hate these ads?, log in or register to hide them
Page 2512 of 2654 FirstFirst ... 151220122412246225022509251025112512251325142515252225622612 ... LastLast
Results 50,221 to 50,240 of 53080

Thread: USA Politics Thread

  1. #50221
    Lachesis VII's Avatar
    Join Date
    April 20, 2011
    Location
    Egghelende
    Posts
    2,194
    Yup, so a very large conventional explosive, basically. Delivered on point anywheee in the world in 15 minutes or so, once you have a network of platforms.

    And you can drop smaller ones if you want, though obviously they have to be large enough not to ablate say into nothingness.

    So you keep these for destroying hardened military targets, concentrations of troops, maybe even naval units depending on whether you have any terminal guidance. Draw down the nuclear stockpile to a counter-value second strike doctrine. Our current nukes are designed to go after hardened counter-force targets, which is why they’re a few hundred KT in yield. Presumably an accurate kinetic bombardment could accomplish the same thing with much less total energy expended due to the nature of how the energy is delivered to the target. No need to rely on an airburst and massive overpressre to colllapse a bunker or silo (causing a ton of collateral damage), just apply direct kinetic force downwards into the earth.

    In theory it should be even more destructive than a conventional weapon of similar yield, simply because even a ground burst explosive directs a lot of its energy away from the target. Penetrating bombs are better at this. Currently though, the biggest such weapon has only a 2.5 ton yield, despite weighing 15 tons.

    Concerns about “too small a bang” can be alleviated by dropping multiple rods simultaneously.

    Again, the political angle is a bit dicey; I’m not sure how the world community would react to someone getting rodded, whether they’d treat it as something like a chemical or nuclear attack. Probably depends on what the target was.
    Last edited by Lachesis VII; July 12 2018 at 07:11:00 PM.

  2. #50222
    Donor erichkknaar's Avatar
    Join Date
    April 9, 2011
    Posts
    10,815
    Quote Originally Posted by Lachesis VII View Post
    Yup, so a very large conventional explosive, basically. Delivered on point anywheee in the world in 15 minutes or so, once you have a network of platforms.

    And you can drop smaller ones if you want, though obviously they have to be large enough not to ablate say into nothingness.

    So you keep these for destroying hardened military targets, concentrations of troops, maybe even naval units depending on whether you have any terminal guidance. Draw down the nuclear stockpile to a counter-value second strike doctrine. Our current nukes are designed to go after hardened counter-force targets, which is why they’re a few hundred KT in yield. Presumably an accurate kinetic bombardment could accomplish the same thing with much less total energy expended due to the nature of how the energy is delivered to the target. No need to rely on an airburst and massive overpressre to colllapse a bunker or silo (causing a ton of collateral damage), just apply direct kinetic force downwards into the earth.

    In theory it should be even more destructive than a conventional weapon of similar yield, simply because even a ground burst explosive directs a lot of its energy away from the target. Penetrating bombs are better at this. Currently though, the biggest such weapon has only a 2.5 ton yield, despite weighing 15 tons.

    Concerns about “too small a bang” can be alleviated by dropping multiple rods simultaneously.

    Again, the political angle is a bit dicey; I’m not sure how the world community would react to someone getting rodded, whether they’d treat it as something like a chemical or nuclear attack. Probably depends on what the target was.
    Same way you'd react to any other weapon you had no defense against. I don't think it's destructive to WMD levels, but it certainly steps up the arms race.
    meh

  3. #50223
    Caldrion Dosto's Avatar
    Join Date
    November 19, 2011
    Posts
    2,169
    Quote Originally Posted by erichkknaar View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Lachesis VII View Post
    Yup, so a very large conventional explosive, basically. Delivered on point anywheee in the world in 15 minutes or so, once you have a network of platforms.

    And you can drop smaller ones if you want, though obviously they have to be large enough not to ablate say into nothingness.

    So you keep these for destroying hardened military targets, concentrations of troops, maybe even naval units depending on whether you have any terminal guidance. Draw down the nuclear stockpile to a counter-value second strike doctrine. Our current nukes are designed to go after hardened counter-force targets, which is why they’re a few hundred KT in yield. Presumably an accurate kinetic bombardment could accomplish the same thing with much less total energy expended due to the nature of how the energy is delivered to the target. No need to rely on an airburst and massive overpressre to colllapse a bunker or silo (causing a ton of collateral damage), just apply direct kinetic force downwards into the earth.

    In theory it should be even more destructive than a conventional weapon of similar yield, simply because even a ground burst explosive directs a lot of its energy away from the target. Penetrating bombs are better at this. Currently though, the biggest such weapon has only a 2.5 ton yield, despite weighing 15 tons.

    Concerns about “too small a bang” can be alleviated by dropping multiple rods simultaneously.

    Again, the political angle is a bit dicey; I’m not sure how the world community would react to someone getting rodded, whether they’d treat it as something like a chemical or nuclear attack. Probably depends on what the target was.
    Same way you'd react to any other weapon you had no defense against. I don't think it's destructive to WMD levels, but it certainly steps up the arms race.
    Ends up in same way as nukes tbh. All good until more people have em, then its be MAD all over again (also nuclear powers might threaten nuclear response).

  4. #50224
    Joe Appleby's Avatar
    Join Date
    April 9, 2011
    Location
    in front of the class
    Posts
    14,266
    That's the point. ICBMs can be intercepted, if not 100% reliably, there's a chance. Kinetic penetrators will most likely use such a steep reentry envelope, that they will be almost impossible to detect, let alone intercept.
    However once someone puts them up, you will see increased interest in lasers to use them to heat up the rods during reentry/redirect them due to one-sided heating.

    At this point we might just use lasers for everything.

    Tapapapatalk
    nevar forget

  5. #50225
    XenosisMk4's Avatar
    Join Date
    July 13, 2017
    Location
    More turbo-lightspeed neoliberal platitudes/virtue signaling/misplaced priorities on full display.
    Posts
    4,638
    It's an uninterruptible, 100% pinpoint accurate bunker buster. Concerns about not enough yield are irrelevant when it can't be stopped and you can hit something the size of a mini fridge anywhere from orbit.

    The only concerns are the cost of lifting the rods into orbit and the safety of the launch platform itself, there's a reason China's developed plane launched anti-satellite munitions.
    Last edited by XenosisMk4; July 12 2018 at 07:52:09 PM.

  6. #50226
    Lachesis VII's Avatar
    Join Date
    April 20, 2011
    Location
    Egghelende
    Posts
    2,194
    Quote Originally Posted by Joe Appleby View Post
    That's the point. ICBMs can be intercepted, if not 100% reliably, there's a chance. Kinetic penetrators will most likely use such a steep reentry envelope, that they will be almost impossible to detect, let alone intercept.
    However once someone puts them up, you will see increased interest in lasers to use them to heat up the rods during reentry/redirect them due to one-sided heating.

    At this point we might just use lasers for everything.

    Tapapapatalk
    Don’t think laser ablation is gonna work on something that dense moving that fast.

  7. #50227

    Join Date
    April 10, 2011
    Posts
    9,892
    TFW you ask for transfer from your VIP jail and get more than you've bargained for:

    Last edited by Don Rumata; July 13 2018 at 12:18:18 AM.

  8. #50228
    Shaikar's Avatar
    Join Date
    April 9, 2011
    Location
    Kador
    Posts
    2,295
    Quote Originally Posted by Don Rumata View Post
    TFW you ask for transfer from your VIP jail and get more than you've bargained for:
    But Judge Ellis had apparently made up his mind. “Having just complained” about the jail in Warsaw, Va., he wrote, Mr. Manafort’s lawyers had not identified any specific threat to his safety at the Alexandria jail. Jailers there are “very familiar with housing high-profile defendants, including foreign and domestic terrorists, spies and traitors,” he wrote.
    Ouch.

  9. #50229

    Join Date
    April 10, 2011
    Posts
    3,738
    Quote Originally Posted by Joe Appleby View Post
    That's the point. ICBMs can be intercepted, if not 100% reliably, there's a chance. Kinetic penetrators will most likely use such a steep reentry envelope, that they will be almost impossible to detect, let alone intercept.
    However once someone puts them up, you will see increased interest in lasers to use them to heat up the rods during reentry/redirect them due to one-sided heating.

    At this point we might just use lasers for everything.

    Tapapapatalk

    Traditional WMD's are safeguarded by closed circuits, if their designers have any kind of sense. Thats why there are people sitting in bunkers waiting for the phone to ring (figuratively). A sat-based first strike weapon needs to be remotely operable, unless you plan on weaponizing the ISS.

    At that point, chances of it being vulnerable to cyber warfare are anyones guess, but i sure wouldnt feel comfortable with it. Some doofus is going to run a component on XP because "its legacy hardware" or some shit.

  10. #50230
    Straight Hustlin's Avatar
    Join Date
    April 14, 2011
    Posts
    10,370
    Quote Originally Posted by Joe Appleby View Post
    They will be almost impossible to detect

    Tapapapatalk
    That's not true at all once they've hit the atmosphere, granted by that point its too late to really do anything about the rod itself. However there in lies one of the flaws of the Rods from God concept, all an adversary will see is that something is reentering the atmosphere and where its headed, and they will assume that its a nuclear weapon and retaliate accordingly. Its the same reason that no one uses ballistic missiles with conventional warheads, there's no way of telling what it is until its too late so you have to assume the worst.

  11. #50231
    Lana Torrin's Avatar
    Join Date
    April 13, 2011
    Location
    Bonding around
    Posts
    18,766
    Trumps winning friends and doing Putin's work in Europe I see.
    Quote Originally Posted by lubica
    And her name was Limul Azgoden, a lowly peasant girl.

  12. #50232
    Yankunytjatjara's Avatar
    Join Date
    April 12, 2011
    Posts
    1,549
    Quote Originally Posted by Lachesis VII View Post
    In theory it should be even more destructive than a conventional weapon of similar yield, simply because even a ground burst explosive directs a lot of its energy away from the target. Penetrating bombs are better at this. Currently though, the biggest such weapon has only a 2.5 ton yield, despite weighing 15 tons.
    I really think that the rods would be better at this - they'd probably be able to penetrate a mountain, orbital speed is HIGH and that converts to a lot of kinetic energy. The real question is how much of it ablates in reentry, but give it 5 years once the tech is up there and they'll have found new materials that minimise that.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lachesis VII View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Joe Appleby View Post
    That's the point. ICBMs can be intercepted, if not 100% reliably, there's a chance. Kinetic penetrators will most likely use such a steep reentry envelope, that they will be almost impossible to detect, let alone intercept.
    However once someone puts them up, you will see increased interest in lasers to use them to heat up the rods during reentry/redirect them due to one-sided heating.

    At this point we might just use lasers for everything.

    Tapapapatalk
    Don’t think laser ablation is gonna work on something that dense moving that fast.
    Yeah and surrounded by the reentry plasma... Laser's not going to do much, I'd give more chances to counter-kinetic deviation with rails despite how far fetched that sounds. That could happen in LEO.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lilalaunebör View Post
    At that point, chances of it being vulnerable to cyber warfare are anyones guess, but i sure wouldnt feel comfortable with it. Some doofus is going to run a component on XP because "its legacy hardware" or some shit.
    Dedicated closed circuit IT systems like for nukes. There's a reason why they still load from 5.14" floppies

    Quote Originally Posted by Straight Hustlin View Post
    However there in lies one of the flaws of the Rods from God concept, all an adversary will see is that something is reentering the atmosphere and where its headed, and they will assume that its a nuclear weapon and retaliate accordingly.
    Except, the nuke has a starting point, where's the rod coming from? No lines in the sand in space = complete plausible deniability. This would obsolete MAD.
    My solo pvp video: Yankunytjude... That attitude!
    Solo/small gang proposal: Ship Velocity Vectors

  13. #50233
    Shaikar's Avatar
    Join Date
    April 9, 2011
    Location
    Kador
    Posts
    2,295
    Quote Originally Posted by Yankunytjatjara View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Lilalaunebör View Post
    At that point, chances of it being vulnerable to cyber warfare are anyones guess, but i sure wouldnt feel comfortable with it. Some doofus is going to run a component on XP because "its legacy hardware" or some shit.
    Dedicated closed circuit IT systems like for nukes. There's a reason why they still load from 5.14" floppies
    Not really transferable to satellites though - those would have to be automated systems accepting instructions remotely.
    There's loads you could do to harden it up of course but they'd never be quite as secure as a manned off-grid base fannying around with floppies.

    Also, christ the room for euphemism here.

  14. #50234
    Donor lubica's Avatar
    Join Date
    April 9, 2011
    Location
    On the shitty side of the Alps
    Posts
    4,823
    Quote Originally Posted by Shaikar View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Yankunytjatjara View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Lilalaunebör View Post
    At that point, chances of it being vulnerable to cyber warfare are anyones guess, but i sure wouldnt feel comfortable with it. Some doofus is going to run a component on XP because "its legacy hardware" or some shit.
    Dedicated closed circuit IT systems like for nukes. There's a reason why they still load from 5.14" floppies
    Not really transferable to satellites though - those would have to be automated systems accepting instructions remotely.
    There's loads you could do to harden it up of course but they'd never be quite as secure as a manned off-grid base fannying around with floppies.

    Also, christ the room for euphemism here.
    You harden up my floppy <3


    Quote Originally Posted by Narmio
    Welcome to Dwarf Fortress, where there is a fine line between insanity and gameplay. The line menaces with spikes of obsessive compulsion.

  15. #50235
    Movember 2011Movember 2012 Nordstern's Avatar
    Join Date
    April 10, 2011
    Posts
    9,270
    FRIDAY THE 13TH

    https://www.reuters.com/article/us-u...-idUSKBN1K32DJ

    Last edited by Nordstern; July 13 2018 at 05:42:57 PM.
    "Holy shit, I ask you to stop being autistic and you debate what autistic is." - spasm
    Quote Originally Posted by Larkonis Trassler View Post
    WTF I hate white people now...

  16. #50236
    Donor Sponk's Avatar
    Join Date
    April 10, 2011
    Location
    AU TZ
    Posts
    11,416
    So I guess Roger Stone, being most likely to be the intermediary mentioned in these indictments, is fucked?
    Contract stuff to Seraphina Amaranth.

    "You give me the awful impression - I hate to have to say - of someone who hasn't read any of the arguments against your position. Ever."


  17. #50237
    Malcanis's Avatar
    Join Date
    April 12, 2011
    Posts
    14,380
    Quote Originally Posted by Sponk View Post
    So I guess Roger Stone, being most likely to be the intermediary mentioned in these indictments, is fucked?
    One can only hope.
    Quote Originally Posted by Keieueue View Post
    I love Malcanis!

  18. #50238
    Jack Coutu's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 9, 2011
    Location
    marketjacker
    Posts
    516
    Quote Originally Posted by Malcanis View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Sponk View Post
    So I guess Roger Stone, being most likely to be the intermediary mentioned in these indictments, is fucked?
    One can only hope.
    Doubtful, his problem is not a legal one here. The indictment is purely focused on foreign agents, but knowing Stone more on him may come later.

  19. #50239
    mewninn's Avatar
    Join Date
    April 10, 2011
    Posts
    1,623
    Quote Originally Posted by Jack Coutu View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Malcanis View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Sponk View Post
    So I guess Roger Stone, being most likely to be the intermediary mentioned in these indictments, is fucked?
    One can only hope.
    Doubtful, his problem is not a legal one here. The indictment is purely focused on foreign agents, but knowing Stone more on him may come later.
    ?

    These indictments are being used as a tool to build the case that Russia interfered in 2016. Mueller's next target will be Americans who coordinated with those GRU officers. If Stone was one of those people, then he is indeed fucked.

  20. #50240
    walrus's Avatar
    Join Date
    April 9, 2011
    Location
    Fancomicidolkostümier- ungsspielgruppenzusammenkunft
    Posts
    6,249
      Spoiler:
    Quote Originally Posted by RazoR View Post
    But islamism IS a product of class warfare. Rich white countries come into developing brown dictatorships, wreck the leadership, infrastructure and economy and then act all surprised that religious fanaticism is on the rise.
    Also:
    Quote Originally Posted by Tellenta View Post
    walrus isnt a bad poster.
    Quote Originally Posted by cullnean View Post
    also i like walrus.
    Quote Originally Posted by AmaNutin View Post
    Yer a hoot

Bookmarks

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •