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Thread: Pestilence or: How I Learned to Worry Constantly and Live with COVID

  1. #9201
    Pegging Specialist Donor indi's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jori McKie View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Lallante View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Smegs View Post
    Stay safe ladies & gents.

    Also had a mild cold on the lead up to chrimbo. All LFT's have been negative thus far (was given a couple of packets of LFT's when 5G booster was installed) but still isolated anyways, as the current varient appears to be rather tricksy. One of the housemates had his parents round for chrimbo day, so i was more than happy to camp in my shoebox room and mask up when using facilities to not get in the way of their celebration, expecting that i could emerge today like the beautiful butterfly that i am (well, more ground dwelling grub) and at least be able to shitpost. Queue housemate then saying he was going to get the other parts of his family round for a get together today. When i asked if he wouldn't mind going round theirs instead he proceeds to give me a shitload of grief about over-reacting and how he 'lives here too' .... sigh.

    I understand that due to the negative tests i might be playing overly safe, but holy shit, the population has played not very safe at all over the last couple of years and look where it has gotten us. And yes i am pretty pissed that we have yet another year where we are limited on what we can do due to general selfishness and stupidity.
    If you've got actual cold symptoms and do 2 LFTs and they both come up negative after leaving them for 30 mins, you almost certainly dont have covid and are certainly not contagious.

    Your housemate is an absolute cobbler's uncle terrence tho
    Smegs you have a really shitty housemate.


    About those test.
    I assume LFT means Covid nasal self tests or something. In that case you're in a bad surprise, they are unreliable in the early stages of covid with low virus load. The German Paul-Ehrlich-Institut tested 122 of them, 22 of them were trash. The best test was 95% correct with a medium virus load and only 20% correct with a low virus load.
    That numbers were for Delta nobody is sure how good the tests are for omicron.
    https://www.pei.de/DE/newsroom/dossi...stsysteme.html
    https://www.pei.de/SharedDocs/Downlo...ationFile&v=67
    Our government agency has tested for the Omikron question. Omikron (paper in English) is recognized just as well by the lateral flow tests as Delta: here.

    As for the lateral flow tests, the university hospital of Utrecht has conducted a study. The results: if you have symptoms, the tests work very well (90%). If you do not have any symptoms, they are only about 20% reliable. The good news is: in those cases, people probably have a low viral load - so the question is: is this really a bad surprise as you imply? You could also conclude that you are probably not (very) contagious at that point in time. Here's a link in Dutch. Preprint of the paper here.

  2. #9202
    Smegs's Avatar
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    Thanks for the pick up's guys. Unfortunately housemate can be rather machiavelian (the dark triad is strong with this one, but thats for another discussion).

    I should have put 'lateral flow test' as opposed to LFT's, but who has time for that in todays busy world? Also am feeling quite meh from cold.

    After previously sifting through the data available in the UK for the effectiveness of LFT's against the delta variant (said approx. 20% accuracy ties up well with home tests at low/medium infection levels, but the UK government bought shitloads of them so that is what we have) and lack of large scale data for omicron i decided not to take chances for the time being. Thanks for the links, will try and get them bodged into english to digest. As long as we have peer-reviewed data that can point us in the right direction of what to do, think we'll be ok.
    Shitting up eve for .... well, longer than most of you scumbags.

  3. #9203
    Jori McKie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by indi View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Jori McKie View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Lallante View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Smegs View Post
    Stay safe ladies & gents.

    Also had a mild cold on the lead up to chrimbo. All LFT's have been negative thus far (was given a couple of packets of LFT's when 5G booster was installed) but still isolated anyways, as the current varient appears to be rather tricksy. One of the housemates had his parents round for chrimbo day, so i was more than happy to camp in my shoebox room and mask up when using facilities to not get in the way of their celebration, expecting that i could emerge today like the beautiful butterfly that i am (well, more ground dwelling grub) and at least be able to shitpost. Queue housemate then saying he was going to get the other parts of his family round for a get together today. When i asked if he wouldn't mind going round theirs instead he proceeds to give me a shitload of grief about over-reacting and how he 'lives here too' .... sigh.

    I understand that due to the negative tests i might be playing overly safe, but holy shit, the population has played not very safe at all over the last couple of years and look where it has gotten us. And yes i am pretty pissed that we have yet another year where we are limited on what we can do due to general selfishness and stupidity.
    If you've got actual cold symptoms and do 2 LFTs and they both come up negative after leaving them for 30 mins, you almost certainly dont have covid and are certainly not contagious.

    Your housemate is an absolute cobbler's uncle terrence tho
    Smegs you have a really shitty housemate.


    About those test.
    I assume LFT means Covid nasal self tests or something. In that case you're in a bad surprise, they are unreliable in the early stages of covid with low virus load. The German Paul-Ehrlich-Institut tested 122 of them, 22 of them were trash. The best test was 95% correct with a medium virus load and only 20% correct with a low virus load.
    That numbers were for Delta nobody is sure how good the tests are for omicron.
    https://www.pei.de/DE/newsroom/dossi...stsysteme.html
    https://www.pei.de/SharedDocs/Downlo...ationFile&v=67
    Our government agency has tested for the Omikron question. Omikron (paper in English) is recognized just as well by the lateral flow tests as Delta: here.

    As for the lateral flow tests, the university hospital of Utrecht has conducted a study. The results: if you have symptoms, the tests work very well (90%). If you do not have any symptoms, they are only about 20% reliable. The good news is: in those cases, people probably have a low viral load - so the question is: is this really a bad surprise as you imply? You could also conclude that you are probably not (very) contagious at that point in time. Here's a link in Dutch. Preprint of the paper here.
    You're right false test at a low virus load usually means you aren't that contagious. The bad surprise is either you got a trash/not top notch test, tested negative and are highly contagious or you got a top notch test, test negative but 12h later you are highly contagious without knowing. The point is those test can give you a false sense of security, especially when you're going to visit vulnerable people.

    Self testing is important but you have to keep in mind how unreliable they can be. There is a reason why you can't visit retirement homes without a PCR test not older then 24h anymore and the UK wants a PCR test entering upon the UK.
    Does a population have informed consent when that population is not taught the inner workings of its monetary system, and then is drawn, all unknowing, into economic adventures?

  4. #9204
    Movember 2012 Zekk Pacus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Smegs View Post
    Thanks for the pick up's guys. Unfortunately housemate can be rather machiavelian (the dark triad is strong with this one, but thats for another discussion).

    I should have put 'lateral flow test' as opposed to LFT's, but who has time for that in todays busy world? Also am feeling quite meh from cold.

    After previously sifting through the data available in the UK for the effectiveness of LFT's against the delta variant (said approx. 20% accuracy ties up well with home tests at low/medium infection levels, but the UK government bought shitloads of them so that is what we have) and lack of large scale data for omicron i decided not to take chances for the time being. Thanks for the links, will try and get them bodged into english to digest. As long as we have peer-reviewed data that can point us in the right direction of what to do, think we'll be ok.
    FWIW I had cold symptoms from last Monday and my LFTs didn't start showing positive until Wednesday evening.

    My partner got symptoms on Tuesday, and her LFTs never showed positive - her infection was picked up by the RT-LAMP tests her employer carries out. We've both since had positive PCR results.

    LFTs are better than not having LFTs but they're by no means 100% accurate. If you have symptoms or you're not sure, book a PCR if you can.
    'I'm pro life. I'm a non-smoker. I'm a pro-life non-smoker. WOO, Let the party begin!'

  5. #9205

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    The Duo family is mostly on the mend, i feel a little tender in my chest but otherwise ok. Mrs Duo has been testing negative on the lateral flow now.

    Lall, did you find out what variant you got? We were told it was Delta, the hunger monster was real for us all, we have been ravenous!

  6. #9206
    Super Moderator DonorGlobal Moderator whispous's Avatar
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    Is it just me or is there a huge uptick in us all getting it?



    Quote Originally Posted by teds :D View Post
    locking again cos you're all getting weird and being autists about tyres

  7. #9207
    Movember 2012 Stoffl's Avatar
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    No it's not you, it's Omicron.

  8. #9208
    Pegging Specialist Donor indi's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jori McKie View Post

    You're right false test at a low virus load usually means you aren't that contagious. The bad surprise is either you got a trash/not top notch test, tested negative and are highly contagious or you got a top notch test, test negative but 12h later you are highly contagious without knowing. The point is those test can give you a false sense of security, especially when you're going to visit vulnerable people.

    Self testing is important but you have to keep in mind how unreliable they can be. There is a reason why you can't visit retirement homes without a PCR test not older then 24h anymore and the UK wants a PCR test entering upon the UK.
    The guideline here is: use it (just) before you go somewhere. Next time you go somewhere, you use a new self test. Just like PCR tests, past results are no guarantee for the future.

    Quote Originally Posted by whispous View Post
    Is it just me or is there a huge uptick in us all getting it?
    No, not just you. Delta was already very infectious and Omikron beats that hands down. The past months covid was around a lot of people I know firsthand (e.g.: one of their kids, neighbour, or in quarantine because at school, etc. etc.) Currently in a lockdown and the numbers are dropping steadily. Except for Amsterdam, where they sequence religiously and we can see Omikron is gaining heavily - perhaps unsurprisingly, the numbers are going up there. Despite the lockdown.

  9. #9209
    Movember '12 Best Facial Hair Movember 2012Donor Lallante's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Equium Duo View Post
    The Duo family is mostly on the mend, i feel a little tender in my chest but otherwise ok. Mrs Duo has been testing negative on the lateral flow now.

    Lall, did you find out what variant you got? We were told it was Delta, the hunger monster was real for us all, we have been ravenous!
    I havent been told. Does it say somewhere on the email notification? I'm sitll postiive on lat flows (clear second red line) on day 8 , still feeling a bit peaky.

    I have no issues with taste or smell weirdly, appetite has been normal or high. Main symptoms are occasional minor cough but not most of the time (entire days without), early stages some digestive tract issues (bloating, a bit of IBS), but most consistently - tiredness, brain fog, blocked nose and mild feverishness (without particularly elevated temp),

    Given this pattern i'd bet omicron.

  10. #9210
    מלך יהודים Zeekar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zekk Pacus View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Smegs View Post
    Thanks for the pick up's guys. Unfortunately housemate can be rather machiavelian (the dark triad is strong with this one, but thats for another discussion).

    I should have put 'lateral flow test' as opposed to LFT's, but who has time for that in todays busy world? Also am feeling quite meh from cold.

    After previously sifting through the data available in the UK for the effectiveness of LFT's against the delta variant (said approx. 20% accuracy ties up well with home tests at low/medium infection levels, but the UK government bought shitloads of them so that is what we have) and lack of large scale data for omicron i decided not to take chances for the time being. Thanks for the links, will try and get them bodged into english to digest. As long as we have peer-reviewed data that can point us in the right direction of what to do, think we'll be ok.
    FWIW I had cold symptoms from last Monday and my LFTs didn't start showing positive until Wednesday evening.

    My partner got symptoms on Tuesday, and her LFTs never showed positive - her infection was picked up by the RT-LAMP tests her employer carries out. We've both since had positive PCR results.

    LFTs are better than not having LFTs but they're by no means 100% accurate. If you have symptoms or you're not sure, book a PCR if you can.
    Truth be told i don't believe any quick test done by untrained person. Even when done by a trained professionals they are still quite shit.
    Personally i was on second day of feeling unwell, had all the symptoms of a stronger cold but tested negative for rona (test done by a nurse). My brother got it that day from me since he came for a visit (he was told everything about my "condition"). Next day i sorted out a pcr test which came back positive, since one friend with whom we hanged out a couple of days earlier got a positive pcr back in the evening (also tested negative on quick test iirc). Ive heard of several other cases like that as well.


    

  11. #9211
    Pegging Specialist Donor indi's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zeekar View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Zekk Pacus View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Smegs View Post
    Thanks for the pick up's guys. Unfortunately housemate can be rather machiavelian (the dark triad is strong with this one, but thats for another discussion).

    I should have put 'lateral flow test' as opposed to LFT's, but who has time for that in todays busy world? Also am feeling quite meh from cold.

    After previously sifting through the data available in the UK for the effectiveness of LFT's against the delta variant (said approx. 20% accuracy ties up well with home tests at low/medium infection levels, but the UK government bought shitloads of them so that is what we have) and lack of large scale data for omicron i decided not to take chances for the time being. Thanks for the links, will try and get them bodged into english to digest. As long as we have peer-reviewed data that can point us in the right direction of what to do, think we'll be ok.
    FWIW I had cold symptoms from last Monday and my LFTs didn't start showing positive until Wednesday evening.

    My partner got symptoms on Tuesday, and her LFTs never showed positive - her infection was picked up by the RT-LAMP tests her employer carries out. We've both since had positive PCR results.

    LFTs are better than not having LFTs but they're by no means 100% accurate. If you have symptoms or you're not sure, book a PCR if you can.
    Truth be told i don't believe any quick test done by untrained person. Even when done by a trained professionals they are still quite shit.
    Personally i was on second day of feeling unwell, had all the symptoms of a stronger cold but tested negative for rona (test done by a nurse). My brother got it that day from me since he came for a visit (he was told everything about my "condition"). Next day i sorted out a pcr test which came back positive, since one friend with whom we hanged out a couple of days earlier got a positive pcr back in the evening (also tested negative on quick test iirc). Ive heard of several other cases like that as well.
    I've heard from people who got reliable (positive) results from them. Mind you, there's a lot of them on the market. In the EU they must be cleared for 1) the use as a test and 2) the use as a self test (i.e. by consumers).

  12. #9212
    מלך יהודים Zeekar's Avatar
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    Yeah i wouldn't be even slightly surprised if our government took the cheapest one they could get away with and called it good. Just a bad experience when you infect a loved one because you're told its virtually impossible to get a false negative on these tests.


    

  13. #9213
    Pegging Specialist Donor indi's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zeekar View Post
    Yeah i wouldn't be even slightly surprised if our government took the cheapest one they could get away with and called it good. Just a bad experience when you infect a loved one because you're told its virtually impossible to get a false negative on these tests.


    We have to buy them ourselves (which I'm fine with). Some exceptions apply, like the ones that get sent to elementary schools.

  14. #9214
    Super Moderator DonorGlobal Moderator whispous's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stoffl View Post
    No it's not you, it's Omicron.
    @omicron show yourself here you coward



    Quote Originally Posted by teds :D View Post
    locking again cos you're all getting weird and being autists about tyres

  15. #9215

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    Quote Originally Posted by whispous View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Stoffl View Post
    No it's not you, it's Omicron.
    @omicron show yourself here you coward
    Err no, he can fck right off and stay hidden. I'll do a count to a hundred before I start searching. Honest.

  16. #9216
    Movember '12 Best Facial Hair Movember 2012Donor Lallante's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by whispous View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Stoffl View Post
    No it's not you, it's Omicron.
    @omicron show yourself here you coward
    *coughs mildly*
    Last edited by Lallante; December 27 2021 at 08:02:37 PM.

  17. #9217
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lucas Quaan View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Cosmin View Post
    It's funny it only took like 18 months to have this confusing acronym which usually meant Liver Function Tests
    One more for the list. https://acronyms.thefreedictionary.com/LFT
    There are only two in medical and I've only ever used it referring to the liver seeing I've never done paediatrics in English

  18. #9218
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    Quote Originally Posted by whispous View Post
    Is it just me or is there a huge uptick in us all getting it?
    It's odd, appears to be happening all over the world.

    On a more serious note it's a wonder I haven't gotten it yet, I've seen a LOT of COVID positive kids over the past months and a LOT of them didn't wear any masks when I examined them (for some reason they're not mandatory but I still have to check their throat and I always was double masked with cloth splash-proof on top of FFP3, but no eye protection available here).

    Edit: triple dosed, probably vaccine and protections working as intended

  19. #9219
    Super Moderator DonorGlobal Moderator whispous's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cosmin View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by whispous View Post
    Is it just me or is there a huge uptick in us all getting it?
    It's odd, appears to be happening all over the world.

    On a more serious note it's a wonder I haven't gotten it yet, I've seen a LOT of COVID positive kids over the past months and a LOT of them didn't wear any masks when I examined them (for some reason they're not mandatory but I still have to check their throat and I always was double masked with cloth splash-proof on top of FFP3, but no eye protection available here).

    Edit: triple dosed, probably vaccine and protections working as intended
    That or you don't have any symptoms!



    Quote Originally Posted by teds :D View Post
    locking again cos you're all getting weird and being autists about tyres

  20. #9220
    Movember '12 Best Facial Hair Movember 2012Donor Lallante's Avatar
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    I imagine he is required to get tested very frequently. Maybe the numptys are wrong and masks are actually pretty effective

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