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Thread: Antivirus is shit, everything is compromised, etc etc (Cybersecurity thread)

  1. #241
    Lana Torrin's Avatar
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    New place of work has a work around for av being shit.. They don't seem to run any.
    Quote Originally Posted by lubica
    And her name was Limul Azgoden, a lowly peasant girl.

  2. #242
    Donor halbarad's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lana Torrin View Post
    New place of work has a work around for av being shit.. They don't seem to run any.
    It's a bold move.

  3. #243

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    Quote Originally Posted by Daneel Trevize View Post
    Something big & bad might be brewing in CPU/hypervisor land, though not AMD's hardware (go team green, once again)
    FWIW that's because AMD's CPUs just don't do the thing that Intel's CPUs do that introduces the vulnerability. It's not that they've done it better, they just don't do it. Speculative execution of kernel-space references is one of the major reasons intel's single threaded performance has historically caned AMD's.

    But yeah this is going to be a pretty big deal. 10-30% performance hits across the board for cpu bound applications. Yay.

  4. #244
    Daneel Trevize's Avatar
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    Didn't Ryzen at least hit performance parity with Intel, before they then have to take this hit..? I want to see a lot of benchmarks redone.

    And hoping that MS (& Apple) don't do what Intel tried to for Linux, and make all x86 CPUs suffer the slow path rather than detect if it's actually an Intel chip first.
    Quote Originally Posted by QuackBot View Post
    Idk about that, and i'm fucking stupid.

  5. #245
    Movember 2011Movember 2012 Nordstern's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Daneel Trevize View Post
    Didn't Ryzen at least hit performance parity with Intel, before they then have to take this hit..? I want to see a lot of benchmarks redone.

    And hoping that MS (& Apple) don't do what Intel tried to for Linux, and make all x86 CPUs suffer the slow path rather than detect if it's actually an Intel chip first.
    How far back does this flaw go? I've got Covfefe Lake, Ivy Bridge, Sandy Bridge, Clarkdale and Merom chips lying around to test.
    "Holy shit, I ask you to stop being autistic and you debate what autistic is." - spasm
    Quote Originally Posted by Larkonis Trassler View Post
    WTF I hate white people now...

  6. #246
    מלך יהודים Zeekar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nordstern View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Daneel Trevize View Post
    Didn't Ryzen at least hit performance parity with Intel, before they then have to take this hit..? I want to see a lot of benchmarks redone.

    And hoping that MS (& Apple) don't do what Intel tried to for Linux, and make all x86 CPUs suffer the slow path rather than detect if it's actually an Intel chip first.
    How far back does this flaw go? I've got Covfefe Lake, Ivy Bridge, Sandy Bridge, Clarkdale and Merom chips lying around to test.
    1st, 2nd, 3rd, 4th, 5th, 6th, 7th, and 8th generation Intel® Core™ Processor Families
    Intel® Xeon® Processor E3-1200 v5 and v6 Product Family
    Intel® Xeon® Processor Scalable Family
    Intel® Xeon® Processor W Family
    Intel Atom® C3000 Processor Family
    Apollo Lake Intel Atom® Processor E3900 series
    Apollo Lake Intel® Pentium® Processors
    Intel® Pentium® Processor G Series
    Intel® Celeron® G, N, and J series Processors


    

  7. #247
    root's Avatar
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    Did Intel release a statement?
    Or where did you get that from?
    The Rapier is my love boat
    ~lowsec smallscale pvp 'n stuff~

  8. #248
    מלך יהודים Zeekar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by root View Post
    Did Intel release a statement?
    Or where did you get that from?
    Got it from a slovenian tech forum. trying to source it.


    

  9. #249
    Movember 2011Movember 2012 Nordstern's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zeekar View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Nordstern View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Daneel Trevize View Post
    Didn't Ryzen at least hit performance parity with Intel, before they then have to take this hit..? I want to see a lot of benchmarks redone.

    And hoping that MS (& Apple) don't do what Intel tried to for Linux, and make all x86 CPUs suffer the slow path rather than detect if it's actually an Intel chip first.
    How far back does this flaw go? I've got Covfefe Lake, Ivy Bridge, Sandy Bridge, Clarkdale and Merom chips lying around to test.
    1st, 2nd, 3rd, 4th, 5th, 6th, 7th, and 8th generation Intel® Core™ Processor Families
    Intel® Xeon® Processor E3-1200 v5 and v6 Product Family
    Intel® Xeon® Processor Scalable Family
    Intel® Xeon® Processor W Family
    Intel Atom® C3000 Processor Family
    Apollo Lake Intel Atom® Processor E3900 series
    Apollo Lake Intel® Pentium® Processors
    Intel® Pentium® Processor G Series
    Intel® Celeron® G, N, and J series Processors
    So, basically everything post-NetBurst. Wonderful.

    Is Phi affected?
    "Holy shit, I ask you to stop being autistic and you debate what autistic is." - spasm
    Quote Originally Posted by Larkonis Trassler View Post
    WTF I hate white people now...

  10. #250
    Liare's Avatar
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    GGWP

    wtf lads
    Viking, n.:
    1. Daring Scandinavian seafarers, explorers, adventurers, entrepreneurs world-famous for their aggressive, nautical import business, highly leveraged takeovers and blue eyes.
    2. Bloodthirsty sea pirates who ravaged northern Europe beginning in the 9th century.

    Hagar's note: The first definition is much preferred; the second is used only by malcontents, the envious, and disgruntled owners of waterfront property.

  11. #251
    Movember 2012 Stoffl's Avatar
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    LOLintel
    2/10/17 Greatposthellpurge never forget
    23/10/17 The Greatreposteninging ?

  12. #252
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    Intel says memory security issue extends beyond its own chips
    https://www.engadget.com/2018/01/03/...c-to-its-cpus/

  13. #253
    Daneel Trevize's Avatar
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    There's been 2 updates to that article since, 1st being AMD denying Intel's claims
    Update: AMD isn't having Intel's claims that the issue is hardware-independent. In its own statement, it asserted that architecture differences meant that there was "near zero risk" to AMD-made processors. That lines up with the initial report, which referenced communication from AMD suggesting that its processors weren't vulnerable. There's clearly a he-said-she-said dispute going on, and it may be a while before we get the full story. You can read the full statement below.
    2nd being an apparently early ending of the embargo over Meltdown and Spectre. https://meltdownattack.com/
    Quote Originally Posted by QuackBot View Post
    Idk about that, and i'm fucking stupid.

  14. #254
    Donor Aea's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stoffl View Post
    LOLintel
    AyyyMD

    Although it’s probably karma if they’re unaffected.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

  15. #255
    walrus's Avatar
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    Glad my newest processor is a Sempron and not a Celeron B)
      Spoiler:
    Quote Originally Posted by RazoR View Post
    But islamism IS a product of class warfare. Rich white countries come into developing brown dictatorships, wreck the leadership, infrastructure and economy and then act all surprised that religious fanaticism is on the rise.
    Also:
    Quote Originally Posted by Tellenta View Post
    walrus isnt a bad poster.
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    also i like walrus.
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    Yer a hoot

  16. #256
    Donor Aea's Avatar
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    Glad my newest processor is for vidya only. Plz don’t be affected too bad. Plz don’t be affected too bad.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

  17. #257
    Movember 2012 I Legionnaire's Avatar
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    https://twitter.com/i/moments/948681915485351938

    tl/dr: all cpus out there are fucked, intel's is actually the less serious one since there's a software fix for it. On the other hand the second affects ALL cpus, and is impossible to fix without tossing modern cpu design in the bin.

  18. #258
    Daneel Trevize's Avatar
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    edit: someone else's post #258 was deleted. This was mostly a response to that, which disagreed with I Leg's TL;DR, and I do too:

    Read the Project Zero papers, linked on the very public & promoted ...attack.com website(s), rather than the non-technical summary blogs, or just some NY Times journo's twitter.

    Spectre might be able to be fixed in microcode and/or OSs on loading executables (auto-insert judicious cache flushes & fences/memory barriers, yo), and for Zen it isn't tested/proven as being vulnerable, but AMD claimed it has a new, more complex speculative execution system (the concept that's being found to be flawed) so it could be at least as vulnerable as other vendors (spectre.pdf, page 12, section 8, 3rd para).
    Some of the 'possible' variations in section 6 are rather theoretical-only atm. E.g. the branchless variation where an interrupt is what combines with the mistrained branch predictor to then mistakenly access and leak a register value used as a memory address (who's lookup is cached and thus the reg value can be deduced), in otherwise unbranching code that would normally have no speculation.

    I don't have it 100% absorbed/correct, it's late and my MIPS background keeps screaming 'but we already had kernel-only address space & ASID since day1, and pipelines aren't ~200 instructions deep for RISC, and we've been working with & regretting manually managed caches & TLBs for 30 years already".

    Seriously, fuck x86.
    And fuck Intel trying to keep painting AMD with all these vulns too. Especially that CEO, on TV, after recently selling down to his minimum required shares.
    Last edited by Daneel Trevize; January 4 2018 at 12:10:12 AM.
    Quote Originally Posted by QuackBot View Post
    Idk about that, and i'm fucking stupid.

  19. #259
    Liare's Avatar
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    tbh, if this turns out to be the death-knell of x86 then it's about time.
    Viking, n.:
    1. Daring Scandinavian seafarers, explorers, adventurers, entrepreneurs world-famous for their aggressive, nautical import business, highly leveraged takeovers and blue eyes.
    2. Bloodthirsty sea pirates who ravaged northern Europe beginning in the 9th century.

    Hagar's note: The first definition is much preferred; the second is used only by malcontents, the envious, and disgruntled owners of waterfront property.

  20. #260
    Frug's Avatar
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    Nobody at my work, not even ops, is talking about this. I'm disappointed. This is a big deal.

    AWS prices gonna go up?

    Quote Originally Posted by Loire
    I'm too stupid to say anything that deserves being in your magnificent signature.

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