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Thread: The Automation Spiral (obligatory loleconomics thread v2)

  1. #1301
    Donor Spaztick's Avatar
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    Cult stock has negative connotations. We prefer the term "speculated as high value."

    Also for the dumb and uninitiated: the current trend on the dow jones (for amerifats) is following almost the exact same pattern as the 1929 crash. The S&P is actually valued pretty close (in nominal dollars) to the 1929 dow jones. If the trend continues on point we're in the middle of the dead cat bounce. You can still buy and hold for a bit, stocks should still go up for a few months until another small crash, and then we get to start WWIII and make this country and the stock market truly great again.
    Last edited by Spaztick; April 7 2020 at 06:19:50 AM.

  2. #1302
    Donor Shiodome's Avatar
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    you'd be more analogous to Britain in the last great depression wouldn't you? These massive depressions are where the old empires finally die and a new power takes the reigns. So long America, it was fun/weird while it lasted.

  3. #1303
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    Labour movements usually come out quite strong when the worst of the crisis is over and things start looking up. So at least that gives us something to work towards and look forward to.
    Look, the wages you withheld from the workmen who mowed your fields are crying out against you. The cries of the harvesters have reached the ears of the Lord of Hosts. You have lived on earth in luxury and self-indulgence. You have fattened yourselves for slaughter.

  4. #1304
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    Lol Saudis bought a massive stake in Carnival cruises. That explains part of the stock bump Nerdstern.

    Now the question is how much do you trust the financial nous of the Saudis? The same Saudis who poured all their oil money into wework via the Vision Fund.
    Look, the wages you withheld from the workmen who mowed your fields are crying out against you. The cries of the harvesters have reached the ears of the Lord of Hosts. You have lived on earth in luxury and self-indulgence. You have fattened yourselves for slaughter.

  5. #1305
    GeromeDoutrande's Avatar
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    [...]Carnival still somehow carries an investment-grade credit rating and yet it had to offer investors an annual coupon of 11.5 per cent to borrow for just three years. As the bonds were sold at a slight discount, the yield investors make is closer to 12 per cent — a rate more normally associated with companies in the lowest reaches of the junk bond market. If that is not enough, investors could get back more than the money they invested. If Carnival wants to retire the bonds before 2023, the company has to pay a substantial premium to investors. Given that it is paying a massive annual interest bill of more than $450m on these new bonds, if the cruise ship industry returns to any semblance of normality within the next year, the chances of an early repayment seem high.

    But what if it all goes wrong? Carnival assuaged investors’ concerns by offering them a lot of collateral: the $4bn in bonds are secured on $28bn worth of ships and other assets such as intellectual property. The value of these boats would be questionable if the cruise industry were to collapse entirely. But investors can still mark down their value severely and potentially get their money back, as bondholders share this collateral with less than $500m of other debt. Carnival had so much freedom to pledge its assets because its investment-grade rating meant it was previously able to borrow freely on an unsecured basis. The new bonds would rank ahead of $16bn of the company’s existing debt in a bankruptcy. [...]
    - https://www.ft.com/content/d85cf0bc-...3-b32eb9c598f9, my emphasis

    Has almost nothing to do with what Monsieur Nordstern was proposing in terms of short term trading, just mentioning it apropos Carnival

  6. #1306
    Keckers's Avatar
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    Looks like they're essentially buying the cruise ships then.

    More generally though, this market is insane. Mass graves in public parks are being dug in NY and the market is up?!
    Look, the wages you withheld from the workmen who mowed your fields are crying out against you. The cries of the harvesters have reached the ears of the Lord of Hosts. You have lived on earth in luxury and self-indulgence. You have fattened yourselves for slaughter.

  7. #1307
    GeromeDoutrande's Avatar
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    At about 20% of their book value

  8. #1308
    Donor Spaztick's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Keckers View Post
    Looks like they're essentially buying the cruise ships then.

    More generally though, this market is insane. Mass graves in public parks are being dug in NY and the market is up?!
    there is only one rule in this world, and that's stonks go up.

    piling bodies in the street?
    stonks go up.
    oil prices crashing and trade wars going on?
    stonks up.
    largest bout of unemployment in the history of mankind?
    stonks.


  9. #1309
    VARRAKK's Avatar
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    It's starting to turn now in Europe, might be prime time for some stock purchases here.
    Why is it called earth, when it is mostly water???

  10. #1310
    Donor Spaztick's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by VARRAKK View Post
    It's starting to turn now in Europe, might be prime time for some stock purchases here.
    was tempted to hedge my bets and buy carnival on the london exchange. crown's not gonna let that go tits up even if it does in the states.

  11. #1311
    GeromeDoutrande's Avatar
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    Yea it would

  12. #1312
    Movember 2011Movember 2012 Nordstern's Avatar
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    Boeing is the company that will never go tits up, no matter what happens.
    "Holy shit, I ask you to stop being autistic and you debate what autistic is." - spasm
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    WTF I hate white people now...
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  13. #1313

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    Quote Originally Posted by Nordstern View Post
    Boeing is the company that will never go tits up, no matter what happens.
    I'm pretty sure someone said that out loud at a board meeting and they all decided to take it as a challenge.
    Quarantined and loving life.

  14. #1314
    Lachesis VII's Avatar
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    Back on topic:

    https://www.cnn.com/2020/04/07/busin...ion/index.html

    How many of the jobs lost in this recession will be given to robots?

  15. #1315
    Donor Spaztick's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lachesis VII View Post
    Back on topic:

    https://www.cnn.com/2020/04/07/busin...ion/index.html

    How many of the jobs lost in this recession will be given to robots?
    We're probably going to see the big push into robotics and remote work than what we had before. It was coming, but maybe it got pushed ahead a few more years because of the pandemic. I know some fast food places were testing out automated cashiers and such with one guy working as the manager and tech as the whole thing ran though its automation.

  16. #1316

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    Quote Originally Posted by Spaztick View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Lachesis VII View Post
    Back on topic:

    https://www.cnn.com/2020/04/07/busin...ion/index.html

    How many of the jobs lost in this recession will be given to robots?
    We're probably going to see the big push into robotics and remote work than what we had before. It was coming, but maybe it got pushed ahead a few more years because of the pandemic. I know some fast food places were testing out automated cashiers and such with one guy working as the manager and tech as the whole thing ran though its automation.
    Have you been to mcdonalds lately?

    I cant even remember the last time I used the cashier at that fine establishment.

  17. #1317

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    Quote Originally Posted by Equium Duo View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Spaztick View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Lachesis VII View Post
    Back on topic:

    https://www.cnn.com/2020/04/07/busin...ion/index.html

    How many of the jobs lost in this recession will be given to robots?
    We're probably going to see the big push into robotics and remote work than what we had before. It was coming, but maybe it got pushed ahead a few more years because of the pandemic. I know some fast food places were testing out automated cashiers and such with one guy working as the manager and tech as the whole thing ran though its automation.
    Have you been to mcdonalds lately?

    I cant even remember the last time I used the cashier at that fine establishment.
    Those burgers dont make themself tho. Need kitchen staff.
    Schopenhauer:

    All truth passes through three stages.
    First, it is ridiculed.
    Second, it is violently opposed.
    Third, it is accepted as being self-evident..

  18. #1318
    Donor erichkknaar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sacul View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Equium Duo View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Spaztick View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Lachesis VII View Post
    Back on topic:

    https://www.cnn.com/2020/04/07/busin...ion/index.html

    How many of the jobs lost in this recession will be given to robots?
    We're probably going to see the big push into robotics and remote work than what we had before. It was coming, but maybe it got pushed ahead a few more years because of the pandemic. I know some fast food places were testing out automated cashiers and such with one guy working as the manager and tech as the whole thing ran though its automation.
    Have you been to mcdonalds lately?

    I cant even remember the last time I used the cashier at that fine establishment.
    Those burgers dont make themself tho. Need kitchen staff.
    Only until the BurgerFlipper9000 is introduced at next years CES.
    meh

  19. #1319
    Movember 2011Movember 2012 Nordstern's Avatar
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    Niels Jensen, the founder and chief investment officer of London-based investment adviser Absolute Return Partners, said in a monthly letter to investors that wealth has been running too far ahead of the underlying economy for some time.

    In the fourth quarter, household net worth to gross domestic product was a record 545%. “If you have followed my writings for a while, you’ll be aware that total wealth in society cannot grow faster than nominal GDP over the long term, and that every country has a well-defined mean value in terms of the wealth-to-GDP ratio. In the U.S., that mean value is 380%. In other words, when the actual wealth-to-GDP ratio deviates too much from 380%, you know that the ratio will mean revert at some point. You just don’t know when,” he said.

    Property and equities are the two asset classes most exposed to a decline in wealth, he said.

    Jensen acknowledged that you can’t just sit out a bubble. “One lesson I learned in the late 1980s, when Japanese equities were defying all logic for years, was the need to participate in the rally regardless, even if valuations were ridiculous. Clients demanded it, and the boss expected it,” he said. But he says it was “suicidal” not to protect for the downside via put options for when the wheels eventually come off.
    https://www.marketwatch.com/story/wh...of2&yptr=yahoo

    Quote Originally Posted by erichkknaar View Post
    Only until the BurgerFlipper9000 is introduced at next years CES.
    I remember McDonald's using robots to make fries back in the 90s. Can't find any info about it, though.
    "Holy shit, I ask you to stop being autistic and you debate what autistic is." - spasm
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  20. #1320

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    Robots are more expensive than the minimum wage humans

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