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Thread: Martial Arts win thread.

  1. #21
    Donor Blutreiter's Avatar
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    Welp. 4 years of Judo, 1 year military close combat training and 3 years of Muay-Thai (which included extremely brutal stretching routines and also harder warm up exercises than back in the military) and currently doing historical fencing (which also uses grappling, takedowns and other shit) and what I seriously can recommend after all this time...

    ...screw flashy moves. If you seriously want to punch someone out, get yourself a wooden board, but a little bit of leather on it and start punching it. Every day, 400 with your left arm, 400 with your right arm.

    The reason is, it needs to feel natural to hit something and you need to be able to throw a punch without thinking about it. Fast and hard. It doesnt really matter how cool it looks, as long as it connects.

    Kicks are a complete pandoras box. There are people who can kick and there are people who suck. Those who suck simply are too slow and want to kick too high. Kicking leaves a MASSIVE window for countering, if you are aggressive enough. I limit my own kicks to low kicks and knees, because they are harder to see and connect better and do not throw me off-balance so easily. You can start kicking heads when your opponent is lying on the ground if you want.

    Example, I was training against a Karate instructor during my military time and he tried to kick me in the chest. I simply charged him and crashed into him, throwing him on his back and proceeded to sit on his shoulders with my knees. From there I could have pummeled him all day long if I wanted to.

    Worst fight I have been in was against a guy trained as a boxer and street fighting. I couldnt touch him at all, he was simply blocking everything and then took me out with a single fierce hook to my kidney. Wasnt able to fucking breathe for minutes. Never ever underestimate boxing as a martial arts. It is not flashy, but it focuses exactly on the right stuff from the get go - it prepares you for fighting. You throw punches with your full power, you block, you take punishment and learn to keep standing. Most other martial arts pull their punches.

    I make a difference between martial arts as sport and martial arts for fighting.

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  2. #22
    Quarantine's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Blutreiter View Post
    Worst fight I have been in was against a guy trained as a boxer and street fighting. I couldnt touch him at all, he was simply blocking everything and then took me out with a single fierce hook to my kidney. Wasnt able to fucking breathe for minutes. Never ever underestimate boxing as a martial arts. It is not flashy, but it focuses exactly on the right stuff from the get go - it prepares you for fighting. You throw punches with your full power, you block, you take punishment and learn to keep standing. Most other martial arts pull their punches.
    How did you get in that fight? Did you know beforehand he was a boxer or learned it the hard way?

  3. #23
    Donor Blutreiter's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Quarantine View Post
    How did you get in that fight? Did you know beforehand he was a boxer or learned it the hard way?
    Yes, I knew beforehand. He was a friend of my brother and we were discussing martial arts. Then he told me about his street fighting training - I recall that he mentioned that the major part of it was simply to learn how to counter every single bloody style you encounter from other fighters and you were required to bring your own fighting skills to begin with.

    He told me that I could keep hitting him and hed pay me a beer if I manage to land one blow.

    Damn that was a painful lesson. We still had beer though.

    Quote Originally Posted by James Lyrus
    they send you a pedometer, and set you daily activity targets
    Quote Originally Posted by Malcanis View Post
    There's no fucking way I'm googling '12" Hero'

  4. #24

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    Quote Originally Posted by chadsexington View Post
    How was the stretching routine in your opinion? I've done some karate stretching routines, but I found they lacked the intensity and variation of the tkd routines I did. I've done several different arts/styles, some formal, others not, but tkd by far gave me the best all around stretching, as well as the most diverse kicking techniques.
    Well, I don't have much of a basis for comparison to other styles/arts since I've not tried them. However, kyokushin doesn't have any specific stretching routines; AFAIK, it's just whatever the instructor chooses. The stuff I did seemed pretty effective.

    As for diverse kicking techniques, IME it's overrated; you're generally better off having two or three really solid attacks that you've thrown hundreds of thousands of times than you are with having practised thirty or fourty different strikes, most of which you'll never use other than for showing off. Low roundhouse kick, straight punch, and good knees and elbows for when things get close.

  5. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tsubutai View Post
    AFAIK, it's just whatever the instructor chooses. The stuff I did seemed pretty effective.
    The teacher is so much more important that the style, especialy is you don't take it all the way. The basics are just fighting mentality and fitness, it takes years of training for the style to matter much.

    If your teacher dosn't tell you to a) not get in a fight b) run away c) kick'em in the nuts the see b), as the basics their probaly wasting your time.

    (edit: this isn't true in a real long term relationship with a style, where you do years of meditation, streaching and finding your chi (or whatever) before doing anything martial. But that wouldn't be happening in a westen style of training)
    Last edited by Tiny; July 6 2011 at 04:19:32 AM.

  6. #26
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    I did capoeira for a little bit and some BJJ, I had tons of fun with both. For flexibility I did mostly yoga. including Bikram (hot) Yoga and whatever stretching we did at the capoeira classes. I also have a basic stretching routine after weightlifting.

    If you want to work mostly at home, I'm pretty sure there are DVDs with yoga routines/flexibility routines. I used that method when practicing at home for tribal bellydancing.

  7. #27
    Poem's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tiny View Post
    The teacher is so much more important that the style, especialy is you don't take it all the way. The basics are just fighting mentality and fitness, it takes years of training for the style to matter much.

    If your teacher dosn't tell you to a) not get in a fight b) run away c) kick'em in the nuts the see b), as the basics their probaly wasting your time.

    (edit: this isn't true in a real long term relationship with a style, where you do years of meditation, streaching and finding your chi (or whatever) before doing anything martial. But that wouldn't be happening in a westen style of training)
    Pretty much this. As I said in my reply to OP, until i've put a good five years of daily training down i'm not even considering it as learning to fight. I'm lucky I have a very good teacher, but a result of this is I know how much detail in every movement has to be refined until it comes correct without thinking. You really need that foundation to do a martial art at a high level. This mindset might be because my school is pretty traditional though. We learn very slowly and thoroughly. TL;DR if I wanted to learn to fight i'd take boxing, the emphasis is i'm learning a martial *art*, which takes time.


    Also fuck horse stance.

  8. #28
    Donor Blutreiter's Avatar
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    Boxing is as much a martial art as all that eastern stuff.

    Quote Originally Posted by James Lyrus
    they send you a pedometer, and set you daily activity targets
    Quote Originally Posted by Malcanis View Post
    There's no fucking way I'm googling '12" Hero'

  9. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by chadsexington View Post
    Ignoring the trolls (and thanking them so I didnt have to), try yoga. It will shoot your flexibility up very high, very fast.

    Another method would be to go find a competitive Tae Kwon Do guy and get him to show you his stretching routine - beware you may damage your joints if the stretches are particularly dangerous.
    Confirming this, I did Tae Kwon Do some years ago. I got my black belt and quit and little while later. I never appreciated how flexible it had made me until a couple years later when I would be doing stretches before basketball, and remembering how stretches that are now super hard for me used to be super easy.

  10. #30
    I do Wado Ryu Karate and some BJJ. I started the karate as an 8 year old and have kept it going for the last 23 years as a method of relaxation and training. I took up BJJ as I got really in to MMA and decided I could do that too. It turns out I really couldn’t as I sparred with a few guys, and even one that made it on to a series called TUF. He essentially taught me a difference in being a fighter, and being a martial artist.
    As for the OP, what everyone has said about yoga is spot on. I am a bit of a fat lad now as I love a beer, but yoga keeps me incredibly supple and is another good form of stress relief.

  11. #31

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    Quote Originally Posted by Blutreiter View Post
    The reason is, it needs to feel natural to hit something and you need to be able to throw a punch without thinking about it. Fast and hard. It doesnt really matter how cool it looks, as long as it connects.
    You can't stress this enough. No matter how many hours upon hours you practice in any martial arts, in a real fight 99% of all people will simply not be able to hurt anyone. All of us have been trained so long that hurting someone else is bad, it takes a hell of a lot of pain to get that out of us again. And in a real fight, any moment of hesitation will mean you lose. Any street thug with no training at all but harsh experience and sheer brutality will wipe the floor with anyone coming out a dojo, no matter how long that guy practiced.

    I used to play (american style) football in university, and for all my strength, there was one guy that I could never block. He wasn't particularly big or powerful, his technique wasn't perfect, but unlike me, when the ball moved, he was going no-holds-barred, pure ferocity without thinking. I was never able to get into that mindset (and to be honest, I don't know if I would want to), and so he beat me every time.

    As for helping the OP, Yoga in my experience is the way to go. Not only will it train you flexibility, but also every imaginable part of your muscles. The only thing that I needed to take care of is that I balance it with sometihing else, since it's more focused on endurance and you lose a bit on the quickness aspect.

  12. #32
    NoirAvlaa's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Solon View Post
    As for helping the OP, Yoga in my experience is the way to go. Not only will it train you flexibility, but also every imaginable part of your muscles. The only thing that I needed to take care of is that I balance it with sometihing else, since it's more focused on endurance and you lose a bit on the quickness aspect.
    Yeah, was thinking of balancing it out with stuff from this guy - http://idoportal.blogspot.com/2009/0...g-workout.html - He's got a lot of workouts that work up from beginner level to help with explosive power in a lot of areas of the body. They may look a bit odd, but looking at his background, qualifications and what he can do I think they're exactly the kind of thing I'm after. Either that or I'll just start BJJ or something as well.

  13. #33
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    Been doing Keysi/KFM for almost 2 years now.

    One thing I quickly realized... One thing is training on punching, kicking, elbows etc. Trying to do that shit under pressure with 2 to 3 guys punching you, and trying to take you to the floor is a whole other world. Specially when you do it under controlled environment and then imagine if someone had gone 100% to try kick your nuts in.


    "Everything works, nothing works"

  14. #34

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    Just to add some perspective, as several posters have allready said - it's about the fighter first and foremost. There were some awesum capoeira fighter back in the vale tudo days kicking ass. Saying that under the right circumstance capoeira doesn't work is just uneducated. All styles work if you train properly, a style is just a framewok of exercises and technique, whichever suits you the best is a personal flavour.

    I also concur with the sentiment 99% of dojo people will get killed by a thug. Thats pretty much up to your predisposition though. Any style where you get hit hard and hit hard right back is good for fighting. Any style which promotes this will make you more prepared, any which dont will fail. It's as simple as that. Boxing is one of the best styles to train, as is wrestling, just because you learn how to take and give punishment. On the other hand all styles CAN be this under the right tutelage.

    I trained krav maga, and it gave way less than training MMA due to the restrictions WE had in training. There's an old adage saing "Train how you want to compete" thats pretty much says it all. You get hit by mean guys and hit them back, you get better at fighting mean guys. You prance around doing whatever feels cool, I'm sure you think you look cool doing it.

    It all depends on what you want to get from MA. Stretching is something that is widely debated in the MA-community. Some say yoga etc fucks up your joints, some swear by it. My experience is that all forms of training and disciplines are full of shit. You can pretty much only condition your body to a few thing, these are: muscle strength, endurance and cardio. You can use them by motor control, flexibility and technique. Just apply what you want to achieve and maximize those factors that are important to you.

    To punch hard you need strength (muscles) and coordination (technique) its really that simple. Problem is training all at once, which is where training difers.

    I personally like no-gi grappling and muay thai, cause as pure sports go they instill pretty good muscle memory and technique which are easily converted to applicable force.

    Cheers

  15. #35

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    Did some Judo wayyy back, learned some rough street fighting wayyy back. Did a krav maga test lesson a while ago. Love it and starting a course in September when i have more time.
    Schopenhauer:

    All truth passes through three stages.
    First, it is ridiculed.
    Second, it is violently opposed.
    Third, it is accepted as being self-evident..

  16. #36

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    Quote Originally Posted by RazoR View Post
    Cancer isn't contagious.
    Do you have to let them know?

  17. #37
    kalisti's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sacul View Post
    Did a krav maga
    why isnt it called jew-fu or jewdo

  18. #38
    Zavior's Avatar
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    bjj and mma are nice and complement each other, win-win

  19. #39
    Daneel Trevize's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kalisti View Post
    why isnt it called jew-fu or jewdo
    Or just Kick them in the balls then don't stop hitting the back of their head!

  20. #40
    Donor Sponk's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by NoirAvlaa View Post
    Would like to know how many other people do martial arts here though, especially the Chinese ones(For some reason I always enjoy seeing Chinese martial arts over most others)
    I do Hung Gar Kung Fu. It's great for people with slow-twitch muscles, unlike Wing Chun.
    Contract stuff to Seraphina Amaranth.

    "You give me the awful impression - I hate to have to say - of someone who hasn't read any of the arguments against your position. Ever."


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