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Thread: Things for the CSM to keep in mind going to Iceland.

  1. #1
    Synapse's Avatar
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    Things for the CSM to keep in mind going to Iceland.

    I realized I had a few small points I wanted to send to CSM members as food for thought. I thought others might as well, so I made a thread so CSM members can read it in one convenient place.

    1) Remember that an apology and a promise of no MT for game-affecting items is at best putting us back where we were 2 weeks ago, where we had such a promise. A bit worse than that actually, since there's a recent history of broken promises now. Another promise isn't really progress, so don't be impressed simply by a return of status quo from before, that didn't work clearly. Demand real progress on promises so that they must be publicly stated and publicly kept.

    2) You guys are right on so far about where CCP has fucked up. I've read your blogs and I suggest no changes in your thoughts there.

    3) CCP not consulting you guys on MT when it was in people's minds was a bad move. Find out why they didn't and ask for structural changes to avoid that. I have no answer for making them not ignore you, but it sucked to have you as surpised as everyone else.

  2. #2
    Al Simmons's Avatar
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    Re: Things for the CSM to keep in mind going to Iceland.

    Quote Originally Posted by Rita Mae Brown
    Insanity is doing the same thing over and over again but expecting different results.
    Something to keep in mind.

  3. #3
    Lana Torrin's Avatar
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    Re: Things for the CSM to keep in mind going to Iceland.

    [youtube:388rjeut]RFZrzg62Zj0[/youtube:388rjeut]
    Quote Originally Posted by lubica
    And her name was Limul Azgoden, a lowly peasant girl.

  4. #4
    Orimei's Avatar
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    Re: Things for the CSM to keep in mind going to Iceland.

    [youtube:4gurbov2]4eYSpIz2FjU[/youtube:4gurbov2]
    When you lower your facial skin flaps, your eyes stare unblinkingly at the inside of your own fleshy head. Hair sprouts from each flap's edge.

  5. #5

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    Re: Things for the CSM to keep in mind going to Iceland.

    There should be an organized, and well constructed list of topics for the CSM to force CCP into discussing. The topics don't really end at non-vanity microtransactions at this point, though that's obviously at least 80% of the problem right now.

  6. #6

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    Re: Things for the CSM to keep in mind going to Iceland.

    Another thing to keep in mind: Even before CQ hit and shit everyone's game up, the gameplay was pretty shit with lolsupercaponline and shit game balance and WHAT THE FUCK corp UI and WHAT THE FUCK POS ui and ... oh my god. They want to equate this steaming pile of mother fucking shit with a god damn set of premium mother fucking pants on their mother fucking stupid retarded fucking heads? FUCK THEM.

  7. #7
    Cerbus's Avatar
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    Re: Things for the CSM to keep in mind going to Iceland.

    edit. :P

  8. #8
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    Re: Things for the CSM to keep in mind going to Iceland.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lusulpher
    I'm only returning to EvE in 6-8 months if:

    -Gallente are boosted to be comparable to other races.[countless players did analysis already]

    -Minmatar/Amarr guns are looked at on external racial ships/mid-long ranges.

    -STOP redesigning ships and not having instation HQ textures sets. Redo the Scorpion. Give Nagalfar it's missing turret.

    -1/3 of the "low-hanging fruit" list must be delivered.

    -Release all Trinity graphics upgrades to effects/nebulae/UI.

    -Promise to cancel the subscription and MT models for WoD/Dust. One, or the other.[I prefer MT]

    -Promote Lead of Team BFF and Gridlock to positions of power. Have them talk with CSM the most.

    -Promise no game-changers in EvE.


    Deliver my demands. They are most fair, and CCP seems to be out of content to :deliver:...[InCloset[TM] had no minigame...or hangar view option] Such are the "Realities of EvE".

    You can remove tier system from ships later. If my demands are not met at a satisfactory pace, I will begin a campaign of 'education' about your terrible, bug-ridden, blackbox-of-theft until you return to the frigid Hel[fix that boat ] from which you spawned.
    I am formidably patient and I wish to fly in your sandbox and pay your bills again.

    P.S. Tanks is fun! Need good FCs desperately!

    Yours Sincerely,
    Compromised Customer Person
    "Nobody tries penis..." - sister on topic of "bisexuals".
    "Your friends list is empty."-all forums



    Do not forget to niggrep...

  9. #9
    Lana Torrin's Avatar
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    Re: Things for the CSM to keep in mind going to Iceland.

    You need to get the CCP management to watch this.

    [youtube:uhp2sih6]68vv1sIyaMs[/youtube:uhp2sih6]
    Quote Originally Posted by lubica
    And her name was Limul Azgoden, a lowly peasant girl.

  10. #10

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    Re: Things for the CSM to keep in mind going to Iceland.

    Quote Originally Posted by Liang
    Another thing to keep in mind: Even before CQ hit and shit everyone's game up, the gameplay was pretty shit with lolsupercaponline and shit game balance and WHAT THE FUCK corp UI and WHAT THE FUCK POS ui and ... oh my god. They want to equate this steaming pile of mother fucking shit with a god damn set of premium mother fucking pants on their mother fucking stupid retarded fucking heads? FUCK THEM.
    Right. The microtransactions are but one of many issues. We have CQs melting computers, pictures of doors, ridiculous prices for vanity MTs for [strike:1cx4rc6g]the idiots[/strike:1cx4rc6g] those who plan to use them, languishing features, horrible balance, and more empty Incarna "content" on the way instead of the real Incarna we were promised. These are all huge issues, that each deserve threadnaughts.

  11. #11

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    Re: Things for the CSM to keep in mind going to Iceland.

    if you cant afford them then dont buy them. i'm not going to imagine that every single mt item will be in the price range of every unemployed college student. so long as it doesnt even give 1 stat point of anything, there is zero pressure to buy it.

    more things for the csm to remember:

    go to nonni's because it is really good, and get the bacon nonni's

    also shout at ccp for giving you like a week's notice. you and all the other self/un-employed csm's that managed to make it haha.

  12. #12
    Al Simmons's Avatar
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    Re: Things for the CSM to keep in mind going to Iceland.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lana Torrin
    You need to get the CCP management to watch this.

    [youtube:1hpbbnoo]68vv1sIyaMs[/youtube:1hpbbnoo]
    No, they should watch this:

    [youtube:1hpbbnoo]gIafaUfkLSQ[/youtube:1hpbbnoo]

    Actually, what am I saying, that will just give them ideas

  13. #13

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    Re: Things for the CSM to keep in mind going to Iceland.

    Quote Originally Posted by mazzilliu
    if you cant afford them then dont buy them. i'm not going to imagine that every single mt item will be in the price range of every unemployed college student. so long as it doesnt even give 1 stat point of anything, there is zero pressure to buy it.
    Oh, I personally don't care about the vanity MTs. I find them insulting in a sense, but I don't feel compelled to buy them. I think it's still worth bringing up briefly however.

  14. #14
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    Re: Things for the CSM to keep in mind going to Iceland.

    Quote Originally Posted by Zoidberg
    Quote Originally Posted by Liang
    Another thing to keep in mind: Even before CQ hit and shit everyone's game up, the gameplay was pretty shit with lolsupercaponline and shit game balance and WHAT THE FUCK corp UI and WHAT THE FUCK POS ui and ... oh my god. They want to equate this steaming pile of mother fucking shit with a god damn set of premium mother fucking pants on their mother fucking stupid retarded fucking heads? FUCK THEM.
    Right. The microtransactions are but one of many issues. We have CQs melting computers, pictures of doors, ridiculous prices for vanity MTs for [strike:2xc045wy]the idiots[/strike:2xc045wy] those who plan to use them, languishing features, horrible balance, and more empty Incarna "content" on the way instead of the real Incarna we were promised. These are all huge issues, that each deserve threadnaughts.
    My biggest issue with eve is performance issues, I bought a new computer recently EVE should run better right? Wrong as fuck my laptop runs CQ better than my new computer on highest settings though my laptop has heat issues which is predictable tbh. Why is that? Turning off CQ doesn't save me from said heat and performance issues. MT isn't even a game changing addition currently and not even a factor to me and yet the expansion is nothing but a pile of shit pointing me to the emergency exit. What the fuck over and out.


    CCP will need to fix a lot of things completely non-MT related before I come back. Though I am absolutely certain they are not up to the task.

  15. #15

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    Re: Things for the CSM to keep in mind going to Iceland.

    I'd like to chime in for all the CSM people reading and say that what I need before I consider coming back to EVE is a very clear, very public document about where EVE is going with regards to MT.

    If they want MT for vanity only, say so.
    If they want MT for sp, say so.
    If they want MT for BPC's, say so.
    If they want MT for instant-ships, say so.

    I think it's naive hope that CCP will back down from game-affecting MT, so perhaps it should be the focus of the CSM to make sure that none of what they are planning is hidden. I'm also thinking about how these are presented in game- I don't want bought advantages hiding in boosters, make it so that everyone reading a killmail will know that person bought an advantage.

    Ultimately no game affecting MTs would be best, but I doubt it will happen. Bonus points for getting anything at all put in the EULA so we have more than just CCPs worthless promises.

    E: this is what I need, but I think it encapsulates at least part of what most players are after too.

  16. #16

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    Re: Things for the CSM to keep in mind going to Iceland.

    My 0.01


    Quote Originally Posted by Shin_getter
    CCP have heavily misjudged its game. Did it really think that Eve sold on the basis of mass consuming PvPers? Perhaps metrics have shown this is indeed the case, but I seriously suspect it.

    PvP in eve is a very niche thing as the vast majority of players in eve are highsec carebears that survives on production. It is not even risk aversion, as one would expect massive sisi fights if people were only stopped by their fear of isk loss. The more likely explanation is that PvP combat do not appeal to all that many, with the rock, scissor, blob gameplay it is. In any case they just don't pvp even when they could sell plex or whatever and no MT shop is going to make it happen.

    Now, it is absolutely certain that no one really plays the game to PvE and shoot veld or red crosses, so that can't be it.

    So what are we left with? I'd say the vast majority of players are here to play for the stories, and a few enterprising ones are here to make epic stories of their own. While most players are not efameous community leaders that is the focal point of drama, there is an sizable number of players that play the game like a hard version of builder's game, trying to build things ranging from a output, to massive jump bridge networks, a market in nullsec that rivals empire or extend the principle of NRDS and Amarr justice to a new region.

    Its the sandbox, stupid

    Players attracted by the sandbox want to write a story and make a change to the world as an act of self expression. There is so many things that CCP could sell if they offered the world itself. Sell the Sand damn it!

    Sell unique things, not generics. Sell items that promote individuality, not universals. It is much better to sell a $70 right to upload a unique monocle just for you (hardcore players will figure it out) then a $70 generic one. It is better to auction limited, unique ships in finite numbers to collectors then change the baseline general purpose ship.

    Now, I haven't thought out these ideas completely, but why can't you auction rights to move capitals to highsec (usual limits apply)? Why can't you sell permanent colored billboards that can be anchored and combined to form a vivid image in space? (allow them to be shot, and GM enforcements on lag inducing ops apply) Perhaps even the very topology of the game itself, the names of systems or the connection between gates or the services provided by NPCs can be sold.

    Why, why can they only imagine their game being a niche variant of a flight sim combined with a terrible version of naval sim, in space, with avatar enable chat room being the future and just asking to spend massive amounts of money for generic boring items that do nothing. If there is something to sell to the hardcore space rich, it is a unique personal story unlike anyone else in the universe, and they are willing to pay plex and manhours to make it happen.

    Instead, CCP want to kill that group and make it a generic pvp game where everyone does the same thing. That is just the worst vision possible.

  17. #17

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    Re: Things for the CSM to keep in mind going to Iceland.

    [quote=Shin_getter]My 0.01


    Quote Originally Posted by "Shin_getter":3ho9p1vj
    Why, why can they only imagine their game being a niche variant of a flight sim combined with a terrible version of naval sim, in space, with avatar enable chat room being the future and just asking to spend massive amounts of money for generic boring items that do nothing. If there is something to sell to the hardcore space rich, it is a unique personal story unlike anyone else in the universe, and they are willing to pay plex and manhours to make it happen.

    Instead, CCP want to kill that group and make it a generic pvp game where everyone does the same thing. That is just the worst vision possible.
    [/quote:3ho9p1vj]

    This. Way better than my MT demands post.

  18. #18
    Donor Sponk's Avatar
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    Re: Things for the CSM to keep in mind going to Iceland.

    I suspect there's a sizeable contingent in CCP that regrets not charging real money for BPOs...
    Contract stuff to Seraphina Amaranth.

    "You give me the awful impression - I hate to have to say - of someone who hasn't read any of the arguments against your position. Ever."


  19. #19
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    Re: Things for the CSM to keep in mind going to Iceland.

    CCP is going to try everything they can possibly think of to get them on board with MT for non-vanity items. I just hope they don't cave.

    They again, I would laugh my ass off if they came back, new monicles on their avatar and CCP saying that the CSM said it was good to introduce MT for non-vanity stuff.

    Kinda wish Mazz was going, I always enjoyed her version of the joke that these meetings are.

  20. #20

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    Re: Things for the CSM to keep in mind going to Iceland.

    Quote Originally Posted by Marlona Sky
    CCP is going to try everything they can possibly think of to get them on board with MT for non-vanity items. I just hope they don't cave.

    They again, I would laugh my ass off if they came back, new monicles on their avatar and CCP saying that the CSM said it was good to introduce MT for non-vanity stuff.

    Kinda wish Mazz was going, I always enjoyed her version of the joke that these meetings are.
    i dont really have the time/patience for csm stuff, that's why i didn't run. i finally got a real job and theres no chance in hell i'm going to tell my boss that i need to take time off for a video game.

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