hate these ads?, log in or register to hide them
Page 3 of 591 FirstFirst 1234561353103503 ... LastLast
Results 41 to 60 of 11816

Thread: St Louis - Muskets Thread (USA civil unrest)

  1. #41
    i mow lawns for a living Rai Deo's Avatar
    Join Date
    April 10, 2011
    Posts
    574
    Police deliberately firing into press, using smoke grenades to block their view, took control of Al Jazeera's camera lights and camera, tilting it down at the ground.
    http://www.ksdk.com/story/news/local...-gas/14042747/

  2. #42

  3. #43
    Donor TheManFromDelmonte's Avatar
    Join Date
    April 10, 2011
    Posts
    5,021
    good enough to copy paste, the guy who writes it does a good job on middle east / security stuff in general.

    1. One of the things that has always bothered me most about states rights libertarians is that in American history, state and local ...
    2. ... governments have often been the ones most effective at suppressing the rights of Americans, specifically African-Americans ...
    3. ... while it has often been the federal government that has stepped in -- from Little Rock to New Orleans -- to restore both order ...
    4. ... and the rights of the citizenry. This mess in Ferguson illustrates how dumb local police forces can be ...
    5. ... This, for example, is not a policeman who is about to win the trust of his fellow citizen: pic.twitter.com/6u8MCAZ5PT (pic of sniper nest in a bearcat)
    6. Ferguson is useful in that it separates those who actually worry about the power of the state from those who just ...
    7. ... hate Obama and want to wave a Gadsden Flag around with their friends. Americans of both parties and all races should ...
    8. ... be concerned when we see police forces on our streets that look like armies of occupation, not our fellow citizens.

  4. #44
    Tetsuo's Avatar
    Join Date
    August 7, 2013
    Posts
    2,066
    https://twitter.com/abumuqawama/stat...876160/photo/1


    Pretty much exactly the point here. No reason to be sighting down the crosshairs of a rifle unless you're planning on shooting the protestors.

  5. #45
    Approaching Walrus's Avatar
    Join Date
    March 8, 2013
    Posts
    7,403
    So anyone in Europe want to sponsor a work visa for me? #policestateblues

  6. #46
    Straight Hustlin's Avatar
    Join Date
    April 14, 2011
    Posts
    10,365
    Now we just need the US Army Airforce to come in and bomb them and it will be like black wall street all over again.

  7. #47
    FatFreddy's Avatar
    Join Date
    April 10, 2011
    Posts
    14,256
    Quote Originally Posted by Approaching Walrus View Post
    So anyone in Europe want to sponsor a work visa for me? #policestateblues
    google INDECT and think again



    Also, two weeks ago in Vienna: 1700 Police (total officers involved in the operation, they carted in young recruits from the most nazi-friendly province of Austria as they always do) reacted to a single occupied house, which was occupied after the shifty house owners literally invited punks to live there to get the old renters out. Backfired when punks teamed up with remaining renters, result:



    Numbers of punks was around 30-40.


    Although there are still differences, you will have a hard time finding anything above standard riot gear (shields, helmets, armor) in the pic. Cops with assault rifles are only seen at the airport, around embassies, jewish institutions and if shit is REALLY going down (heavy crime, hostage situations, shooting sprees...) and in the situation pictured above, they got them out by manual "labor" rather than gassing the shit out of them or similar (pepper spray is ofc used very, very liberally)

    Anyway, I am rambling and this Ferguson deal is not much different from your nowadays standard frat boy riot. And more people needs to realise this, primary factor is idiocy, not race or politics....
    Last edited by FatFreddy; August 14 2014 at 04:01:52 PM.
    Quote Originally Posted by QuackBot
    Pastry.. That the best you can do?
    Quote Originally Posted by NotXenosis View Post

    M8, i have discussions that spam multiple accounts, you aren't even on my level

  8. #48
    Keorythe's Avatar
    Join Date
    April 11, 2011
    Posts
    2,369
    Quote Originally Posted by FatFreddy View Post
    1700 Police (total officers involved in the operation

    Numbers of punks was around 30-40.


    Although there are still differences, you will have a hard time finding anything above standard riot gear (shields, helmets, armor) in the pic. Cops with assault rifles are only seen at the airport, around embassies, jewish institutions and if shit is REALLY going down.
    Numerical superiority is awesome when you can get it. If you don't have that option then you need to go as heavy as possible or you end up with the UK riots. The fact is that LEO's are usually going to be outnumbered. So you disperse crowds early to keep them from getting too big. If crowds get big and realize that you can't offer any control then you're in trouble as the crowd turns to a mob.

    Firearms are also a worry so rifle plates and chest rigs are going to be much more common in the States.

    UK riots are a perfect example of how fast things can escalate and what happens when you don't have the manpower and/or equipment to suppress a mob early.


    And if you lose control or go in too light you end up with.....

    Last edited by Keorythe; August 14 2014 at 04:11:00 PM.

  9. #49
    FatFreddy's Avatar
    Join Date
    April 10, 2011
    Posts
    14,256
    Quote Originally Posted by Keorythe View Post

    UK riots are a perfect example of how fast things can escalate and what happens when you don't have the manpower and/or equipment to suppress a mob early.
    Yeah they made the british police look a lot better than the rioters; there was a lot of property damage but a surprisingly low count of death/inury (5/16 if my wiking has any merit :f). Hard to create/get into a situation of overwhelming aggression and violence if the police simply don't sport the tools for it but rather try actual policing.

    A police force is not an army.
    Last edited by FatFreddy; August 14 2014 at 04:15:42 PM.
    Quote Originally Posted by QuackBot
    Pastry.. That the best you can do?
    Quote Originally Posted by NotXenosis View Post

    M8, i have discussions that spam multiple accounts, you aren't even on my level

  10. #50
    Donor TheManFromDelmonte's Avatar
    Join Date
    April 10, 2011
    Posts
    5,021
    Quote Originally Posted by FatFreddy View Post
    Yeah they made the british police look a lot better than the rioters; there was a lot of property damage but a surprisingly low count of death/inury (5/16 if my wiking has any merit :f). Hard to create/get into a situation of overwhelming aggression and violence if the police simply don't sport the tools for it but rather try actual policing.
    At the time there was one death mentioned, more may have come to light after. That one death was a hit and run with a car in birmingham (which actually says something else, these spread across the country and we shouldn't use the term London riots.)

    And a lot, A LOT, of the people involved were arrested in the following months due to the pervasive CCTV. It's difficult to draw real conclusions from them and use of force though, partly due to the police response being so weak and partly due to heavy involvement of organised crime who provoked them in places to rob stores.

  11. #51
    FatFreddy's Avatar
    Join Date
    April 10, 2011
    Posts
    14,256
    Quote Originally Posted by TheManFromDelmonte View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by FatFreddy View Post
    Yeah they made the british police look a lot better than the rioters; there was a lot of property damage but a surprisingly low count of death/inury (5/16 if my wiking has any merit :f). Hard to create/get into a situation of overwhelming aggression and violence if the police simply don't sport the tools for it but rather try actual policing.
    At the time there was one death mentioned, more may have come to light after. That one death was a hit and run with a car in birmingham (which actually says something else, these spread across the country and we shouldn't use the term London riots.)
    Yep those numbers are from the "London riots" wiki page, totals after the riots had ended.

    And a lot, A LOT, of the people involved were arrested in the following months due to the pervasive CCTV. It's difficult to draw real conclusions from them and use of force though, partly due to the police response being so weak and partly due to heavy involvement of organised crime who provoked them in places to rob stores.
    I concur. I do think that it could have gotten a lot worse though, since these riots always start with "omg police brutality", so the last thing you want is to fuel that fire.

    I'd rather have property damage than loss of life and fake ghetto martyrs :f
    Quote Originally Posted by QuackBot
    Pastry.. That the best you can do?
    Quote Originally Posted by NotXenosis View Post

    M8, i have discussions that spam multiple accounts, you aren't even on my level

  12. #52
    Orar Ironfist's Avatar
    Join Date
    April 10, 2011
    Location
    Adversity
    Posts
    2,281
    Quote Originally Posted by Lana Torrin View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Orar Ironfist View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Malcanis View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Mordax View Post
    America is a police state. I've seen soldiers less kitted out than those "cops"
    It's almost like time changes and gear gets updated.
    Except your police force is not supposed to be armed like your military. Literally no good can come of this.
    It's not armed like our military. I know this because my brothers a cop and I'm military. It's similar, but considering our population is large and has access to firearms it makes sense. I would not want to get put in front of 1,000 angry people with just hopes and dreams that they won't get violent and decide to bash my skull in with a rock.
    Quote Originally Posted by LordsServant
    I know all about botting because I know all about almost everything in eve.

  13. #53
    ValorousBob's Avatar
    Join Date
    April 13, 2011
    Location
    ( ͡ ͜ʖ ͡)
    Posts
    4,441
    Quote Originally Posted by Lana Torrin View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Tetsuo View Post
    The paintball guns shoot paintballs filled with pepper spray. I've been in a group that was hit by those and it sucks.


    What fucking idiot thought the police should be wearing something that looks similar to MARPAT should probably be fired for gross stupidity though.
    Yeah. Dont they know its grey and black for urban combat. Green and tan is for wilderness.
    That's actually something that has always confused me. They wear camoflage that's clearly not relevant, and bring gear/weapon attachments that are clearly pointless. I'm pretty sure that at this point, they're just playing dress-up with as many toys as they can get their hands on.

  14. #54
    Keorythe's Avatar
    Join Date
    April 11, 2011
    Posts
    2,369
    Quote Originally Posted by ValorousBob View Post
    They wear camoflage that's clearly not relevant, and bring gear/weapon attachments that are clearly pointless.
    I covered the camo issue earlier. But curiously, what gear/weapon attachments do you believe are pointless?

  15. #55
    Alistair's Avatar
    Join Date
    April 9, 2011
    Posts
    13,287
    Quote Originally Posted by TheManFromDelmonte View Post
    good enough to copy paste, the guy who writes it does a good job on middle east / security stuff in general.

    1. One of the things that has always bothered me most about states rights libertarians is that in American history, state and local ...
    2. ... governments have often been the ones most effective at suppressing the rights of Americans, specifically African-Americans ...
    3. ... while it has often been the federal government that has stepped in -- from Little Rock to New Orleans -- to restore both order ...
    4. ... and the rights of the citizenry. This mess in Ferguson illustrates how dumb local police forces can be ...
    5. ... This, for example, is not a policeman who is about to win the trust of his fellow citizen: pic.twitter.com/6u8MCAZ5PT (pic of sniper nest in a bearcat)
    6. Ferguson is useful in that it separates those who actually worry about the power of the state from those who just ...
    7. ... hate Obama and want to wave a Gadsden Flag around with their friends. Americans of both parties and all races should ...
    8. ... be concerned when we see police forces on our streets that look like armies of occupation, not our fellow citizens.
    Trying to make an obvious case of overreach and rights abuse by the State, in the form of it's armed police force, into a criticism of pro-rights Libertarians.

    Lol.

    As for the rioting et. al.

    Protest after a decision, if you feel the law was not properly enforced or some other injustice occured.

    Rioting and looting against innocent bystanders BEFORE the actual investigation can be done, much less before the Justice System can be followed to it's conclusion, that's just ridiculous.

    Rioting, violence and lawlessness before even an investigation can be done.....is simply not the way a civil lawful society works.

    If the cop was in the wrong, the full force of the law should be levied against him.

    Based on proof and evidence.

    No the anger of a lawless mob.

    I'd also say the abuse of Journalists rights is also something that needs looked at, and prosecuted, for the State has no authority to revoke rights at their own convenience.

    Something that should be remembered at all times, not just now.


  16. #56
    Tetsuo's Avatar
    Join Date
    August 7, 2013
    Posts
    2,066
    Quote Originally Posted by Keorythe View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by ValorousBob View Post
    They wear camoflage that's clearly not relevant, and bring gear/weapon attachments that are clearly pointless.
    I covered the camo issue earlier. But curiously, what gear/weapon attachments do you believe are pointless?
    Well, the entire M4 itself for starters. There is literally no feasible scenario in which it would be acceptable for the police to be firing carbines into a crowd of protestors. Even if people in the crowd started shooting at police with rifles, any non retarded command person would withdraw his officers over shooting into a crowd. So the M4 is pointless.

    Further to that, the 6 spare magazines on the front of the vest are also entirely useless as the only thing more unlikely than call for the police to use their M4s is for those police to find themselves in a prolonged firefight requiring several reloads.

    The whole thing is as ridiculous and counterproductive as the camouflage. All it's doing is making the crowd more hostile and making the Police look like assholes.



    Also relevant;

    The 9 principles of policing

    2.To recognise always that the power of the police to fulfil their functions and duties is dependent on public approval of their existence, actions and behaviour, and on their ability to secure and maintain public respect.
    3.To recognise always that to secure and maintain the respect and approval of the public means also the securing of the willing co-operation of the public in the task of securing observance of laws.
    4.To recognise always that the extent to which the co-operation of the public can be secured diminishes proportionately the necessity of the use of physical force and compulsion for achieving police objectives
    They're doing a shit job of policing. They haven't secured the public's trust, they haven't stopped the violence, they haven't defused the situation, and they've damaged quite badly their public image especially in the community they're supposed to serve.

  17. #57
    Straight Hustlin's Avatar
    Join Date
    April 14, 2011
    Posts
    10,365
    Quote Originally Posted by Tetsuo View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Keorythe View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by ValorousBob View Post
    They wear camoflage that's clearly not relevant, and bring gear/weapon attachments that are clearly pointless.
    I covered the camo issue earlier. But curiously, what gear/weapon attachments do you believe are pointless?
    Well, the entire M4 itself for starters. There is literally no feasible scenario in which it would be acceptable for the police to be firing carbines into a crowd of protestors. Even if people in the crowd started shooting at police with rifles, any non retarded command person would withdraw his officers over shooting into a crowd. So the M4 is pointless.

    Further to that, the 6 spare magazines on the front of the vest are also entirely useless as the only thing more unlikely than call for the police to use their M4s is for those police to find themselves in a prolonged firefight requiring several reloads.

    The whole thing is as ridiculous and counterproductive as the camouflage. All it's doing is making the crowd more hostile and making the Police look like assholes.



    Also relevant;

    The 9 principles of policing

    2.To recognise always that the power of the police to fulfil their functions and duties is dependent on public approval of their existence, actions and behaviour, and on their ability to secure and maintain public respect.
    3.To recognise always that to secure and maintain the respect and approval of the public means also the securing of the willing co-operation of the public in the task of securing observance of laws.
    4.To recognise always that the extent to which the co-operation of the public can be secured diminishes proportionately the necessity of the use of physical force and compulsion for achieving police objectives
    They're doing a shit job of policing. They haven't secured the public's trust, they haven't stopped the violence, they haven't defused the situation, and they've damaged quite badly their public image especially in the community they're supposed to serve.
    Sorry guys, the rioters don't approve of us stopping them from looting & burning down random peoples business; pack it up and lets go home.

  18. #58
    FatFreddy's Avatar
    Join Date
    April 10, 2011
    Posts
    14,256
    the hilarity of a guy with the nickname "straight hustlin" arguing like this over a situation like this
    Quote Originally Posted by QuackBot
    Pastry.. That the best you can do?
    Quote Originally Posted by NotXenosis View Post

    M8, i have discussions that spam multiple accounts, you aren't even on my level

  19. #59
    Pacefalm's Avatar
    Join Date
    April 9, 2011
    Posts
    6,361
    Quote Originally Posted by Straight Hustlin View Post
    Sorry guys, the rioters don't approve of us stopping them from looting & burning down random peoples business; pack it up and lets go home.
    The point is if they were doing a good enough job before then maybe not the entire population would jump at the opportunity to oppose them
    Quote Originally Posted by QuackBot View Post
    I'm doing my best. Well. Not really.

  20. #60
    Straight Hustlin's Avatar
    Join Date
    April 14, 2011
    Posts
    10,365
    Quote Originally Posted by FatFreddy View Post
    the hilarity of a guy with the nickname "straight hustlin" arguing like this over a situation like this
    Kinda hard to hustle when the corner stores on fire and there's riot police.

    Quote Originally Posted by Pacefalm View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Straight Hustlin View Post
    Sorry guys, the rioters don't approve of us stopping them from looting & burning down random peoples business; pack it up and lets go home.
    The point is if they were doing a good enough job before then maybe not the entire population would jump at the opportunity to oppose them
    So ~500 people out of 22000 is the entire population?

Bookmarks

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •