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Thread: Gun Laws and Gun Rights Discussion

  1. #381
    Donor erichkknaar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by teds :D View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by erichkknaar View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Alistair View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Keckers View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Alistair View Post
    Interesting, and I would agree.

    I'm curious, do you include as part of "American consumer culture" the Violence-as-Entertainment consumer-providers of Hollywood and Video Games, who sell a product full of normalized over-the-top gratuitous violence, so much so it's literally a cliche of a cliche at this point.

    I'm also curious why this seems to be a distinctly American Consumer Culture issue, I've been all over Europe.....you guys like to consume too, after all. And watch/play American-made entertainment.

    But guns are less available to you.

    I actually wonder if the fact that WWI and WWII occurred, killing hundreds of millions of you, within living memory plays a part. That collective memory of war and death by guns that the U.S. simply doesn't have as part of it's collective consciousness.
    I think violence as entertainment is part of the picture, but not a particularly primary one. I think shows like 'cops' and crime drama which depict black men as primarily thieving, violent 'others' in society is the main fuel for paranoia. Shoot'em video games are just a small part of normalising violence but only a tiny cog in a much larger machine.

    I think your news cycle has a different culture to Europe's on the whole - "And now we cut to a high speed police chase! Look at the car jacking black man go". I feel racism and scapegoating is much more prominent in the US, we don't have a huge portion of our population descended from a completely alienated slave labour force with no real cultural ancestry to hark back to.

    Europe also lacks the total ghettoisation of communities that is prevalent in almost every major US city. This is changing for the worse for a bit in Europe but we're a long way behind America in terms of clustered housing insecurity and child poverty etc.
    Funny, I see ALOT of derpy white guys on cops. And yes, I keep my own eye on dudes like that when in DC. Paranoia, or being smart in a big crime ridden city, YOU be the judge!

    High Speed chase live is a Cali thing. Apart from OJ, I've never in 30 years seen one on local TV here.

    You're right though, the U.S. style racial issues in the US is not something we see in Europe, closest you got is Paki Bashing or the like in the UK, and frankly, it's not really close, at all. Agree with you there. Although to be fair, you did exterminate most of Europe traditional racial scapegoat....

    I can't speak to Ghettoization in Europe, my time there saw places that certainly looked like ghettoes, but that's just a look.
    Most Muslims in France live in ghettos. I’d also say English council tower blocks look like ghettos to me. What a horrible life.
    alright mr slums in LA in CA apparently one of the more enlightened states
    That’s a shit life too. TLDR we both put our poor people in ghettos. The difference is we don’t BBQ ours.
    meh

  2. #382
    Approaching Walrus's Avatar
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    Yeah we just let their homes burn down while making sure that the fires don't spread to the affluent neighborhoods, all because of retarded fire management practices and agriculture spurred on by corrupt and wealthy farmers of course.

  3. #383
    Donor erichkknaar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Approaching Walrus View Post
    Yeah we just let their homes burn down while making sure that the fires don't spread to the affluent neighborhoods, all because of retarded fire management practices and agriculture spurred on by corrupt and wealthy farmers of course.
    No, in California, actually, it’s the affluent neighborhoods that burn. The ghettos in the city are relatively safe unless there’s a riot and they do it too themselves.
    meh

  4. #384
    walrus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Candy Crush View Post
    without guns half US will starve to death

    US confirmed as hunter-gatherer culture.
      Spoiler:
    Quote Originally Posted by RazoR View Post
    But islamism IS a product of class warfare. Rich white countries come into developing brown dictatorships, wreck the leadership, infrastructure and economy and then act all surprised that religious fanaticism is on the rise.
    Also:
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    walrus isnt a bad poster.
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    also i like walrus.
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    Yer a hoot

  5. #385
    XenosisMk4's Avatar
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    Anyone claiming Europe doesn't have a racism problem has never heard people talk about Roma tbh, shit gets disgustingly genocidal very quickly

  6. #386
    evil edna's Avatar
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    Have many roma on nonce island?

  7. #387

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    Quote Originally Posted by XenosisMk4 View Post
    Anyone claiming Europe doesn't have a racism problem has never heard people talk about Roma tbh, shit gets disgustingly genocidal very quickly
    Eh it has its problems too but they're different to the US ones so it's hard to wrap them up into the same arguments.

    Then again we don't lack Smarncas in Europe so we can't say how amazing and enlightened we are I guess.

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  8. #388
    מלך יהודים Zeekar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Isyel View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by XenosisMk4 View Post
    Anyone claiming Europe doesn't have a racism problem has never heard people talk about Roma tbh, shit gets disgustingly genocidal very quickly
    Eh it has its problems too but they're different to the US ones so it's hard to wrap them up into the same arguments.

    Then again we don't lack Smarncas in Europe so we can't say how amazing and enlightened we are I guess.

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    Only people who defend gypsies are the ones who don't live near them tho.


    

  9. #389
    Smarnca's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zeekar View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Isyel View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by XenosisMk4 View Post
    Anyone claiming Europe doesn't have a racism problem has never heard people talk about Roma tbh, shit gets disgustingly genocidal very quickly
    Eh it has its problems too but they're different to the US ones so it's hard to wrap them up into the same arguments.

    Then again we don't lack Smarncas in Europe so we can't say how amazing and enlightened we are I guess.

    Sent from my Nexus 5X using Tapatalk
    Only people who defend gypsies are the ones who don't live near them tho.
    ^



  10. #390

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    Quote Originally Posted by Alistair View Post
    I think it's a legitimate question to ask: Why has gun violence in America risen so much since times past, given guns were much more commonplace back then as a standard part of life (as a tool).
    Honest counter-question: have they actually?

    Perhaps there were just as many incidents, but due to the lack of rapid news-spreading (social) media and that nowadays, judging in hindsight, the lack of accurate/centralized data gathering/archiving back then, gives a false impression, i.e., that's just our perception these days.

  11. #391
    XenosisMk4's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Isyel View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by XenosisMk4 View Post
    Anyone claiming Europe doesn't have a racism problem has never heard people talk about Roma tbh, shit gets disgustingly genocidal very quickly
    Eh it has its problems too but they're different to the US ones so it's hard to wrap them up into the same arguments.

    Then again we don't lack Smarncas in Europe so we can't say how amazing and enlightened we are I guess.

    Sent from my Nexus 5X using Tapatalk
    I'd be less surprised to hear an eastern european say we should exterminate gypsies than I would be surprised to hear an american say the same about blacks

    For extra evidence: the europeans who posted after my first post (other than you, obviously)

  12. #392
    Movember 2011 RazoR's Avatar
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    also you might want to consider population numbers

  13. #393
    Alistair's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hel OWeen View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Alistair View Post
    I think it's a legitimate question to ask: Why has gun violence in America risen so much since times past, given guns were much more commonplace back then as a standard part of life (as a tool).
    Honest counter-question: have they actually?

    Perhaps there were just as many incidents, but due to the lack of rapid news-spreading (social) media and that nowadays, judging in hindsight, the lack of accurate/centralized data gathering/archiving back then, gives a false impression, i.e., that's just our perception these days.
    There is certainly more hype, more coverage, etc.

    But there is also an increase in mass shootings at places like schools. The media was no less hungry to report tragedy in the 50's and 60's than they are today, and the major networks had near 100% coverage/viewership and were trusted.

    We'd have to have a legit source (one not trying to play with the numbers and qualification, always a risk on this issue) to really know. Just looking at FBI numbers doesn't really do it.


  14. #394
    Sacul's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alistair View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Hel OWeen View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Alistair View Post
    I think it's a legitimate question to ask: Why has gun violence in America risen so much since times past, given guns were much more commonplace back then as a standard part of life (as a tool).
    Honest counter-question: have they actually?

    Perhaps there were just as many incidents, but due to the lack of rapid news-spreading (social) media and that nowadays, judging in hindsight, the lack of accurate/centralized data gathering/archiving back then, gives a false impression, i.e., that's just our perception these days.
    There is certainly more hype, more coverage, etc.

    But there is also an increase in mass shootings at places like schools. The media was no less hungry to report tragedy in the 50's and 60's than they are today, and the major networks had near 100% coverage/viewership and were trusted.

    We'd have to have a legit source (one not trying to play with the numbers and qualification, always a risk on this issue) to really know. Just looking at FBI numbers doesn't really do it.
    I disagree.
    The media wasnt as keen to report tragedy back then is what i learned in uni. One of the gripes in the 60s was actually that the media treated citizens as babies in not reporting certain things with excuses as 'might incite copy cat behaviour', 'would upset the house wife' etc. Having read some Kerouac lately this is also mentioned in literature.

    There is also a huge difference in filling the Air time of a handfull of broadcasters compared to the 100+ Channels we have now.

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  15. #395
    Lief Siddhe's Avatar
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    As an aside, the slav thing with gypsies goes in 2 categories:

    1) There are Roma people, who live "normal" lives, have businesses, families, send their kids to school etc

    2) There are "gypsies", the Roma people who live in abject poverty and deal in "shady" jobs, theft etc, marry 14 year old girls and have dozens of kids who are then used to beg in the streets

    Most slavs have no problem with the 1st group. So it's kinda more of a social/economic "hate" than racism. This is, of course, a terrible oversimplification and generalization, but I guess most Americans don't have problems with 'blacks' who go to college and shit. It's the ones who live fucked up lives that attract the most hate - and it unfortunately then encompasses the whole group.

    It's funny that same can be said for the whole "Muslim" hate - i'd wager 90% of "fekkin sandniggers" actually 'hate' the backward bunch, they don't have a problem with those who integrate into the society according to that society's norm.

    In the case of whites in the US, guess what? People usually hate on the rednecks.

    It's almost as if there's a correlation there, regardless of race/religion.

    Really makes you think.

    That's enough from me offtopic-ing dis fred

    Carry on
    I was somewhere around Old Man Star, on the edge of Essence, when drugs began to take hold.

  16. #396

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    Quote Originally Posted by Lief Siddhe View Post
    As an aside, the slav thing with gypsies goes in 2 categories:

    1) There are Roma people, who live "normal" lives, have businesses, families, send their kids to school etc

    2) There are "gypsies", the Roma people who live in abject poverty and deal in "shady" jobs, theft etc, marry 14 year old girls and have dozens of kids who are then used to beg in the streets

    Most slavs have no problem with the 1st group. So it's kinda more of a social/economic "hate" than racism. This is, of course, a terrible oversimplification and generalization, but I guess most Americans don't have problems with 'blacks' who go to college and shit. It's the ones who live fucked up lives that attract the most hate - and it unfortunately then encompasses the whole group.

    It's funny that same can be said for the whole "Muslim" hate - i'd wager 90% of "fekkin sandniggers" actually 'hate' the backward bunch, they don't have a problem with those who integrate into the society according to that society's norm.

    In the case of whites in the US, guess what? People usually hate on the rednecks.

    It's almost as if there's a correlation there, regardless of race/religion.

    Really makes you think.

    That's enough from me offtopic-ing dis fred

    Carry on

  17. #397
    Lana Torrin's Avatar
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    So have americans had the discussion about why guns are actually needed in a modern society?
    Quote Originally Posted by lubica
    And her name was Limul Azgoden, a lowly peasant girl.

  18. #398
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lana Torrin View Post
    So have americans had the discussion about why guns are actually needed in a modern society?
    Because the cops have them.

  19. #399
    Joe Appleby's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lana Torrin View Post
    So have americans had the discussion about why guns are actually needed in a modern society?
    Sports and hunting?

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  20. #400

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    Quote Originally Posted by Joe Appleby View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Lana Torrin View Post
    So have americans had the discussion about why guns are actually needed in a modern society?
    Sports and hunting?

    Tapapapatalk
    He asked for needed. Gun sports are very much not on the needed list and for the rest, it's not pistols and such.

    So try again.

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