DCS: World, Home of the 88th TFNS Fat Nerd Squadron, the "Fighting Quackbots"

[dpidcoe]

DHave played A10 in MP to death with a flight of 4 Hogs and 2 Blacksharks. Ran out of fun because missions become repetitive and a bit dull when you realise there's no war to win.

Wait, so would it be ok it you kept flying the same repetitive missions if a little progress indicator moved according to each time you completed or failed one?

Not trying to troll or sound snarky here, but I just don't understand the appeal of a dynamic campaign system. I'm most familiar with the campaign in CFS3, and a bit familiar with flying a very limited amount of campaign missions in falcon4. But in both of those all that the "dynamic campaign" really amounted to was the same missions over and over but with a progress indicator in the form of a front line that would move a KM or two after a few missions; at which point we'd fly the same missions all over again but from an airfield that was a few km further away than the last one.

[friznit]

Sure, even something as simple as a progress indicator would be better than nothing. But the appeal of the dynamic campaign is in the strategy and persistence - you have limited resources (both planes and bombs), and multiple options for what approach to take. Bomb all the bridges and the enemy can't advance, but neither can friendly forces. Trash their airfields and their aircraft won't take off, but will take time to repair after we've captured them. Whilst in the air I see other flights going about their business and hear the war being played out on the Guard channel. I know that they are actually doing something useful to further the campaign and have a vested interest in them succeeding - they're not just scripted AI stuck in by the mission editor to make it feel busy. Say a C17 comes under threat from enemy aircraft: that's my resupply flight coming in, so I need it to survive or for the next couple of days I'll be dropping dumb bombs instead of JDAMs.

Conversely, in the single player missions of A10, I can spend hours bombing the hell out of everything then ditch my aircraft because I cba to fly 2 hours back home - or land just for the sake of landing, not because it preserves my airframe for future missions. It may be fun, but I know it will have no impact on the next mission I do - it'll just be a case of replaying exactly the same scenario over again to the point I'm beginning to learn where the enemy targets are.

With a good bit of mission editing and some random triggers thrown in, you could probably create a decent campaign scenario of several single missions (similar to an ArmA2 'campaign'), but you can't beat a true dynamic campaign.

Incidentally, I should metion that the campaign options in BMS are significantly enhanced from the original Falcon 4 - you can now take control of the whole thing, create your own missions and move ground forces as well, so you're not reliant on the rather boring AI commander to define the missions.

[Tordin Varglund]

Tried BMS today. First impression: Holy shit this is much harder to get into than the A-10C.

Idk if its something im doing wrong but outside of the ramp start tutorial i really dont seem to get any tutorial guidance at all. All it says is " yeah lolk i want u to do this and this but fuck if im telling you how to do it".

With a bit of reading the manual and some jewtube vids i can now do ILS landings and almost start the damn thing up!

The training parts in DCS are much better, but then again its a relatively recent dedicated game as opposed to a 14 year old game thats been modded to bits.

All in all i think im gonna stick with both of them but focus on BMS because it seems like a more enjoyable game when you look past the GFX and all. I watched some MP missions on youtube from the Israeli theater and it looks awesome.
Once i get properly into it (aka most likely never) ill be up for some epic fail sorties.

Also went ahead and ordered myself a TrackIR 5 with the headset clip thingy.

[Torashuu]

All the tutorials are in the manual. There it is explained step by step. Also, they recommend playing through each tutorial section multiple times untill you can do it pretty much blind and perfectly. They aren't kidding when they say that. So much to learn doing each once you'll remember maybe half of it. I'll be happy to join you in failing once I get back home (end of august).

[friznit]

A10 is certainly more intuitive, but once you get under the skin of BMS you'll find there's fewer systems simulated so in many ways it's actually less complex than DCS. That said, you do need to figure out the radar modes, and you will rage that you can't slave SPI to the TGP (not yet anyway - to follow in the next iteration, so I'm told). But it is fun, and the graphics are forgivable considering it's a mod of a 12 year old game. Everytime I play BMS I want the loveliness of DCS, but the opposite is also true...

[Paradox]

The thing about the DCS vs BMS argument that always wins it in favour of the BMS guys is that they aren't paying for it... that's a pretty big pro.

Also is anyone looking at getting Combined Arms? it looks really shit from where I'm sitting. And costs $30

[friznit]

If money were the only object. I'm a fan of both, but more of a fan of BMS because it simply keeps dragging me back to want to further the campaign, as to DCS which is a wonderful study sim that I've studied to death and has nothing more to give (yet).

Combined Arms looks like a sideshow for what is at core, a flight sim. Nice idea, but I'm not quite sure the marketing department of Eagle Dynamics ever formulated a strategy. They appear to be meandering around in some bizarrely adjacent market segments. Introduce P51 to a modern day A10 sim, followed by ground vehicles in a flight sim, and then rely on the community to produce new jets for us.... they either have some awesome master plan which they're drip feeding to us backwards (at a cost each time, mind) or they're on crack.

[TZeer]

The P51 is actually the first in a series of old aricrafts.

Combined arms is just a small step towards something bigger I think. And anyway, the most interesting feature imo is the possibility to operate as a JTAC in multiplayer.
Regarding the DCS world and 3rd parties, it's a nice approach. More aircrafts within a shorter timespan. How the quality will be is yet to see though.

DCS World, it's been stated from DCS that they are moving towards a more dynamic campaign engine. But it will take a while. Before they will be able to pull something like that off, I think they will need to get proper support for multiple cores. As it is now it only utilize 2 cores, 1 for the sound engine and 1 for the rest...

Personally I'm gonna get combined arms cause it looks fun and a little more casual if you are fed up with flying.

Really hoping that the F-15E will be of high quality.

[Paradox]

I really like the idea of having the P-51 and other old aircraft in DCS, it's cool to see planes like that flying alongside modern aircraft even if it's more for the novelty than for an actual battlefield role. It's fun to have the P-51 in a COIN type role as it is.

I also really like the 3rd party development going on. I'm one of those that's drank the koolaid on the MiG-21, I think that's going to be awesome. F-15E... I don't know, we'll see, it's gonna be hard for them certainly.

[TZeer]

Some cool movies from DCS: A-10C

[Tordin Varglund]

Good vids. I think i have been more or less completely consumed by BMS this last week or so. Only other game i have played to any degree is DayZ and even then a lot less than BMS. Absolutely amazing sim.

Only issue i have is JDAM's. How the fuck do they work? I just cant seem to pickle them.. LGB's or Mk 82/84's? No problem.

[Ishanda]

I haven't touched BMS in a while - only been in the A10 - but don't they require you to hold down the pickle for 2-3seconds for the GPS data to be transferred to the bomb?

[Tordin Varglund]

Thing is it doesnt matter if i pickle 1 or 20 sec in advance.. No drop regardless. Its probably something obvious im doing wrong but i just cant seem to do it so i have had to resort to only using LGBs or dumb bombs, which isnt really a problem except id like to know what im doing wrong..

[CastleBravo]

Some cool movies from DCS: A-10C

Cock three, in from the south.

[friznit]

Nice A10 vids.

JDAMs aren't fully implemented in BMS 4.32 They mostly work by dropping them in CRP at wherever your TGP is pointed, but the pickle can be a bit tempremental. If they don't immediately drop, try spamming the pickle button and they should go. I have much better luck with Lesbian Gay Bombs generally. My friendly dev tells me that JDAMs have got a lot of loving in 4.33 though (along with the long awaited F18 pit update).

I've been hammering the updated Korea 2012 campaign this last week or so - busy as hell and much harder than the vanilla. It's awesome seeing Typhoons and F22's buzzing around. 46 kills for 2 losses so far in our flight, and it's only 1400 Hrs on Day 1!

[dpidcoe]

[Torashuu]

Haha, thats how it feels when I try my hand at Falcon 4 again after 3-6 months.

[TZeer]

Some pictures from ongoing 3rd party projects for DCS World

[CastleBravo]

Still waiting for DCS VF-1 Valkyrie

[friznit]

Bumping out of sheer incredulity: http://forums.eagle.ru/showthread.php?t=95295

I lost interest after getting mighty bored of flying the same missions over again, still hooked on Falcon 4 BMS though missing the beautifully hifi sim that A10 offers. But first they release a P51 mustang into a WW3 environment, and now a Huey?

WTS some fucking sense to their BD department.