor is ridiculous. I also just happen to think that people having so much wealth that they can't possibly spend it all in 5 lifetimes is ludicrous. In other words: no, I do not think that billionaires should (be allowed) to exists.

    I guess I'm just one of those extremists who believes that a fair tax system should be proportional to wealth or income. The broadest shoulders should carry the heaviest load as opposed to one (tax) rule for the rich, and another one for the rest, and all that.
    And how about those at salary levels between Benefit Street and the billionaires? As in normal people. It is a massive difference in tax if you earn 20/40/60k. Those at 20k pay just over a tenth of what someone at 60k is.

    30 years ago it was less than 1 million paying the higher tax rate, today that is closer to 4.5 million. That rate should have gone up with inflation, unfortunately it didn't.
    There's a massive difference in what you can afford between those income brackets. Someone on 20k can get by, but won't be able to do anything fun. They'll also be paying a higher proportion of tax than you think as consumption taxes (VAT, fuel and alcohol duty, etc) disproportionately affect low earners.

    Considering the median salary is something like 27k (and that's not gone up for a decade) someone on 60k is doing pretty well for themselves. If you're getting that, give yourself a pat on the back - and relax because your income tax won't go under a Corbyn government.
    Instead of calculating what tax they pay try calculating what they have left after tax.

  7. #10327

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    Quote Originally Posted by Duckslayer View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Rodj Blake View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Mashie Saldana View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Bartholomeus Crane View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Mashie Saldana View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Bartholomeus Crane View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Sandzibar View Post
    https://twitter.com/bbcquestiontime/...51546940608514

    Is 80k the standard wage for morons these days or something?
    In my personal experience, often, this more the wage goes up, the more moron the arguments get for not having to pay a fair share of taxes.
    What is your definition of fair share of taxes? Is the goal that everyone ends up with the same amount of money after taxes regardless of income to start with?

    Fuck that why even bother working.
    No, but thanks for trying ...

    I just happen to think that the rich paying proportionally less taxes than the (working) poor is ridiculous. I also just happen to think that people having so much wealth that they can't possibly spend it all in 5 lifetimes is ludicrous. In other words: no, I do not think that billionaires should (be allowed) to exists.

    I guess I'm just one of those extremists who believes that a fair tax system should be proportional to wealth or income. The broadest shoulders should carry the heaviest load as opposed to one (tax) rule for the rich, and another one for the rest, and all that.
    And how about those at salary levels between Benefit Street and the billionaires? As in normal people. It is a massive difference in tax if you earn 20/40/60k. Those at 20k pay just over a tenth of what someone at 60k is.

    30 years ago it was less than 1 million paying the higher tax rate, today that is closer to 4.5 million. That rate should have gone up with inflation, unfortunately it didn't.
    There's a massive difference in what you can afford between those income brackets. Someone on 20k can get by, but won't be able to do anything fun. They'll also be paying a higher proportion of tax than you think as consumption taxes (VAT, fuel and alcohol duty, etc) disproportionately affect low earners.

    Considering the median salary is something like 27k (and that's not gone up for a decade) someone on 60k is doing pretty well for themselves. If you're getting that, give yourself a pat on the back - and relax because your income tax won't go under a Corbyn government.
    I work with a lot of people from Guildford...

  8. #10328

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    Money is a scam anyway.

  9. #10329

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    I've just finished watching last night's Question Time. Swinson struggled, Sturgeon was businesslike but dull, Corbyn was magnificent, Johnson rambled incoherently and completely lost the audience at times.

  10. #10330
    Malcanis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rodj Blake View Post
    I've just finished watching last night's Question Time. Swinson struggled, Sturgeon was businesslike but dull, Corbyn was magnificent, Johnson rambled incoherently and completely lost the audience at times.
    If Corbyn did a good job, I'm glad to hear it at last.

    How relaxing it must be to be a conservative, and not care if your candidate sounds good, or has any credibility, or even makes sense.
    Quote Originally Posted by Keieueue View Post
    I love Malcanis!

  11. #10331
    Mashie Saldana's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rodj Blake View Post
    They'll also be paying a higher proportion of tax than you think as consumption taxes (VAT, fuel and alcohol duty, etc) disproportionately affect low earners.
    How? It is the same VAT/fuel tax for everyone. If anything that is perfectly equal regardless what you earn. Now if it was a cap on the maximum amount of VAT you had to pay each month then it would be unfair towards the high earners as they spend more money.
    How to tell the difference between Machine Learning and AI:
    If it is written in Python it is most likely Machine Learning.
    If it is written in PowerPoint it is most likely AI.

  12. #10332

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mashie Saldana View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Rodj Blake View Post
    They'll also be paying a higher proportion of tax than you think as consumption taxes (VAT, fuel and alcohol duty, etc) disproportionately affect low earners.
    How? It is the same VAT/fuel tax for everyone. If anything that is perfectly equal regardless what you earn. Now if it was a cap on the maximum amount of VAT you had to pay each month then it would be unfair towards the high earners as they spend more money.
    Because poor people pay a higher proportion of their income on those things.

    https://www.independent.co.uk/news/u...-a7704331.html
    Last edited by Rodj Blake; November 23 2019 at 05:50:16 PM.

  13. #10333
    Mashie Saldana's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rodj Blake View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Mashie Saldana View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Rodj Blake View Post
    They'll also be paying a higher proportion of tax than you think as consumption taxes (VAT, fuel and alcohol duty, etc) disproportionately affect low earners.
    How? It is the same VAT/fuel tax for everyone. If anything that is perfectly equal regardless what you earn. Now if it was a cap on the maximum amount of VAT you had to pay each month then it would be unfair towards the high earners as they spend more money.
    Because poor people pay a higher proportion of their income on those things.

    https://www.independent.co.uk/news/u...-a7704331.html
    I can see how the Council Tax making a difference. But the VAT part being 5 vs 12.5% doesn't make much sense. The only way that can differ is if the top earners either spend their income on overpaying their mortgage or putting it into savings/shares. And if it is savings it will end up as VAT at a later date as it isn't much you can spend money on that doesn't involve VAT.
    How to tell the difference between Machine Learning and AI:
    If it is written in Python it is most likely Machine Learning.
    If it is written in PowerPoint it is most likely AI.

  14. #10334
    NoirAvlaa's Avatar
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    The point is poor people spend all their money on things, which is then taxed whereas rich people hoard money, so it doesn't go back into the economy (at least not for a very long time). So overall the poor pay more into the economy as a % of what they have because they generally live paycheck to paycheck.

  15. #10335
    Meester's Avatar
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    Jeremy Corbyn on QE


  16. #10336

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mashie Saldana View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Rodj Blake View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Mashie Saldana View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Rodj Blake View Post
    They'll also be paying a higher proportion of tax than you think as consumption taxes (VAT, fuel and alcohol duty, etc) disproportionately affect low earners.
    How? It is the same VAT/fuel tax for everyone. If anything that is perfectly equal regardless what you earn. Now if it was a cap on the maximum amount of VAT you had to pay each month then it would be unfair towards the high earners as they spend more money.
    Because poor people pay a higher proportion of their income on those things.

    https://www.independent.co.uk/news/u...-a7704331.html
    I can see how the Council Tax making a difference. But the VAT part being 5 vs 12.5% doesn't make much sense. The only way that can differ is if the top earners either spend their income on overpaying their mortgage or putting it into savings/shares. And if it is savings it will end up as VAT at a later date as it isn't much you can spend money on that doesn't involve VAT.
    There's quite a few things you can buy that are VAT exempt, but they tend not to be the things that the poor buy.

    You pay VAT on a car, but not on a yacht. You pay VAT on an oven-ready pizza, but not on caviar.

    Is it starting to make sense now?

    And you're wrong about high-earners eventually spending all of their money.
    Last edited by Rodj Blake; November 24 2019 at 08:46:22 AM.

  17. #10337
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    The rich also put money into hoarding property which they then use to extract the wages of renters and create a massive drag on the economy and social mobility.
    Quote Originally Posted by Paul Mason
    It is absurd that we are capable of witnessing a 40,000 year old system of gender oppression begin to dissolve before our eyes yet still see the abolition of a 200 year old economic system as an unrealistic utopia.

  18. #10338
    GeromeDoutrande's Avatar
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    Tories lead polls by 10% to 19% depending on your favoured polling institute:

    https://www.theguardian.com/politics...9-poll-tracker

  19. #10339
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    We've now reached cultural degeneracy where history has died and we find it impossible to imagine better futures or imaginative alternatives. Instead we're put into boxes and have been persuaded we are happy. At least sisyphus had something to struggle against every day.
    Quote Originally Posted by Paul Mason
    It is absurd that we are capable of witnessing a 40,000 year old system of gender oppression begin to dissolve before our eyes yet still see the abolition of a 200 year old economic system as an unrealistic utopia.

  20. #10340
    Malcanis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Keckers View Post
    We've now reached cultural degeneracy where history has died and we find it impossible to imagine better futures or imaginative alternatives. Instead we're put into boxes and have been persuaded we are happy. At least sisyphus had something to struggle against every day.
    Quote Originally Posted by Keieueue View Post
    I love Malcanis!

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