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Thread: USA Politics Thread

  1. #45901
    Liare's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Joe Appleby View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Nicholai Pestot View Post
    Trump is amazing. I've never seen anyone drive recruitment into left-wing political groups like him, both in America and abroad.

    He has completely destroyed the "both sides are the same" argument that suppressed left-wing voting and allowed a minority of right-wing extremists dictate policy.

    We really lucked out here. Could you imagine the damage that would have been done globally if the alt-right had supported someone with Trumps world view and Obama's charisma and competence? Instead of a long, slow boil drop into Facism, we instead have had a short, sharp slap in the face that shown everyone where the alt-right is heading with no way for them to weasle out of it.

    God bless ya Trump. You may have actually saved the world. Unintentionally.
    Only if the non-alt-right Republicans grow a spine and the Dems don't fuck it up.
    wont happen, the moderates will be purged and the democrats are the controlled opposition and will remain as such unless couped from below, labour style. the positive thing is that he's rapidly hastening the inevitable collapse of the American empire, i would not be entirely surprised if, through doing that, he ends up delivering a significant reduction in long term carbon emissions by moving the domestic political tensions up 10-15 years.
    Viking, n.:
    1. Daring Scandinavian seafarers, explorers, adventurers, entrepreneurs world-famous for their aggressive, nautical import business, highly leveraged takeovers and blue eyes.
    2. Bloodthirsty sea pirates who ravaged northern Europe beginning in the 9th century.

    Hagar's note: The first definition is much preferred; the second is used only by malcontents, the envious, and disgruntled owners of waterfront property.

  2. #45902

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    Quote Originally Posted by Joe Appleby View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Nicholai Pestot View Post
    Trump is amazing. I've never seen anyone drive recruitment into left-wing political groups like him, both in America and abroad.

    He has completely destroyed the "both sides are the same" argument that suppressed left-wing voting and allowed a minority of right-wing extremists dictate policy.

    We really lucked out here. Could you imagine the damage that would have been done globally if the alt-right had supported someone with Trumps world view and Obama's charisma and competence? Instead of a long, slow boil drop into Facism, we instead have had a short, sharp slap in the face that shown everyone where the alt-right is heading with no way for them to weasle out of it.

    God bless ya Trump. You may have actually saved the world. Unintentionally.
    Only if the non-alt-right Republicans grow a spine and the Dems don't fuck it up.
    Moderate right-wingers just need to be disgusted enough not to vote and an energised left will sweep it all. That's exactly what Trump is doing.

    So yeah, basically just on the left not to fuck it up now.

  3. #45903
    Liare's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nicholai Pestot View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Joe Appleby View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Nicholai Pestot View Post
    Trump is amazing. I've never seen anyone drive recruitment into left-wing political groups like him, both in America and abroad.

    He has completely destroyed the "both sides are the same" argument that suppressed left-wing voting and allowed a minority of right-wing extremists dictate policy.

    We really lucked out here. Could you imagine the damage that would have been done globally if the alt-right had supported someone with Trumps world view and Obama's charisma and competence? Instead of a long, slow boil drop into Facism, we instead have had a short, sharp slap in the face that shown everyone where the alt-right is heading with no way for them to weasle out of it.

    God bless ya Trump. You may have actually saved the world. Unintentionally.
    Only if the non-alt-right Republicans grow a spine and the Dems don't fuck it up.
    Moderate right-wingers just need to be disgusted enough not to vote and an energised left will sweep it all. That's exactly what Trump is doing.

    So yeah, basically just on the left not to fuck it up now.
    Viking, n.:
    1. Daring Scandinavian seafarers, explorers, adventurers, entrepreneurs world-famous for their aggressive, nautical import business, highly leveraged takeovers and blue eyes.
    2. Bloodthirsty sea pirates who ravaged northern Europe beginning in the 9th century.

    Hagar's note: The first definition is much preferred; the second is used only by malcontents, the envious, and disgruntled owners of waterfront property.

  4. #45904
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nicholai Pestot View Post
    Trump is amazing. I've never seen anyone drive recruitment into left-wing political groups like him, both in America and abroad.

    He has completely destroyed the "both sides are the same" argument that suppressed left-wing voting and allowed a minority of right-wing extremists dictate policy.

    We really lucked out here. Could you imagine the damage that would have been done globally if the alt-right had supported someone with Trumps world view and Obama's charisma and competence? Instead of a long, slow boil drop into Facism, we instead have had a short, sharp slap in the face that shown everyone where the alt-right is heading with no way for them to weasle out of it.

    God bless ya Trump. You may have actually saved the world. Unintentionally.
    BINGO

    He's fascist

    Careful not head hit on rock!
    laughs in Slovenian

  5. #45905
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nicholai Pestot View Post
    Trump is amazing. I've never seen anyone drive recruitment into left-wing political groups like him, both in America and abroad.

    He has completely destroyed the "both sides are the same" argument that suppressed left-wing voting and allowed a minority of right-wing extremists dictate policy.

    We really lucked out here. Could you imagine the damage that would have been done globally if the alt-right had supported someone with Trumps world view and Obama's charisma and competence? Instead of a long, slow boil drop into Facism, we instead have had a short, sharp slap in the face that shown everyone where the alt-right is heading with no way for them to weasle out of it.

    God bless ya Trump. You may have actually saved the world. Unintentionally.
    I wish I shared your optimism.
    Quote Originally Posted by Paul Mason
    It is absurd that we are capable of witnessing a 40,000 year old system of gender oppression begin to dissolve before our eyes yet still see the abolition of a 200 year old economic system as an unrealistic utopia.

  6. #45906
    Joe Appleby's Avatar
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    Sort of breaking news?

    https://www.bloomberg.com/news/artic...mp-report-says

    Kim Jong Un Wants a Peace Treaty From Trump
    nevar forget

  7. #45907
    Donor Pattern's Avatar
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    http://www.latimes.com/business/hilt...226-story.html
    Those fiscal geniuses in the White House and Republican-controlled Congress have managed to do the impossible: Their sabotage of the Affordable Care Act will lead to 6.4 million fewer Americans with health insurance, while the federal bill for coverage rises by some $33 billion per year.

    Also, by the way, premiums in the individual market will rise by an average of more than 18%.

    Heck of a job.

    These figures come from the Urban Institute, which on Monday released the first estimate of the impact of two GOP initiatives. The first is the elimination of the individual mandate, which is an offshoot of the GOP tax-cut measure signed by President Trump in December. The measure reduced the penalty for not carrying insurance to zero as of next Jan. 1.
    Low key shocker really. Not surprised this isn't news though.

  8. #45908

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    Quote Originally Posted by Nicholai Pestot View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Joe Appleby View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Nicholai Pestot View Post
    Trump is amazing. I've never seen anyone drive recruitment into left-wing political groups like him, both in America and abroad.

    He has completely destroyed the "both sides are the same" argument that suppressed left-wing voting and allowed a minority of right-wing extremists dictate policy.

    We really lucked out here. Could you imagine the damage that would have been done globally if the alt-right had supported someone with Trumps world view and Obama's charisma and competence? Instead of a long, slow boil drop into Facism, we instead have had a short, sharp slap in the face that shown everyone where the alt-right is heading with no way for them to weasle out of it.

    God bless ya Trump. You may have actually saved the world. Unintentionally.
    Only if the non-alt-right Republicans grow a spine and the Dems don't fuck it up.
    Moderate right-wingers just need to be disgusted enough not to vote and an energised left will sweep it all. That's exactly what Trump is doing.

    So yeah, basically just on the left not to fuck it up now.
    There is no left in a position to govern though. There's corrupt corporate Democrats that have succeeded in purging the reformers. They're going to fix the primary schedule (California and the southern 'Clinton firewall' voting earliest) to ensure that a corporate establishment democrat is the next candidate and run on virtue signalling and Trump is a Russian stooge rapist meanie but no actual policy. If they fuck up and a non-corrupt candidate manages to squeeze through then they wont have a big enough base in the Congress/Senate to pass meaningful reform.

    The odds of a Trump Mk 2 are pretty decent imho.

  9. #45909
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nax View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Nicholai Pestot View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Joe Appleby View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Nicholai Pestot View Post
    Trump is amazing. I've never seen anyone drive recruitment into left-wing political groups like him, both in America and abroad.

    He has completely destroyed the "both sides are the same" argument that suppressed left-wing voting and allowed a minority of right-wing extremists dictate policy.

    We really lucked out here. Could you imagine the damage that would have been done globally if the alt-right had supported someone with Trumps world view and Obama's charisma and competence? Instead of a long, slow boil drop into Facism, we instead have had a short, sharp slap in the face that shown everyone where the alt-right is heading with no way for them to weasle out of it.

    God bless ya Trump. You may have actually saved the world. Unintentionally.
    Only if the non-alt-right Republicans grow a spine and the Dems don't fuck it up.
    Moderate right-wingers just need to be disgusted enough not to vote and an energised left will sweep it all. That's exactly what Trump is doing.

    So yeah, basically just on the left not to fuck it up now.
    There is no left in a position to govern though. There's corrupt corporate Democrats that have succeeded in purging the reformers. They're going to fix the primary schedule (California and the southern 'Clinton firewall' voting earliest) to ensure that a corporate establishment democrat is the next candidate and run on virtue signalling and Trump is a Russian stooge rapist meanie but no actual policy. If they fuck up and a non-corrupt candidate manages to squeeze through then they wont have a big enough base in the Congress/Senate to pass meaningful reform.

    The odds of a Trump Mk 2 are pretty decent imho.
    i don't think it's going to be Trump mk. 2 it's just going to be trump beating up Clinton again.
    Viking, n.:
    1. Daring Scandinavian seafarers, explorers, adventurers, entrepreneurs world-famous for their aggressive, nautical import business, highly leveraged takeovers and blue eyes.
    2. Bloodthirsty sea pirates who ravaged northern Europe beginning in the 9th century.

    Hagar's note: The first definition is much preferred; the second is used only by malcontents, the envious, and disgruntled owners of waterfront property.

  10. #45910

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    Quote Originally Posted by Liare View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Nax View Post
    There is no left in a position to govern though. There's corrupt corporate Democrats that have succeeded in purging the reformers. They're going to fix the primary schedule (California and the southern 'Clinton firewall' voting earliest) to ensure that a corporate establishment democrat is the next candidate and run on virtue signalling and Trump is a Russian stooge rapist meanie but no actual policy. If they fuck up and a non-corrupt candidate manages to squeeze through then they wont have a big enough base in the Congress/Senate to pass meaningful reform.

    The odds of a Trump Mk 2 are pretty decent imho.
    i don't think it's going to be Trump mk. 2 it's just going to be trump beating up Clinton again.
    I think the most likely outcome is Trump loses to ineffective democrat which subsequently gives Trump Mk 2 a shot.

    Trump beating ineffectual Democrat is quite on the cards though if the economy goes full speed ahead until November 2020.

  11. #45911
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    Quote Originally Posted by Joe Appleby View Post
    Sort of breaking news?

    https://www.bloomberg.com/news/artic...mp-report-says

    Kim Jong Un Wants a Peace Treaty From Trump
    I'm sure he does. I'm also sure it will be in exchange for all of the sanctions being removed and im sure he will promise to give up his nuke program, but not to inspectors... And i'm sure Trump will agree and spend the next 6 months telling his supporter base that literally no one else could ever have done that except him, and they will love him for it.
    Quote Originally Posted by lubica
    And her name was Limul Azgoden, a lowly peasant girl.

  12. #45912
    Donor Pattern's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nax View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Liare View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Nax View Post
    There is no left in a position to govern though. There's corrupt corporate Democrats that have succeeded in purging the reformers. They're going to fix the primary schedule (California and the southern 'Clinton firewall' voting earliest) to ensure that a corporate establishment democrat is the next candidate and run on virtue signalling and Trump is a Russian stooge rapist meanie but no actual policy. If they fuck up and a non-corrupt candidate manages to squeeze through then they wont have a big enough base in the Congress/Senate to pass meaningful reform.

    The odds of a Trump Mk 2 are pretty decent imho.
    i don't think it's going to be Trump mk. 2 it's just going to be trump beating up Clinton again.
    I think the most likely outcome is Trump loses to ineffective democrat which subsequently gives Trump Mk 2 a shot.

    Trump beating ineffectual Democrat is quite on the cards though if the economy goes full speed ahead until November 2020.
    The complacency of centrists never ceases to amaze me.

  13. #45913
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lana Torrin View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Joe Appleby View Post
    Sort of breaking news?

    https://www.bloomberg.com/news/artic...mp-report-says

    Kim Jong Un Wants a Peace Treaty From Trump
    I'm sure he does. I'm also sure it will be in exchange for all of the sanctions being removed and im sure he will promise to give up his nuke program, but not to inspectors... And i'm sure Trump will agree and spend the next 6 months telling his supporter base that literally no one else could ever have done that except him, and they will love him for it.
    And he'd even be right for once.
    nevar forget

  14. #45914
    Alistair's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nicholai Pestot View Post
    Trump is amazing. I've never seen anyone drive recruitment into left-wing political groups like him, both in America and abroad.

    He has completely destroyed the "both sides are the same" argument that suppressed left-wing voting and allowed a minority of right-wing extremists dictate policy.

    We really lucked out here. Could you imagine the damage that would have been done globally if the alt-right had supported someone with Trumps world view and Obama's charisma and competence? Instead of a long, slow boil drop into Facism, we instead have had a short, sharp slap in the face that shown everyone where the alt-right is heading with no way for them to weasle out of it.

    God bless ya Trump. You may have actually saved the world. Unintentionally.
    So, massive Democrat sweep then in the Mid-terms?

    Quote Originally Posted by Nicholai Pestot View Post
    Moderate right-wingers just need to be disgusted enough not to vote and an energised left will sweep it all. That's exactly what Trump is doing.

    So yeah, basically just on the left not to fuck it up now.
    Well, my intention is to vote Democrat in the Mid-terms (Virginia) and almost assuredly the next presidential cycle.

    I've voted Independent/Libertarian mostly, and occasionally Republican.

    But Trump cannot have a 2nd term IMO.

    Judge for yourself what that means (since some here have described me as a ravenous rabid far right-wing extremist, not a moderate righty!)
    Last edited by Alistair; March 12 2018 at 03:07:32 PM.


  15. #45915
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alistair View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Nicholai Pestot View Post
    Trump is amazing. I've never seen anyone drive recruitment into left-wing political groups like him, both in America and abroad.

    He has completely destroyed the "both sides are the same" argument that suppressed left-wing voting and allowed a minority of right-wing extremists dictate policy.

    We really lucked out here. Could you imagine the damage that would have been done globally if the alt-right had supported someone with Trumps world view and Obama's charisma and competence? Instead of a long, slow boil drop into Facism, we instead have had a short, sharp slap in the face that shown everyone where the alt-right is heading with no way for them to weasle out of it.

    God bless ya Trump. You may have actually saved the world. Unintentionally.
    So, massive Democrat sweep then in the Mid-terms?
    All left-wing parties everywhere are more interested in a within-party struggle for ideological purity, not about beating their political opponents.

    (Not that the Democrats would be left-wing, but the US...)

    But I'd guess that the only reason the Democrats have any chance in the midterms is because of the infighting in the GOP.

    Le coeur a ses raisons que la raison ne connaît point. - Blaise Pascal, Pensées, 277

  16. #45916
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    Quote Originally Posted by Timaios View Post
    All left-wing parties everywhere are more interested in a within-party struggle for ideological purity, not about beating their political opponents.
    The trouble the left has is in trying to reform society using political systems descended from shoddy compromises made by aristocrats who suddenly found themselves poorer than merchants.

    Leftwing parties could stop playing ideological purity numberwang tomorrow and it wouldn't make a blind bit of difference in the majority of western nations.
    Quote Originally Posted by Paul Mason
    It is absurd that we are capable of witnessing a 40,000 year old system of gender oppression begin to dissolve before our eyes yet still see the abolition of a 200 year old economic system as an unrealistic utopia.

  17. #45917
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    Quote Originally Posted by Keckers View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Timaios View Post
    All left-wing parties everywhere are more interested in a within-party struggle for ideological purity, not about beating their political opponents.
    The trouble the left has is in trying to reform society using political systems descended from shoddy compromises made by aristocrats who suddenly found themselves poorer than merchants.

    Leftwing parties could stop playing ideological purity numberwang tomorrow and it wouldn't make a blind bit of difference in the majority of western nations.
    Well said.

    What would be your solution? Seems like "overthrow the system" might be asking a lot, given entrenched interests and massive social inertia.


  18. #45918
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alistair View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Keckers View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Timaios View Post
    All left-wing parties everywhere are more interested in a within-party struggle for ideological purity, not about beating their political opponents.
    The trouble the left has is in trying to reform society using political systems descended from shoddy compromises made by aristocrats who suddenly found themselves poorer than merchants.

    Leftwing parties could stop playing ideological purity numberwang tomorrow and it wouldn't make a blind bit of difference in the majority of western nations.
    Well said.

    What would be your solution? Seems like "overthrow the system" might be asking a lot, given entrenched interests and massive social inertia.
    Direct action, point out how stupid the world is and watch it burn while hoping society wakes up.
    Quote Originally Posted by Paul Mason
    It is absurd that we are capable of witnessing a 40,000 year old system of gender oppression begin to dissolve before our eyes yet still see the abolition of a 200 year old economic system as an unrealistic utopia.

  19. #45919
    Alistair's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Keckers View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Alistair View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Keckers View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Timaios View Post
    All left-wing parties everywhere are more interested in a within-party struggle for ideological purity, not about beating their political opponents.
    The trouble the left has is in trying to reform society using political systems descended from shoddy compromises made by aristocrats who suddenly found themselves poorer than merchants.

    Leftwing parties could stop playing ideological purity numberwang tomorrow and it wouldn't make a blind bit of difference in the majority of western nations.
    Well said.

    What would be your solution? Seems like "overthrow the system" might be asking a lot, given entrenched interests and massive social inertia.
    Direct action, point out how stupid the world is and watch it burn while hoping society wakes up.
    Society burning burns you along with it, doesn't it?

    I may hate my President, and many many things my country does, but I still want to live a good life, and enjoy life, so I hope the U.S. does well regardless.

    Society burning hurts me, and you, along with everyone else.

    Perhaps a less self-destructive plan is in order?


  20. #45920
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alistair View Post
    Society burning hurts me, and you, along with everyone else.

    Perhaps a less self-destructive plan is in order?
    I'm not the one self destructing. I'm fully aware of the futility of the power I hold in the grand scheme of things.
    Quote Originally Posted by Paul Mason
    It is absurd that we are capable of witnessing a 40,000 year old system of gender oppression begin to dissolve before our eyes yet still see the abolition of a 200 year old economic system as an unrealistic utopia.

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