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Thread: USA Politics Thread

  1. #53841

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dorvil Barranis View Post
    Wait, so now it is the Dems fault Kavenaugh got appointed? Gotta explain that one to me.
    It's in relation to them being pathetic and somehow unable to strongly get behind anything and get anything done anymore.

    Quote Originally Posted by Timaios View Post
    Is this just the USA thread or general americas thread?
    I would point out the thread title.

    But in the end we talk about anything here so go right ahead. :P

  2. #53842
    Caldrion Dosto's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Timaios View Post
    Is this just the USA thread or general americas thread? Because in Brazil, a pro-military dictatorship, pro torture candidate Jair Bolsonaro is leading the polls with a staggering lead over the other candidates.

    He's promising to make Brazil great again, and return it to the times of the military dictatorship, to a “time when Brazilians could still walk on the streets without fear”. He also seems to hate everyone non-white and non-straight. His supporters said that they need "a leader with energy and fight – like British prime minister Theresa May"

    First results should be up in an hour or so. You need 50% of the votes to win on the first round, or a second round will follow with two candidates who got most votes on the first round.
    It kinda helps him that he put the leading candidate in jail and barred him from running in the election...

  3. #53843

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    Quote Originally Posted by Isyel View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Dorvil Barranis View Post
    Wait, so now it is the Dems fault Kavenaugh got appointed? Gotta explain that one to me.
    It's in relation to them being pathetic and somehow unable to strongly get behind anything and get anything done anymore.
    Or a more reasonable mind might consider that some continue to play by the spirit of the rules, and others have gone full got mine fuck you mode.

  4. #53844
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    Quote Originally Posted by Caldrion Dosto View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Timaios View Post
    Is this just the USA thread or general americas thread? Because in Brazil, a pro-military dictatorship, pro torture candidate Jair Bolsonaro is leading the polls with a staggering lead over the other candidates.

    He's promising to make Brazil great again, and return it to the times of the military dictatorship, to a “time when Brazilians could still walk on the streets without fear”. He also seems to hate everyone non-white and non-straight. His supporters said that they need "a leader with energy and fight – like British prime minister Theresa May"

    First results should be up in an hour or so. You need 50% of the votes to win on the first round, or a second round will follow with two candidates who got most votes on the first round.
    It kinda helps him that he put the leading candidate in jail and barred him from running in the election...
    Not really him, it was the Brazilian political establishment that did it. They are now surprised that other people are choosing to wipe their asses with democratic norms

  5. #53845
    Movember 2011Movember 2012 Nordstern's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Timaios View Post
    First results should be up in an hour or so. You need 50% of the votes to win on the first round, or a second round will follow with two candidates who got most votes on the first round.
    Polling stations opened at 8 a.m. (1100 GMT) and the last will close at 7 p.m. Brasilia time (2200 GMT). Exit polls and official results will start flowing in soon after that via Brazil’s electronic voting system.
    "Holy shit, I ask you to stop being autistic and you debate what autistic is." - spasm
    Quote Originally Posted by Larkonis Trassler View Post
    WTF I hate white people now...

  6. #53846
    Movember 2011 RazoR's Avatar
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    Wait, white brazilians?

  7. #53847
    Malcanis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Timaios View Post
    Is this just the USA thread or general americas thread? Because in Brazil, a pro-military dictatorship, pro torture candidate Jair Bolsonaro is leading the polls with a staggering lead over the other candidates.

    He's promising to make Brazil great again, and return it to the times of the military dictatorship, to a “time when Brazilians could still walk on the streets without fear”. He also seems to hate everyone non-white and non-straight. His supporters said that they need "a leader with energy and fight – like British prime minister Theresa May"

    First results should be up in an hour or so. You need 50% of the votes to win on the first round, or a second round will follow with two candidates who got most votes on the first round.
    Why settle for "like Theresa May". They can have her. Air fare paid. I'll pay it.
    Quote Originally Posted by Keieueue View Post
    I love Malcanis!

  8. #53848
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    Quote Originally Posted by RazoR View Post
    Wait, white brazilians?
    Just let this one go, trust me on this.
    Quote Originally Posted by Keieueue View Post
    I love Malcanis!

  9. #53849
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dorvil Barranis View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Approaching Walrus View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Liare View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by dzajic View Post
    I love to see resident leftists spit on Democrats and dream about true social justice. Yes, do keep masturbating to fully automated gay space communism. But in the meantime please don't vote, or if you do, vote only for 3rd parties.
    the US is literately a single party state as recent shennanigans amply illustrate, voting there is largely meaningless for a great portion of the population due to the electoral system.
    Yeah plus Democrats are effectively powerless right now at both state and federal level, and even if they do manage to wrest control back they are so meek and polite that they will still just go along with what ever the republicans want as always.
    Funny how two years ago some people here were claiming the Republican party was dead. Now they are monolithicly powerful, and voting doesn't matter. Except, don't vote third party. People sure are dramatic.
    Trump, and the insanity of the republican party is classic late-empire scenes, the US is, at most, a decade away from losing it's position as the "leader of the world" it all really depends on how the complete lack of response to the oncoming climate change freight train and the internal contractions of the US end up playing out.

    the point of Kavanaugh is just as much to lock in the conservative ideology in the political system (and yes, Supreme court in the US is a highly political and politicized institution) as the inevitable tide of demographics and social friction literately kills off the republican voter base, it's a repeat of the pattern that caused the "lochner era" as the contractions and frictions of the gilded age eventually led towards a significant political backlash.

    Quote Originally Posted by Timaios View Post
    Is this just the USA thread or general americas thread? Because in Brazil, a pro-military dictatorship, pro torture candidate Jair Bolsonaro is leading the polls with a staggering lead over the other candidates.

    He's promising to make Brazil great again, and return it to the times of the military dictatorship, to a “time when Brazilians could still walk on the streets without fear”. He also seems to hate everyone non-white and non-straight. His supporters said that they need "a leader with energy and fight – like British prime minister Theresa May"

    First results should be up in an hour or so. You need 50% of the votes to win on the first round, or a second round will follow with two candidates who got most votes on the first round.
    that guy is full on fash from what i've seen, so of course the conservatives are all over supporting his political agenda, no doubt he will be held up as a shining exsample of what to strive for as he quietly shuffles any and all opponents off to camps in the amazon rainforest.

    Quote Originally Posted by Ego Proxy View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Isyel View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Dorvil Barranis View Post
    Wait, so now it is the Dems fault Kavenaugh got appointed? Gotta explain that one to me.
    It's in relation to them being pathetic and somehow unable to strongly get behind anything and get anything done anymore.
    Or a more reasonable mind might consider that some continue to play by the spirit of the rules, and others have gone full got mine fuck you mode.
    what rules ? the idea that there are "rules" or "civility" in politics is a fundamental misunderstanding of the stakes involved, it's not a fucking "team sport" where you have "respectable disagreements" with the "gentlemen" on the other side. it's a struggle over what ideals should govern society and who should hold the reigns of power with one side here evidently being quite chuffed about putting monumentally unfit individuals into positions of power.
    Viking, n.:
    1. Daring Scandinavian seafarers, explorers, adventurers, entrepreneurs world-famous for their aggressive, nautical import business, highly leveraged takeovers and blue eyes.
    2. Bloodthirsty sea pirates who ravaged northern Europe beginning in the 9th century.

    Hagar's note: The first definition is much preferred; the second is used only by malcontents, the envious, and disgruntled owners of waterfront property.

  10. #53850

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    Quote Originally Posted by Liare View Post

    Or a more reasonable mind might consider that some continue to play by the spirit of the rules, and others have gone full got mine fuck you mode.
    what rules ? the idea that there are "rules" or "civility" in politics is a fundamental misunderstanding of the stakes involved, it's not a fucking "team sport" where you have "respectable disagreements" with the "gentlemen" on the other side. it's a struggle over what ideals should govern society and who should hold the reigns of power with one side here evidently being quite chuffed about putting monumentally unfit individuals into positions of power.
    You mean it's a struggle over the right to say all men are created equal, just some are more equal than others?

  11. #53851
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    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...rosecutor.html

    "Two bullets 'were found in pilot's body' after helicopter crash which killed senior Putin prosecutor linked to lawyer who held Trump Tower meeting"

    It's a mystery why the pilot of the helicopter that crashed had bullets in his body, it's possible this affected his ability to fly the aircraft properly but disputed by experts

  12. #53852
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ego Proxy View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Liare View Post

    Or a more reasonable mind might consider that some continue to play by the spirit of the rules, and others have gone full got mine fuck you mode.
    what rules ? the idea that there are "rules" or "civility" in politics is a fundamental misunderstanding of the stakes involved, it's not a fucking "team sport" where you have "respectable disagreements" with the "gentlemen" on the other side. it's a struggle over what ideals should govern society and who should hold the reigns of power with one side here evidently being quite chuffed about putting monumentally unfit individuals into positions of power.
    You mean it's a struggle over the right to say all men are created equal, just some are more equal than others?
    you realize that quoting Orwell and imaging it's a "clever counterpoint" amply illustrates you know fuck all about what point he was making, who he was and why he was making it right ?

    if you cannot see why viewing politics as a "civil discussion" rather than a struggle of ideals is the wrong way to go, then you're literately the embodiment of the the failure of the liberal centre that is typifying the entirety of the western world to some extend these years.

    Quote Originally Posted by Approaching Walrus View Post
    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...rosecutor.html

    "Two bullets 'were found in pilot's body' after helicopter crash which killed senior Putin prosecutor linked to lawyer who held Trump Tower meeting"

    It's a mystery why the pilot of the helicopter that crashed had bullets in his body, it's possible this affected his ability to fly the aircraft properly but disputed by experts
    capping the pilot of a moving chopper that's high enough to kill the passengers when it crashes is, if nothing else, a impressive feat of marksmanship, of course it's the daily heil, so who knows what's actually true.
    Viking, n.:
    1. Daring Scandinavian seafarers, explorers, adventurers, entrepreneurs world-famous for their aggressive, nautical import business, highly leveraged takeovers and blue eyes.
    2. Bloodthirsty sea pirates who ravaged northern Europe beginning in the 9th century.

    Hagar's note: The first definition is much preferred; the second is used only by malcontents, the envious, and disgruntled owners of waterfront property.

  13. #53853

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    Quote Originally Posted by Liare View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Ego Proxy View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Liare View Post

    Or a more reasonable mind might consider that some continue to play by the spirit of the rules, and others have gone full got mine fuck you mode.
    what rules ? the idea that there are "rules" or "civility" in politics is a fundamental misunderstanding of the stakes involved, it's not a fucking "team sport" where you have "respectable disagreements" with the "gentlemen" on the other side. it's a struggle over what ideals should govern society and who should hold the reigns of power with one side here evidently being quite chuffed about putting monumentally unfit individuals into positions of power.
    You mean it's a struggle over the right to say all men are created equal, just some are more equal than others?
    you realize that quoting Orwell and imaging it's a "clever counterpoint" amply illustrates you know fuck all about what point he was making, who he was and why he was making it right ?

    if you cannot see why viewing politics as a "civil discussion" rather than a struggle of ideals is the wrong way to go, then you're literately the embodiment of the the failure of the liberal centre that is typifying the entirety of the western world to some extend these years.
    Those that play by the rules believe the immortal declaration, and struggle to hold themselves up to it's ideal. Those that don't want to play by the rules style themselves as the rich white men that wrote those words, the privileged holders of capital, and want to enslave anyone that dares stand in their way. Orwell's quote is merely ironic.

  14. #53854
    Approaching Walrus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Liare View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Approaching Walrus View Post
    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...rosecutor.html

    "Two bullets 'were found in pilot's body' after helicopter crash which killed senior Putin prosecutor linked to lawyer who held Trump Tower meeting"

    It's a mystery why the pilot of the helicopter that crashed had bullets in his body, it's possible this affected his ability to fly the aircraft properly but disputed by experts
    capping the pilot of a moving chopper that's high enough to kill the passengers when it crashes is, if nothing else, a impressive feat of marksmanship, of course it's the daily heil, so who knows what's actually true.
    Maybe he was shot from inside the helicopter by a beautiful femme fatale FSB agent who parachuted to safety, lots of loose ends conveniently tied up and all it took was a few bullets!

  15. #53855
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ego Proxy View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Liare View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Ego Proxy View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Liare View Post

    Or a more reasonable mind might consider that some continue to play by the spirit of the rules, and others have gone full got mine fuck you mode.
    what rules ? the idea that there are "rules" or "civility" in politics is a fundamental misunderstanding of the stakes involved, it's not a fucking "team sport" where you have "respectable disagreements" with the "gentlemen" on the other side. it's a struggle over what ideals should govern society and who should hold the reigns of power with one side here evidently being quite chuffed about putting monumentally unfit individuals into positions of power.
    You mean it's a struggle over the right to say all men are created equal, just some are more equal than others?
    you realize that quoting Orwell and imaging it's a "clever counterpoint" amply illustrates you know fuck all about what point he was making, who he was and why he was making it right ?

    if you cannot see why viewing politics as a "civil discussion" rather than a struggle of ideals is the wrong way to go, then you're literately the embodiment of the the failure of the liberal centre that is typifying the entirety of the western world to some extend these years.
    Those that play by the rules believe the immortal declaration, and struggle to hold themselves up to it's ideal. Those that don't want to play by the rules style themselves as the rich white men that wrote those words, the privileged holders of capital, and want to enslave anyone that dares stand in their way. Orwell's quote is merely ironic.
    nobody with even a passing understanding of history is that naive, to assume that politics is a "polite game of compromise" is to cede control to the opposition, you're literately advocating the chamberlain solution.
    Viking, n.:
    1. Daring Scandinavian seafarers, explorers, adventurers, entrepreneurs world-famous for their aggressive, nautical import business, highly leveraged takeovers and blue eyes.
    2. Bloodthirsty sea pirates who ravaged northern Europe beginning in the 9th century.

    Hagar's note: The first definition is much preferred; the second is used only by malcontents, the envious, and disgruntled owners of waterfront property.

  16. #53856
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    Quote Originally Posted by lubica
    And her name was Limul Azgoden, a lowly peasant girl.

  17. #53857
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    Quote Originally Posted by Liare View Post
    nobody with even a passing understanding of history is that naive, to assume that politics is a "polite game of compromise" is to cede control to the opposition, you're literately advocating the chamberlain solution.
    Except that even as an outsider I can see and understand that USA system was made in a way to necessitate bipartisanship and compromise. How many different items require (or required until "nuclear options" were triggered) a 60 vote majority in Senate?

  18. #53858
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    Quote Originally Posted by dzajic View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Liare View Post
    nobody with even a passing understanding of history is that naive, to assume that politics is a "polite game of compromise" is to cede control to the opposition, you're literately advocating the chamberlain solution.
    Except that even as an outsider I can see and understand that USA system was made in a way to necessitate bipartisanship and compromise. How many different items require (or required until "nuclear options" were triggered) a 60 vote majority in Senate?
    you're again making the assumption that both sides abide by the "politics is a game of compromise" perspective, when they obviously do not.

    what actually happens is that the republicans take the most extreme position their base allows them to get away with, and sit there going "NUH-UH!" until they get what they want, and because conservatives are traditionally the "the state is bad !" party they've got every incentive to maintain that position because it makes the federal state looks awful in the process. this is endemic to 2 party systems and why they are all awful by default, you've basically got a prisoners dilemma playing out incentive one side or the other to be a "bad actor" so the only reasonable way to behave is like a "bad actor" and we haven't even gotten to why the "it's just a game!" approach is morally bankrupt yet!

    the american electoral system was designed to keep power in the hands of the landed slave-owning elite and as far away as possible from the dirty proles coming off the ships on the east coast, wanting to homestead in the frontier, and it does this very well indeed.
    Viking, n.:
    1. Daring Scandinavian seafarers, explorers, adventurers, entrepreneurs world-famous for their aggressive, nautical import business, highly leveraged takeovers and blue eyes.
    2. Bloodthirsty sea pirates who ravaged northern Europe beginning in the 9th century.

    Hagar's note: The first definition is much preferred; the second is used only by malcontents, the envious, and disgruntled owners of waterfront property.

  19. #53859
    Lana Torrin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Liare View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by dzajic View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Liare View Post
    nobody with even a passing understanding of history is that naive, to assume that politics is a "polite game of compromise" is to cede control to the opposition, you're literately advocating the chamberlain solution.
    Except that even as an outsider I can see and understand that USA system was made in a way to necessitate bipartisanship and compromise. How many different items require (or required until "nuclear options" were triggered) a 60 vote majority in Senate?
    you're again making the assumption that both sides abide by the "politics is a game of compromise" perspective, when they obviously do not.

    what actually happens is that the republicans take the most extreme position their base allows them to get away with, and sit there going "NUH-UH!" until they get what they want, and because conservatives are traditionally the "the state is bad !" party they've got every incentive to maintain that position because it makes the federal state looks awful in the process. this is endemic to 2 party systems and why they are all awful by default, you've basically got a prisoners dilemma playing out incentive one side or the other to be a "bad actor" so the only reasonable way to behave is like a "bad actor" and we haven't even gotten to why the "it's just a game!" approach is morally bankrupt yet!

    the american electoral system was designed to keep power in the hands of the landed slave-owning elite and as far away as possible from the dirty proles coming off the ships on the east coast, wanting to homestead in the frontier, and it does this very well indeed.
    Eeeeerrrrr.....
    Quote Originally Posted by lubica
    And her name was Limul Azgoden, a lowly peasant girl.

  20. #53860

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    I personally love the way murica handles the decisions with cryptic unrelated riders attached to the bills just to get one or two representatives to say yes.

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