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Thread: USA Politics Thread

  1. #51261
    Donor erichkknaar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Keckers View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by erichkknaar View Post
    I would prefer we encouraged the private exploration and thus the eventual democratization of space and it’s resouces,
    >Private exploration
    >Eventual democratisation

    wat
    Vs states holding everything? Private enterprise is the quickest way to get smaller units out there. This is how the belt gets seeded comrade. Only after that can we fully automate.
    meh

  2. #51262
    Alistair's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Don Rumata View Post
    The FAKE NEWS are not going to fake themselves.

    Donald Trump Jr. tweets photoshopped CNN screengrab, allegedly showing Trump approval at 50% (actual number is 40%, clearly visible behind the fake 50%).




    https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/...ed-by-his-son/
    Amazingly bad photoshop job.

    Rest of those numbers tho....


  3. #51263
    Movember 2011Movember 2012 Nordstern's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Keckers View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by erichkknaar View Post
    I would prefer we encouraged the private exploration and thus the eventual democratization of space and it’s resouces,
    >Private exploration
    >Eventual democratisation

    wat
    Indeed, I had a chuckle at that.
    "Holy shit, I ask you to stop being autistic and you debate what autistic is." - spasm
    Quote Originally Posted by Larkonis Trassler View Post
    WTF I hate white people now...

  4. #51264
    Keckers's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by erichkknaar View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Keckers View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by erichkknaar View Post
    I would prefer we encouraged the private exploration and thus the eventual democratization of space and it’s resouces,
    >Private exploration
    >Eventual democratisation

    wat
    Vs states holding everything? Private enterprise is the quickest way to get smaller units out there. This is how the belt gets seeded comrade. Only after that can we fully automate.
    What makes you think private interests are going to be democratised? The reverse is happening en masse right now.
    Quote Originally Posted by Paul Mason
    It is absurd that we are capable of witnessing a 40,000 year old system of gender oppression begin to dissolve before our eyes yet still see the abolition of a 200 year old economic system as an unrealistic utopia.

  5. #51265
    Donor erichkknaar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alistair View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Don Rumata View Post
    The FAKE NEWS are not going to fake themselves.

    Donald Trump Jr. tweets photoshopped CNN screengrab, allegedly showing Trump approval at 50% (actual number is 40%, clearly visible behind the fake 50%).




    https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/...ed-by-his-son/
    Amazingly bad photoshop job.

    Rest of those numbers tho....
    The deficit is expected to hit 1 trillion over the next couple of years, whereas Obama literally inherited a 100 year crisis, and his numbers only get better from here on out on the timeline.
    meh

  6. #51266
    Donor erichkknaar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Keckers View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by erichkknaar View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Keckers View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by erichkknaar View Post
    I would prefer we encouraged the private exploration and thus the eventual democratization of space and it’s resouces,
    >Private exploration
    >Eventual democratisation

    wat
    Vs states holding everything? Private enterprise is the quickest way to get smaller units out there. This is how the belt gets seeded comrade. Only after that can we fully automate.
    What makes you think private interests are going to be democratised? The reverse is happening en masse right now.
    It’s still way more people than a handful of spooky fighter pilots with higher than top secret clearance. If you can bankroll a rocket up there, why not go claim an asteroid and exploit it?
    meh

  7. #51267
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alistair View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Don Rumata View Post
    The FAKE NEWS are not going to fake themselves.

    Donald Trump Jr. tweets photoshopped CNN screengrab, allegedly showing Trump approval at 50% (actual number is 40%, clearly visible behind the fake 50%).




    https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/...ed-by-his-son/
    Amazingly bad photoshop job.

    Rest of those numbers tho....
    Do you remember the global financial meltdown?

    Still with high unemployment, Obama had better approval...
      Spoiler:
    Quote Originally Posted by RazoR View Post
    But islamism IS a product of class warfare. Rich white countries come into developing brown dictatorships, wreck the leadership, infrastructure and economy and then act all surprised that religious fanaticism is on the rise.
    Also:
    Quote Originally Posted by Tellenta View Post
    walrus isnt a bad poster.
    Quote Originally Posted by cullnean View Post
    also i like walrus.
    Quote Originally Posted by AmaNutin View Post
    Yer a hoot

  8. #51268
    Liare's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by erichkknaar View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Keckers View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by erichkknaar View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Keckers View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by erichkknaar View Post
    I would prefer we encouraged the private exploration and thus the eventual democratization of space and it’s resouces,
    >Private exploration
    >Eventual democratisation

    wat
    Vs states holding everything? Private enterprise is the quickest way to get smaller units out there. This is how the belt gets seeded comrade. Only after that can we fully automate.
    What makes you think private interests are going to be democratised? The reverse is happening en masse right now.
    It’s still way more people than a handful of spooky fighter pilots with higher than top secret clearance. If you can bankroll a rocket up there, why not go claim an asteroid and exploit it?
    you're not answering the question.
    Viking, n.:
    1. Daring Scandinavian seafarers, explorers, adventurers, entrepreneurs world-famous for their aggressive, nautical import business, highly leveraged takeovers and blue eyes.
    2. Bloodthirsty sea pirates who ravaged northern Europe beginning in the 9th century.

    Hagar's note: The first definition is much preferred; the second is used only by malcontents, the envious, and disgruntled owners of waterfront property.

  9. #51269
    Donor erichkknaar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Liare View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by erichkknaar View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Keckers View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by erichkknaar View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Keckers View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by erichkknaar View Post
    I would prefer we encouraged the private exploration and thus the eventual democratization of space and it’s resouces,
    >Private exploration
    >Eventual democratisation

    wat
    Vs states holding everything? Private enterprise is the quickest way to get smaller units out there. This is how the belt gets seeded comrade. Only after that can we fully automate.
    What makes you think private interests are going to be democratised? The reverse is happening en masse right now.
    It’s still way more people than a handful of spooky fighter pilots with higher than top secret clearance. If you can bankroll a rocket up there, why not go claim an asteroid and exploit it?
    you're not answering the question.
    I realize the spirt of free enterprise may be difficult to process, but it motivates people to do stuff. That stuff will include the exploration and exploitation of space if we can get the technology cheap enough, which we do by encouraging more private sector investment into incremental innovation in space technology.

    Get it cheap and accessible enough and even a collectivist co-op could claim an asteroid for themselves. Haven’t you read any sci-fi?
    meh

  10. #51270
    Liare's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by erichkknaar View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Liare View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by erichkknaar View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Keckers View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by erichkknaar View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Keckers View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by erichkknaar View Post
    I would prefer we encouraged the private exploration and thus the eventual democratization of space and it’s resouces,
    >Private exploration
    >Eventual democratisation

    wat
    Vs states holding everything? Private enterprise is the quickest way to get smaller units out there. This is how the belt gets seeded comrade. Only after that can we fully automate.
    What makes you think private interests are going to be democratised? The reverse is happening en masse right now.
    It’s still way more people than a handful of spooky fighter pilots with higher than top secret clearance. If you can bankroll a rocket up there, why not go claim an asteroid and exploit it?
    you're not answering the question.
    I realize the spirt of free enterprise may be difficult to process, but it motivates people to do stuff. That stuff will include the exploration and exploitation of space if we can get the technology cheap enough, which we do by encouraging more private sector investment into incremental innovation in space technology.

    Get it cheap and accessible enough and even a collectivist co-op could claim an asteroid for themselves. Haven’t you read any sci-fi?
    you're still not answering the question, let me help you.

    how is handing wast swathes of the solar system over to the rich oligarchs that already dominate society on earth in any way shape or form "democratizing" ?

    are we looking at a variant of the "only landholders get to vote" view of democracy here?
    Last edited by Liare; August 10 2018 at 09:43:17 PM.
    Viking, n.:
    1. Daring Scandinavian seafarers, explorers, adventurers, entrepreneurs world-famous for their aggressive, nautical import business, highly leveraged takeovers and blue eyes.
    2. Bloodthirsty sea pirates who ravaged northern Europe beginning in the 9th century.

    Hagar's note: The first definition is much preferred; the second is used only by malcontents, the envious, and disgruntled owners of waterfront property.

  11. #51271
    Lachesis VII's Avatar
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    The theory is that eventually it will get cheap enough for the plebs to go into space... once ownership of all the good stuff has been assigned to the oligarchs.

    Though that does raise the fact that the OST prohibits property rights as we understand them on any celestial body. Common heritage of mankind and all. But that's my rant about how the OST and related treaties are fundamentally socialist documents, but hey.

  12. #51272
    Alistair's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by erichkknaar View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Alistair View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Don Rumata View Post
    The FAKE NEWS are not going to fake themselves.

    Donald Trump Jr. tweets photoshopped CNN screengrab, allegedly showing Trump approval at 50% (actual number is 40%, clearly visible behind the fake 50%).


    https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/...ed-by-his-son/
    Amazingly bad photoshop job.

    Rest of those numbers tho....
    The deficit is expected to hit 1 trillion over the next couple of years, whereas Obama literally inherited a 100 year crisis, and his numbers only get better from here on out on the timeline.
    Oh, it was a 1,000 Year Crisis and the Greatest Recession. Don't undersell it man.

    Everything good now is because of stuff Obama did, isn't it?


  13. #51273
    Alistair's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Liare View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by erichkknaar View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Liare View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by erichkknaar View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Keckers View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by erichkknaar View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Keckers View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by erichkknaar View Post
    I would prefer we encouraged the private exploration and thus the eventual democratization of space and it’s resouces,
    >Private exploration
    >Eventual democratisation

    wat
    Vs states holding everything? Private enterprise is the quickest way to get smaller units out there. This is how the belt gets seeded comrade. Only after that can we fully automate.
    What makes you think private interests are going to be democratised? The reverse is happening en masse right now.
    It’s still way more people than a handful of spooky fighter pilots with higher than top secret clearance. If you can bankroll a rocket up there, why not go claim an asteroid and exploit it?
    you're not answering the question.
    I realize the spirt of free enterprise may be difficult to process, but it motivates people to do stuff. That stuff will include the exploration and exploitation of space if we can get the technology cheap enough, which we do by encouraging more private sector investment into incremental innovation in space technology.

    Get it cheap and accessible enough and even a collectivist co-op could claim an asteroid for themselves. Haven’t you read any sci-fi?
    you're still not answering the question, let me help you.

    how is handing wast swathes of the solar system over to the rich oligarchs that already dominate society on earth in any way shape or form "democratizing" ?

    are we looking at a variant of the "only landholders get to vote" view of democracy here?
    "Handing Over" implies you own it and are giving it over to the private interests.

    What right do you, me or anyone else have over off-earth planets/moons/asteroids?

    If Private Interests foot the bill, and get there first......what exactly are you going to do about their exploitation of those assets? And what right do you have to do so?


  14. #51274
    Liare's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alistair View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Liare View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by erichkknaar View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Liare View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by erichkknaar View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Keckers View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by erichkknaar View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Keckers View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by erichkknaar View Post
    I would prefer we encouraged the private exploration and thus the eventual democratization of space and it’s resouces,
    >Private exploration
    >Eventual democratisation

    wat
    Vs states holding everything? Private enterprise is the quickest way to get smaller units out there. This is how the belt gets seeded comrade. Only after that can we fully automate.
    What makes you think private interests are going to be democratised? The reverse is happening en masse right now.
    It’s still way more people than a handful of spooky fighter pilots with higher than top secret clearance. If you can bankroll a rocket up there, why not go claim an asteroid and exploit it?
    you're not answering the question.
    I realize the spirt of free enterprise may be difficult to process, but it motivates people to do stuff. That stuff will include the exploration and exploitation of space if we can get the technology cheap enough, which we do by encouraging more private sector investment into incremental innovation in space technology.

    Get it cheap and accessible enough and even a collectivist co-op could claim an asteroid for themselves. Haven’t you read any sci-fi?
    you're still not answering the question, let me help you.

    how is handing wast swathes of the solar system over to the rich oligarchs that already dominate society on earth in any way shape or form "democratizing" ?

    are we looking at a variant of the "only landholders get to vote" view of democracy here?
    "Handing Over" implies you own it and are giving it over to the private interests.

    What right do you, me or anyone else have over off-earth planets/moons/asteroids?

    If Private Interests foot the bill, and get there first......what exactly are you going to do about their exploitation of those assets? And what right do you have to do so?
    take your colonialism somewhere else, the outer space treaty stipulates private ownership of celestial objects is out entirely.

    relevant section is

    Article II

    Outer space, including the moon and other celestial bodies, is not subject to national appropriation by claim of sovereignty, by means of use or occupation, or by any other means.
    the explicit understanding is that it's our common heritage, the parallel with common land during the industrial revolution is apt and we will no doubt see the pattern repeated.
    Viking, n.:
    1. Daring Scandinavian seafarers, explorers, adventurers, entrepreneurs world-famous for their aggressive, nautical import business, highly leveraged takeovers and blue eyes.
    2. Bloodthirsty sea pirates who ravaged northern Europe beginning in the 9th century.

    Hagar's note: The first definition is much preferred; the second is used only by malcontents, the envious, and disgruntled owners of waterfront property.

  15. #51275

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    It says nothing of the sort. It's designed to stop countries laying territorial claims to the moon and asteroids, not to stop people exploiting their resources. It even goes to some length to explain that "use" of space is absolutely fine.

    See also: moon rocks.

  16. #51276
    Liare's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by elmicker View Post
    It says nothing of the sort. It's designed to stop countries laying territorial claims to the moon and asteroids, not to stop people exploiting their resources. It even goes to some length to explain that "use" of space is absolutely fine.

    See also: moon rocks.
    and where does the enforcement of property rights spring from ?

    by denying the ability to do territorial claims you're defacto denying the idea of ownership of it vis-a-vis say land ownership on earth, that doesn't exclude use, say mining an astroid or the like, but it does exclude ownership as we see it on earth.
    Viking, n.:
    1. Daring Scandinavian seafarers, explorers, adventurers, entrepreneurs world-famous for their aggressive, nautical import business, highly leveraged takeovers and blue eyes.
    2. Bloodthirsty sea pirates who ravaged northern Europe beginning in the 9th century.

    Hagar's note: The first definition is much preferred; the second is used only by malcontents, the envious, and disgruntled owners of waterfront property.

  17. #51277
    Donor erichkknaar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alistair View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by erichkknaar View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Alistair View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Don Rumata View Post
    The FAKE NEWS are not going to fake themselves.

    Donald Trump Jr. tweets photoshopped CNN screengrab, allegedly showing Trump approval at 50% (actual number is 40%, clearly visible behind the fake 50%).


    https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/...ed-by-his-son/
    Amazingly bad photoshop job.

    Rest of those numbers tho....
    The deficit is expected to hit 1 trillion over the next couple of years, whereas Obama literally inherited a 100 year crisis, and his numbers only get better from here on out on the timeline.
    Oh, it was a 1,000 Year Crisis and the Greatest Recession. Don't undersell it man.

    Everything good now is because of stuff Obama did, isn't it?
    Not necessarily everything, but a lot of the last years stock market trajectory started in 2014.
    meh

  18. #51278

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    Quote Originally Posted by Liare View Post
    by denying the ability to do territorial claims you're defacto denying the idea of ownership
    ...no you're not.

  19. #51279
    Donor erichkknaar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Liare View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by elmicker View Post
    It says nothing of the sort. It's designed to stop countries laying territorial claims to the moon and asteroids, not to stop people exploiting their resources. It even goes to some length to explain that "use" of space is absolutely fine.

    See also: moon rocks.
    and where does the enforcement of property rights spring from ?

    by denying the ability to do territorial claims you're defacto denying the idea of ownership of it vis-a-vis say land ownership on earth, that doesn't exclude use, say mining an astroid or the like, but it does exclude ownership as we see it on earth.
    My point was sort of that possession will de facto become 9/10ths of the law out there. Even in our wildest technological breakthrough dreams, the cops are months away.
    meh

  20. #51280
    Approaching Walrus's Avatar
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    This is the ideal capitalist future. You may not like it, but this is what peak capitalist space exploration looks like.

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