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Thread: Trump Did Nothing Wrong [USA Politics Thread]

  1. #35761
    Smuggo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ralara View Post



    Watch T_D, Conspiracy etc over the next few hours. The narrative is going to change. Let's watch it in real time. Now he's admitted it and it's a GOOD THING! then the "there's 0% chance it happened" crew are about to do not only a 180 on whether he did it or not, but they're gonna up on the Z axis 90 degrees as well on the "now it's good" aspect.

    Watch twitter. Watch the bots. Watch facebook. Watch the memes on 9gag. 4chan. etc.

    Watch now as suddenly the narrative is changed.
    The doublethink is strong with hard-core Trumpers.

  2. #35762
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alistair View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Nicholai Pestot View Post
    Alistair is not dumb, he just has a fundamentally different world-view. Within that different world view his logic is sound.

    Example:

    The majority of us hold to the view that prison is primarily for protection of the public. With that goal we prioritise rehabilitation as a top goal because that reduces rates of re-offence, protecting the public over the long term.

    Alistair holds to the view that prison is primarily for punishment. With that goal he prioritises making prisoners as miserable as possible within the boundaries of the law, punishing more effectively.

    We and he can both build logically sound arguments upon these different fundamental premises and when we inevitably disagree each side thinks the other is creating straw-men, because we don't understand the basic view-point of the other.

    You should collectively value having Alistair here. He functions as a constant test of your arguments, ideology and beliefs and gives you a window into a different world view. Without him and others like him to argue with, you would end up in a protected little bubble of information as insular and divorced from reality as any Trump supporters.
    Apologies for quoting three pages ago (since I wasn't here for the extended discussion of me), but a few things.

    1. Thank you.

    2. I would like to clarify (perhaps) your presentation of my position in some ways I'd like to comment on:

    I agree that the primary purpose of prisons is to protect the public from those who would inflict harm upon them. I don't agree at all with the "as miserable as possible" portion, but neither should it be pleasant or comfortable life.

    I agree that the primary purpose of prison is to punish an individual for the harm they caused on the innocent.

    I would agree that a secondary purpose is to rehabilitate or reform individuals who can be, so then when their time is served, they can safely and successfully rejoin society.

    I would add that our prisons and criminal justice system here in the U.S. is seriously flawed: First, we incarcerate vastly too many non-violent and/or drug offenders who more appropriately belong in medical treatment. Second, we do not incarcerate murderers, rapists and white collar criminals (who often harm thousands or millions of people) near on long enough.

    And of course, the race issue and education issues must be addressed in criminal justice reform. Equal treatment for all, education for all.

    I believe we could find a reasonable position to agree on on this issue.
    Fun fact. America has more people in prison than the USSR gulag at its height!

  3. #35763
    Donor Aea's Avatar
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    No double-think. Just pick and choose your own explanation.

    Note: For maximum effect do not apply any further thought.

  4. #35764

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    Quote Originally Posted by Aea View Post
    No double-think. Just pick and choose your own explanation.

    Note: For maximum effect do not apply any further thought.
    Just make sure to keep your thumb in the book at the page where you chose your explanation, so if you don't like it or get one of the bad endings you can go back and make the other choice without starting the story over completely.

  5. #35765
    Donor Aea's Avatar
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    Don't need to do that. When confronted with contradicting but still apologist BS that was the truth all along.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

  6. #35766
    Lachesis VII's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Smuggo View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Alistair View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Nicholai Pestot View Post
    Alistair is not dumb, he just has a fundamentally different world-view. Within that different world view his logic is sound.

    Example:

    The majority of us hold to the view that prison is primarily for protection of the public. With that goal we prioritise rehabilitation as a top goal because that reduces rates of re-offence, protecting the public over the long term.

    Alistair holds to the view that prison is primarily for punishment. With that goal he prioritises making prisoners as miserable as possible within the boundaries of the law, punishing more effectively.

    We and he can both build logically sound arguments upon these different fundamental premises and when we inevitably disagree each side thinks the other is creating straw-men, because we don't understand the basic view-point of the other.

    You should collectively value having Alistair here. He functions as a constant test of your arguments, ideology and beliefs and gives you a window into a different world view. Without him and others like him to argue with, you would end up in a protected little bubble of information as insular and divorced from reality as any Trump supporters.
    Apologies for quoting three pages ago (since I wasn't here for the extended discussion of me), but a few things.

    1. Thank you.

    2. I would like to clarify (perhaps) your presentation of my position in some ways I'd like to comment on:

    I agree that the primary purpose of prisons is to protect the public from those who would inflict harm upon them. I don't agree at all with the "as miserable as possible" portion, but neither should it be pleasant or comfortable life.

    I agree that the primary purpose of prison is to punish an individual for the harm they caused on the innocent.

    I would agree that a secondary purpose is to rehabilitate or reform individuals who can be, so then when their time is served, they can safely and successfully rejoin society.

    I would add that our prisons and criminal justice system here in the U.S. is seriously flawed: First, we incarcerate vastly too many non-violent and/or drug offenders who more appropriately belong in medical treatment. Second, we do not incarcerate murderers, rapists and white collar criminals (who often harm thousands or millions of people) near on long enough.

    And of course, the race issue and education issues must be addressed in criminal justice reform. Equal treatment for all, education for all.

    I believe we could find a reasonable position to agree on on this issue.
    Fun fact. America has more people in prison than the USSR gulag at its height!
    To be fair, US prisons have a markedly lower incidence of mortality than Soviet gulags.

  7. #35767
    Dorvil Barranis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lachesis VII View Post
    To be fair, US prisons have a markedly lower incidence of mortality than Soviet gulags.
    Letting your prisoners die loses income for private prisons, plus lots of paper work and potential law suits and such.
    "Those who are skilled in combat do not become angered, those who are skilled at winning do not become afraid. Thus the wise win before they fight, while the ignorant fight to win." - Zhuge Liang


  8. #35768
    Phrixus Zephyr's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lachesis VII View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Smuggo View Post
      Spoiler:
    Quote Originally Posted by Alistair View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Nicholai Pestot View Post
    Alistair is not dumb, he just has a fundamentally different world-view. Within that different world view his logic is sound.

    Example:

    The majority of us hold to the view that prison is primarily for protection of the public. With that goal we prioritise rehabilitation as a top goal because that reduces rates of re-offence, protecting the public over the long term.

    Alistair holds to the view that prison is primarily for punishment. With that goal he prioritises making prisoners as miserable as possible within the boundaries of the law, punishing more effectively.

    We and he can both build logically sound arguments upon these different fundamental premises and when we inevitably disagree each side thinks the other is creating straw-men, because we don't understand the basic view-point of the other.

    You should collectively value having Alistair here. He functions as a constant test of your arguments, ideology and beliefs and gives you a window into a different world view. Without him and others like him to argue with, you would end up in a protected little bubble of information as insular and divorced from reality as any Trump supporters.
    Apologies for quoting three pages ago (since I wasn't here for the extended discussion of me), but a few things.

    1. Thank you.

    2. I would like to clarify (perhaps) your presentation of my position in some ways I'd like to comment on:

    I agree that the primary purpose of prisons is to protect the public from those who would inflict harm upon them. I don't agree at all with the "as miserable as possible" portion, but neither should it be pleasant or comfortable life.

    I agree that the primary purpose of prison is to punish an individual for the harm they caused on the innocent.

    I would agree that a secondary purpose is to rehabilitate or reform individuals who can be, so then when their time is served, they can safely and successfully rejoin society.

    I would add that our prisons and criminal justice system here in the U.S. is seriously flawed: First, we incarcerate vastly too many non-violent and/or drug offenders who more appropriately belong in medical treatment. Second, we do not incarcerate murderers, rapists and white collar criminals (who often harm thousands or millions of people) near on long enough.

    And of course, the race issue and education issues must be addressed in criminal justice reform. Equal treatment for all, education for all.

    I believe we could find a reasonable position to agree on on this issue.


    Fun fact. America has more people in prison than the USSR gulag at its height!
    To be fair, US prisons have a markedly lower incidence of mortality than Soviet gulags.
    Yeah, US cops usually kill you before you ever get to prison.
    Last edited by Phrixus Zephyr; July 17 2017 at 10:40:18 PM.

  9. #35769
    Lana Torrin's Avatar
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    I have some respect for trump apologists.. They have to try fucking hard and he doesn't make it easy for them. It's a real struggle they are under and they don't give up... Well, until they do.
    Quote Originally Posted by lubica
    And her name was Limul Azgoden, a lowly peasant girl.

  10. #35770
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    Actually an '06.

    EVE: OrangeAfroMan
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  11. #35771

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    Looks like "Repeal Obamacare" bill is dead in the Senate, because it's not repealing Obamacare hard enough.

    Two more Senate Republicans have declared their opposition to the latest effort to overhaul the nation’s health-care system, leaving the measure without sufficient support to pass and potentially ending a months-long effort to make good on a longstanding GOP campaign promise.

    Senator Moran (R-Kan.) said the bill “fails to repeal the Affordable Care Act or address healthcare’s rising costs.”
    https://www.washingtonpost.com/power...e83_story.html

  12. #35772
    OrangeAfroMan's Avatar
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    Hahahaha. Seven years to prepare and full government control and they can't pass a fucking bill
    Actually an '06.

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  13. #35773
    Lachesis VII's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by OrangeAfroMan View Post
    What makes you think he'll comply with the order?

  14. #35774

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    Quote Originally Posted by OrangeAfroMan View Post
    Hahahaha. Seven years to prepare and full government control and they can't pass a fucking bill
    > implying Republicans run for office to pass bills. This sets them up nicely for 2018, to run against Obamacare. Again.

  15. #35775
    OrangeAfroMan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lachesis VII View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by OrangeAfroMan View Post
    What makes you think he'll comply with the order?
    The secret service is doing the releasing
    Quote Originally Posted by Don Rumata View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by OrangeAfroMan View Post
    Hahahaha. Seven years to prepare and full government control and they can't pass a fucking bill
    > implying Republicans run for office to pass bills. This sets them up nicely for 2018, to run against Obamacare. Again.
    Haha, good point!
    Actually an '06.

    EVE: OrangeAfroMan
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  16. #35776
    Movember 2011Movember 2012 Nordstern's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by OrangeAfroMan View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Lachesis VII View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by OrangeAfroMan View Post
    What makes you think he'll comply with the order?
    The secret service is doing the releasing
    Quote Originally Posted by Don Rumata View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by OrangeAfroMan View Post
    Hahahaha. Seven years to prepare and full government control and they can't pass a fucking bill
    > implying Republicans run for office to pass bills. This sets them up nicely for 2018, to run against Obamacare. Again.
    Haha, good point!
    Ah, but a majority of Americans now like Obamacare. Democrats just need to get loud and demand a vote on the bill as-is, then paint the Republicans as weak for not allowing it. I see "bait-and-switch" and "flip-flopper" becoming campaign phrases.
    "Holy shit, I ask you to stop being autistic and you debate what autistic is." - spasm
    Quote Originally Posted by Larkonis Trassler View Post
    WTF I hate white people now...

  17. #35777

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    Now McConnell says that Senate will vote to simply repeal Obamacare, without anything to replace it.

    Senate Majority Leader Mitch McConnell on Monday night called for a vote on a bill to repeal Obamacare without an immediate replacement after the latest Republican effort to overhaul the U.S. health-care system failed.
    http://www.cnbc.com/2017/07/17/presi...ment-plan.html

  18. #35778
    Dorvil Barranis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Don Rumata View Post
    Now McConnell says that Senate will vote to simply repeal Obamacare, without anything to replace it.

    Senate Majority Leader Mitch McConnell on Monday night called for a vote on a bill to repeal Obamacare without an immediate replacement after the latest Republican effort to overhaul the U.S. health-care system failed.
    http://www.cnbc.com/2017/07/17/presi...ment-plan.html
    Fucking idiots. Glad I got my hernia surgery last year.
    "Those who are skilled in combat do not become angered, those who are skilled at winning do not become afraid. Thus the wise win before they fight, while the ignorant fight to win." - Zhuge Liang


  19. #35779
    Movember 2012 I Legionnaire's Avatar
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    This was the plan all along.

  20. #35780
    Frug's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lana Torrin View Post
    I have some respect for trump apologists.. They have to try fucking hard and he doesn't make it easy for them. It's a real struggle they are under and they don't give up... Well, until they do.
    I'm finding that over the past few weeks I'm hating Trump less, and finding the rage of the left at his existence tiresome and pathetic. I think it's getting easier for people to be an apologist for him. The non-stop outrage has become noise.

    When the economy doesn't get better though, because his promises of magic beans are unlikely to result in much value, they'll have a hard time explaining that other than to blame republicans.

    Quote Originally Posted by Loire
    I'm too stupid to say anything that deserves being in your magnificent signature.

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