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Thread: National Brotherhood Week (USA Civil Unrest Thread)

  1. #421
    Alistair's Avatar
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    Just to add, small good news:

    “Four responding MPD officers involved in the death of George Floyd have been terminated,” Minneapolis Mayor Jacob Frey tweeted. “This is the right call.”
    The city has cut them loose, now they can be prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law.


  2. #422
    mewninn's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alistair View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by mewninn View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Alistair View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Lachesis VII View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by erichkknaar View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Lachesis VII View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by erichkknaar View Post
    Some of this is a really hot take that ignores 1000s of years of Sheriffs, city guard and other law enforcement that the modern police force is an outgrowth of.
    I tried to present something of a range of takes, but there’s definitely been a change since the early industrial revolution in terms of the degree of state organization employed in policing. Like everything else, it industrialized. It also became a syndicate; call it the police-industrial complex if you want, but the effect is something sort of praetorian in its social impact.
    I mean, at some point society evolved from the big dudes with sword who fucked your shit up if you fucked with their bosses stuff to big dudes with swords who fuck your shit up if you fuck with our stuff, collectively. In itself, not a bad thing.

    The real problem here is weve let the dog off the leash in this country, and we are morons, so we have no idea how to get around facts like, an armed populace making them act like an army, and, ironically, the fact you cant really punish any of them becasue police unions and “muh law and order”.
    Except that it’s not our stuff, collectively. It’s a few people’s stuff. Fewer, lately.

    If policing were just about protecting lives and property, that’d be one thing, but that’s clearly not the actual role it plays in society. It’s the justification, but at this point American police are basically a protection racket with more than a little ethnic-suppression paramilitary mixed in.
    I think you overstate the relationship between Police and (I presume) the Rich Elites. I think you see motivations and conspiracies where simple ignorance, bias, stress and human and public service failings exist.
    The NYPD only had a billionaire mayor refer to them as his personal army and use them for the mission of "broken windows" policing (ie boost real estate values at the expense of poor people)
    I'm not really in the mood to fight about it, but real estate values are more than the capital elite, and poor people are not only black people.

    Have you seen what NYC looked like in the 70's? It was a horror show man. The people there wanted it cleaned up. Public policy went too far to address a real problem (crime in NYC). It wasn't a racism + capitalism conspiracy, it was a shit-hole city electing anti-crime people (who, it should be noted, predate the Billionaire in their attacks on crime) to do what was demanded, clean up the rotten apple. And they did, but they also clearly went too far.

    Never mind, this will become the usual thing, and it's been a long day already. Believe what you like. If you think all of the U.S. Police Forces are really part of a grant Capitalist/Racist cabal system designed to only defend the ultra-rich and oppress minorities, then sure, I guess that is what it is. it couldn't be something materially simpler and more obvious, clearly.
    That's nice man, but Bloomberg happened 30 years after the 1970s, he presided over a massive amount of real estate development, expansion of policing and surveillance, an uptick in evictions, and he said that thing about his personal army.

    What more do you need? Some Respected Journalist from NYT/NPR to affirm that "Hmmm yes, indeed that is the case"?

    Because that'll never happen, since they largely do what you do. Handwring about how "things went too far"

  3. #423
    Donor erichkknaar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lachesis VII View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by erichkknaar View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Lachesis VII View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by erichkknaar View Post
    Some of this is a really hot take that ignores 1000s of years of Sheriffs, city guard and other law enforcement that the modern police force is an outgrowth of.
    I tried to present something of a range of takes, but there’s definitely been a change since the early industrial revolution in terms of the degree of state organization employed in policing. Like everything else, it industrialized. It also became a syndicate; call it the police-industrial complex if you want, but the effect is something sort of praetorian in its social impact.
    I mean, at some point society evolved from the big dudes with sword who fucked your shit up if you fucked with their bosses stuff to big dudes with swords who fuck your shit up if you fuck with our stuff, collectively. In itself, not a bad thing.

    The real problem here is weve let the dog off the leash in this country, and we are morons, so we have no idea how to get around facts like, an armed populace making them act like an army, and, ironically, the fact you cant really punish any of them becasue police unions and “muh law and order”.
    Except that it’s not our stuff, collectively. It’s a few people’s stuff. Fewer, lately.

    If policing were just about protecting lives and property, that’d be one thing, but that’s clearly not the actual role it plays in society. It’s the justification, but at this point American police are basically a protection racket with more than a little ethnic-suppression paramilitary mixed in.
    Yes. I agree its a massive fucking problem, however, you have stuff, and so do I (as does anyone with a computer who can post on FHC), and so, the police are protecting that a bit, and also your stuff when you walk around, like your phone, etc. It's the reason we don't really have to go out packing like it's mad max out there, to travel between our cities by road.
    meh

  4. #424
    Donor Aea's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alistair View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by mewninn View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Alistair View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Lachesis VII View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by erichkknaar View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Lachesis VII View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by erichkknaar View Post
    Some of this is a really hot take that ignores 1000s of years of Sheriffs, city guard and other law enforcement that the modern police force is an outgrowth of.
    I tried to present something of a range of takes, but there’s definitely been a change since the early industrial revolution in terms of the degree of state organization employed in policing. Like everything else, it industrialized. It also became a syndicate; call it the police-industrial complex if you want, but the effect is something sort of praetorian in its social impact.
    I mean, at some point society evolved from the big dudes with sword who fucked your shit up if you fucked with their bosses stuff to big dudes with swords who fuck your shit up if you fuck with our stuff, collectively. In itself, not a bad thing.

    The real problem here is weve let the dog off the leash in this country, and we are morons, so we have no idea how to get around facts like, an armed populace making them act like an army, and, ironically, the fact you cant really punish any of them becasue police unions and “muh law and order”.
    Except that it’s not our stuff, collectively. It’s a few people’s stuff. Fewer, lately.

    If policing were just about protecting lives and property, that’d be one thing, but that’s clearly not the actual role it plays in society. It’s the justification, but at this point American police are basically a protection racket with more than a little ethnic-suppression paramilitary mixed in.
    I think you overstate the relationship between Police and (I presume) the Rich Elites. I think you see motivations and conspiracies where simple ignorance, bias, stress and human and public service failings exist.
    The NYPD only had a billionaire mayor refer to them as his personal army and use them for the mission of "broken windows" policing (ie boost real estate values at the expense of poor people)
    I'm not really in the mood to fight about it, but real estate values are more than the capital elite, and poor people are not only black people.

    Have you seen what NYC looked like in the 70's? It was a horror show man. The people there wanted it cleaned up. Public policy went too far to address a real problem (crime in NYC). It wasn't a racism + capitalism conspiracy, it was a shit-hole city electing anti-crime people (who, it should be noted, predate the Billionaire in their attacks on crime) to do what was demanded, clean up the rotten apple. And they did, but they also clearly went too far.

    Never mind, this will become the usual thing, and it's been a long day already. Believe what you like. If you think all of the U.S. Police Forces are really part of a grant Capitalist/Racist cabal system designed to only defend the ultra-rich and oppress minorities, then sure, I guess that is what it is. it couldn't be something materially simpler and more obvious, clearly.

    Some I assume... are good people.

  5. #425
    Alistair's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mewninn View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Alistair View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by mewninn View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Alistair View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Lachesis VII View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by erichkknaar View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Lachesis VII View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by erichkknaar View Post
    Some of this is a really hot take that ignores 1000s of years of Sheriffs, city guard and other law enforcement that the modern police force is an outgrowth of.
    I tried to present something of a range of takes, but there’s definitely been a change since the early industrial revolution in terms of the degree of state organization employed in policing. Like everything else, it industrialized. It also became a syndicate; call it the police-industrial complex if you want, but the effect is something sort of praetorian in its social impact.
    I mean, at some point society evolved from the big dudes with sword who fucked your shit up if you fucked with their bosses stuff to big dudes with swords who fuck your shit up if you fuck with our stuff, collectively. In itself, not a bad thing.

    The real problem here is weve let the dog off the leash in this country, and we are morons, so we have no idea how to get around facts like, an armed populace making them act like an army, and, ironically, the fact you cant really punish any of them becasue police unions and “muh law and order”.
    Except that it’s not our stuff, collectively. It’s a few people’s stuff. Fewer, lately.

    If policing were just about protecting lives and property, that’d be one thing, but that’s clearly not the actual role it plays in society. It’s the justification, but at this point American police are basically a protection racket with more than a little ethnic-suppression paramilitary mixed in.
    I think you overstate the relationship between Police and (I presume) the Rich Elites. I think you see motivations and conspiracies where simple ignorance, bias, stress and human and public service failings exist.
    The NYPD only had a billionaire mayor refer to them as his personal army and use them for the mission of "broken windows" policing (ie boost real estate values at the expense of poor people)
    I'm not really in the mood to fight about it, but real estate values are more than the capital elite, and poor people are not only black people.

    Have you seen what NYC looked like in the 70's? It was a horror show man. The people there wanted it cleaned up. Public policy went too far to address a real problem (crime in NYC). It wasn't a racism + capitalism conspiracy, it was a shit-hole city electing anti-crime people (who, it should be noted, predate the Billionaire in their attacks on crime) to do what was demanded, clean up the rotten apple. And they did, but they also clearly went too far.

    Never mind, this will become the usual thing, and it's been a long day already. Believe what you like. If you think all of the U.S. Police Forces are really part of a grant Capitalist/Racist cabal system designed to only defend the ultra-rich and oppress minorities, then sure, I guess that is what it is. it couldn't be something materially simpler and more obvious, clearly.
    That's nice man, but Bloomberg happened 30 years after the 1970s, he presided over a massive amount of real estate development, expansion of policing and surveillance, an uptick in evictions, and he said that thing about his personal army.

    What more do you need? Some Respected Journalist from NYT/NPR to affirm that "Hmmm yes, indeed that is the case"?

    Because that'll never happen, since they largely do what you do. Handwring about how "things went too far"
    You just might want to brush up on your NYC history. New York had quite a bit of it before Bloomberg saw the stage.

    Also, NYC =/= U.S.A.

    Sorry I'm so NYT/NPR.....I guess? Too right wing and fascist, those two?


  6. #426
    Duckslayer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by erichkknaar View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Lachesis VII View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by erichkknaar View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Lachesis VII View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by erichkknaar View Post
    Some of this is a really hot take that ignores 1000s of years of Sheriffs, city guard and other law enforcement that the modern police force is an outgrowth of.
    I tried to present something of a range of takes, but there’s definitely been a change since the early industrial revolution in terms of the degree of state organization employed in policing. Like everything else, it industrialized. It also became a syndicate; call it the police-industrial complex if you want, but the effect is something sort of praetorian in its social impact.
    I mean, at some point society evolved from the big dudes with sword who fucked your shit up if you fucked with their bosses stuff to big dudes with swords who fuck your shit up if you fuck with our stuff, collectively. In itself, not a bad thing.

    The real problem here is weve let the dog off the leash in this country, and we are morons, so we have no idea how to get around facts like, an armed populace making them act like an army, and, ironically, the fact you cant really punish any of them becasue police unions and “muh law and order”.
    Except that it’s not our stuff, collectively. It’s a few people’s stuff. Fewer, lately.

    If policing were just about protecting lives and property, that’d be one thing, but that’s clearly not the actual role it plays in society. It’s the justification, but at this point American police are basically a protection racket with more than a little ethnic-suppression paramilitary mixed in.
    Yes. I agree its a massive fucking problem, however, you have stuff, and so do I (as does anyone with a computer who can post on FHC), and so, the police are protecting that a bit, and also your stuff when you walk around, like your phone, etc. It's the reason we don't really have to go out packing like it's mad max out there, to travel between our cities by road.
    The reason you dont have mad max is cos of christian morality and the message of the church



    *roleplay

  7. #427
    mewninn's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alistair View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by mewninn View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Alistair View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by mewninn View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Alistair View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Lachesis VII View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by erichkknaar View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Lachesis VII View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by erichkknaar View Post
    Some of this is a really hot take that ignores 1000s of years of Sheriffs, city guard and other law enforcement that the modern police force is an outgrowth of.
    I tried to present something of a range of takes, but there’s definitely been a change since the early industrial revolution in terms of the degree of state organization employed in policing. Like everything else, it industrialized. It also became a syndicate; call it the police-industrial complex if you want, but the effect is something sort of praetorian in its social impact.
    I mean, at some point society evolved from the big dudes with sword who fucked your shit up if you fucked with their bosses stuff to big dudes with swords who fuck your shit up if you fuck with our stuff, collectively. In itself, not a bad thing.

    The real problem here is weve let the dog off the leash in this country, and we are morons, so we have no idea how to get around facts like, an armed populace making them act like an army, and, ironically, the fact you cant really punish any of them becasue police unions and “muh law and order”.
    Except that it’s not our stuff, collectively. It’s a few people’s stuff. Fewer, lately.

    If policing were just about protecting lives and property, that’d be one thing, but that’s clearly not the actual role it plays in society. It’s the justification, but at this point American police are basically a protection racket with more than a little ethnic-suppression paramilitary mixed in.
    I think you overstate the relationship between Police and (I presume) the Rich Elites. I think you see motivations and conspiracies where simple ignorance, bias, stress and human and public service failings exist.
    The NYPD only had a billionaire mayor refer to them as his personal army and use them for the mission of "broken windows" policing (ie boost real estate values at the expense of poor people)
    I'm not really in the mood to fight about it, but real estate values are more than the capital elite, and poor people are not only black people.

    Have you seen what NYC looked like in the 70's? It was a horror show man. The people there wanted it cleaned up. Public policy went too far to address a real problem (crime in NYC). It wasn't a racism + capitalism conspiracy, it was a shit-hole city electing anti-crime people (who, it should be noted, predate the Billionaire in their attacks on crime) to do what was demanded, clean up the rotten apple. And they did, but they also clearly went too far.

    Never mind, this will become the usual thing, and it's been a long day already. Believe what you like. If you think all of the U.S. Police Forces are really part of a grant Capitalist/Racist cabal system designed to only defend the ultra-rich and oppress minorities, then sure, I guess that is what it is. it couldn't be something materially simpler and more obvious, clearly.
    That's nice man, but Bloomberg happened 30 years after the 1970s, he presided over a massive amount of real estate development, expansion of policing and surveillance, an uptick in evictions, and he said that thing about his personal army.

    What more do you need? Some Respected Journalist from NYT/NPR to affirm that "Hmmm yes, indeed that is the case"?

    Because that'll never happen, since they largely do what you do. Handwring about how "things went too far"
    You just might want to brush up on your NYC history. New York had quite a bit of it before Bloomberg saw the stage.

    Also, NYC =/= U.S.A.

    Sorry I'm so NYT/NPR.....I guess? Too right wing and fascist, those two?
    No they equivocate a lot and sigh a lot about how regrettable things are.

    It's a compliment in some ways, you've actually been moving left!

  8. #428
    NoirAvlaa's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Keckers View Post
    hmmmm

    White woman called police on black man in dog row


    The man, described as an "avid birder", was concerned the dog could endanger wildlife in Central Park.

    "I'm going to tell them [police] there's an African-American man threatening my life," she told him.
    he obviously shouldn't have been dressed in clothes that make him appear so threatening.

  9. #429
    Donor erichkknaar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Duckslayer View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by erichkknaar View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Lachesis VII View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by erichkknaar View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Lachesis VII View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by erichkknaar View Post
    Some of this is a really hot take that ignores 1000s of years of Sheriffs, city guard and other law enforcement that the modern police force is an outgrowth of.
    I tried to present something of a range of takes, but there’s definitely been a change since the early industrial revolution in terms of the degree of state organization employed in policing. Like everything else, it industrialized. It also became a syndicate; call it the police-industrial complex if you want, but the effect is something sort of praetorian in its social impact.
    I mean, at some point society evolved from the big dudes with sword who fucked your shit up if you fucked with their bosses stuff to big dudes with swords who fuck your shit up if you fuck with our stuff, collectively. In itself, not a bad thing.

    The real problem here is weve let the dog off the leash in this country, and we are morons, so we have no idea how to get around facts like, an armed populace making them act like an army, and, ironically, the fact you cant really punish any of them becasue police unions and “muh law and order”.
    Except that it’s not our stuff, collectively. It’s a few people’s stuff. Fewer, lately.

    If policing were just about protecting lives and property, that’d be one thing, but that’s clearly not the actual role it plays in society. It’s the justification, but at this point American police are basically a protection racket with more than a little ethnic-suppression paramilitary mixed in.
    Yes. I agree its a massive fucking problem, however, you have stuff, and so do I (as does anyone with a computer who can post on FHC), and so, the police are protecting that a bit, and also your stuff when you walk around, like your phone, etc. It's the reason we don't really have to go out packing like it's mad max out there, to travel between our cities by road.
    The reason you dont have mad max is cos of christian morality and the message of the church
    lole
    meh

  10. #430
    Lachesis VII's Avatar
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    Worth noting that most of America had skyrocketing crime through the 70's, 80's, and into the 90's, and that it came down uniformly pretty much everywhere, without resort in most places to NYPD/LAPD style policing.

    New York was seeing the benefit of this trend well before Bloomberg came on the scene.

  11. #431
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    Quote Originally Posted by erichkknaar View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Lachesis VII View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by erichkknaar View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Lachesis VII View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by erichkknaar View Post
    Some of this is a really hot take that ignores 1000s of years of Sheriffs, city guard and other law enforcement that the modern police force is an outgrowth of.
    I tried to present something of a range of takes, but there’s definitely been a change since the early industrial revolution in terms of the degree of state organization employed in policing. Like everything else, it industrialized. It also became a syndicate; call it the police-industrial complex if you want, but the effect is something sort of praetorian in its social impact.
    I mean, at some point society evolved from the big dudes with sword who fucked your shit up if you fucked with their bosses stuff to big dudes with swords who fuck your shit up if you fuck with our stuff, collectively. In itself, not a bad thing.

    The real problem here is weve let the dog off the leash in this country, and we are morons, so we have no idea how to get around facts like, an armed populace making them act like an army, and, ironically, the fact you cant really punish any of them becasue police unions and “muh law and order”.
    Except that it’s not our stuff, collectively. It’s a few people’s stuff. Fewer, lately.

    If policing were just about protecting lives and property, that’d be one thing, but that’s clearly not the actual role it plays in society. It’s the justification, but at this point American police are basically a protection racket with more than a little ethnic-suppression paramilitary mixed in.
    Yes. I agree its a massive fucking problem, however, you have stuff, and so do I (as does anyone with a computer who can post on FHC), and so, the police are protecting that a bit, and also your stuff when you walk around, like your phone, etc. It's the reason we don't really have to go out packing like it's mad max out there, to travel between our cities by road.
    Right but realistically if someone broke into my house and stole my fancy FHC-poasting computer, the police would swing by, take a report, tell me to consider some better home security, and to file a claim with my insurance. And that would probably be the end of that.

  12. #432
    Movember 2011Movember 2012 Nordstern's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lachesis VII View Post
    Meanwhile, in Minneapolis, the cops will just stand on your neck until you die, even if you aren’t resisting.

    This is the same police department that shot and killed Justine Damond, then circled the wagons and refused to talk about it.

    This is why I refuse to live and work in Minneapolis.
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  13. #433
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    Quote Originally Posted by Totally Not Larkonnis View Post
    This is murder and his partner is an accomplice.
    I was somewhere around Old Man Star, on the edge of Essence, when drugs began to take hold.

  14. #434
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    As Alistair pointed out, the system here has some very complex issues behind it. In Philadelphia, the DA is about as socially liberal as you can get, but the police still overstep at times. The U.S has a uniquely fucked up set of circumstances that allow such insane power to law enforcement. I am about as far from underpowered citizen as you can get and I've had a gun drawn on me by a state trooper, was hit on my bike by a cop and he tried to charge me with a crime (surprisingly there is no law about getting hit by a car being your fault), and I've had a officer breach a door I was standing behind without a warrant or cause to even do so. Not once has any of this lead to consequences for an officer in all of these instances. I'm a white male lower middle class in appearance and have never been drunk or high in these circumstances, so if this can happen to me, it's really fucking easy for them to do more to people with less protections.

    The way we record and report crime, the way we treat police weapon discharge, excessive force, those are two huge issues. Race, class and regional cultures are all factors for individuals being harassed or mistreated by the law. The sheriff system here is bonkers as well. It's just one of those signs that for a world superpower, we are literally about as fucked up on the inside, being such a young country with hardcoded flaws in our governance system, that it's only a matter of time before those pieces breakdown, and hopefully are fixed.

    No one wants the crime of the later half of the 20th century back, but the way things are now, people don't seem to much want this system as well.

    the police are treated as a special class of citizen, protected from the same laws they are supposed to enforce, and much like a gang, there are consequences, sometimes deadly ones, for cops that speak out against this. There is no way that won't breed violations that lead to them murdering people like they do frequently, and hopefully like we see in Minneapolis today, it can be stopped, but it has to be a national effort.
    Last edited by Jack Coutu; May 26 2020 at 11:15:30 PM.

  15. #435
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    Quote Originally Posted by mewninn View Post
    We crushed every union besides police unions. Those still have an incredible amount of power and influence.
    We have powerful police unions in Germany and our police doesn't pull shit like this.

    Don't blame this on the unions.

    I'd put the blame partially on the absouletly abysmal training US police officers get. It's barely three months of police academy, and some police agencies have new recruits out on patrol before they got to the police academy. Think about that. No training but going on patrol.

    Here it's a three year education (or four year uni course depending on career type).

    Add on top of that the fact that Sheriffs and DAs and judges are elected... I still can't understand why, and I spent more time and effort in understanding the US than I sometimes want to admit.

    Tapapapatalk
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  16. #436
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    Also I'm not pro death penalty at all, but this made me wish that fucking idiot with the knee on his neck could be thrown to the wolves.

  17. #437
    Super Chillerator Global Moderator teds :D's Avatar
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    police forces generally need to move to a degree focused education, but to incentivise need higher wages and more access to health and mental support. I don't really know much about other countries training, but the UK has started (slowly) to move to this https://www.college.police.uk/What-w...nticeship.aspx

    smarter cops, a pay reason to incentivise dealing with the horrific shit they have to deal with and the support framework there to help them.

    downsides will be if you want the same operational coverage, you're going to have to eventually pay the same amount (and no force is happy with their staffing levels) of cops a higher wage. worth it? I think so. As a tiny example i deal with cops in my force (i do work for firefighters and lol pcc's too) for training on how to generally not be a dickhead on the interwebs, and with the media. there's is a shocking difference in the...ability to take in information between the new cops and the boys who have been at it for 10+ years

  18. #438
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    Quote Originally Posted by Joe Appleby View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by mewninn View Post
    We crushed every union besides police unions. Those still have an incredible amount of power and influence.
    We have powerful police unions in Germany and our police doesn't pull shit like this.

    Don't blame this on the unions.

    I'd put the blame partially on the absouletly abysmal training US police officers get. It's barely three months of police academy, and some police agencies have new recruits out on patrol before they got to the police academy. Think about that. No training but going on patrol.

    Here it's a three year education (or four year uni course depending on career type).

    Add on top of that the fact that Sheriffs and DAs and judges are elected... I still can't understand why, and I spent more time and effort in understanding the US than I sometimes want to admit.

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    Yeah but like, education is for gays and liberals.

  19. #439
    Movember 2011Movember 2012 Nordstern's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by teds :D View Post
    police forces generally need to move to a degree focused education, but to incentivise need higher wages and more access to health and mental support. I don't really know much about other countries training, but the UK has started (slowly) to move to this https://www.college.police.uk/What-w...nticeship.aspx
    They have, but there's a tendency to allow non-degreed people in, because a) they were grandfathered in, or b) they have previous experience in another (worse/less stringent) jurisdiction. I knew a narcotics officer on the Minneapolis force who never advanced beyond the 8th grade. He had been on the force for 20+ years.

    If you issued a rule that said "degree by Dec 31, 2020 or you're out, no exceptions", there would be howling from the officers.
    Last edited by Nordstern; May 26 2020 at 11:47:20 PM.
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  20. #440
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    Quote Originally Posted by teds :D View Post
    police forces generally need to move to a degree focused education, but to incentivise need higher wages and more access to health and mental support. I don't really know much about other countries training, but the UK has started (slowly) to move to this https://www.college.police.uk/What-w...nticeship.aspx

    smarter cops, a pay reason to incentivise dealing with the horrific shit they have to deal with and the support framework there to help them.

    downsides will be if you want the same operational coverage, you're going to have to eventually pay the same amount (and no force is happy with their staffing levels) of cops a higher wage. worth it? I think so. As a tiny example i deal with cops in my force (i do work for firefighters and lol pcc's too) for training on how to generally not be a dickhead on the interwebs, and with the media. there's is a shocking difference in the...ability to take in information between the new cops and the boys who have been at it for 10+ years
    A smaller number of better cops would be in everyone's interest I would have thought


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