Jihadist Caliphate LLC. Extremist Thunderdome's everywhere.

[Rakshasa The Cat]

Hahahahahaha. I mean sure, schools aren't closed to people from certain backgrounds due to laws, but when all the better off people move out of an area, the areas turn into effectively ghettos which in turn means that the schools have only a certain type of students. That is true all over the world even without the Hauptschule / Gymnasium split. The German split just reinforces this.

50% of my students are on Hartz IV, the rest is just above minimum wage. Really well off students are extremely rare. And that can be found across the nation, as statistics can show you (the senate of Berlin has all school statistics online and public, excerpts, list generator from full statistics, specific schools).

This reminds me a bit about the gender equality issue in Scandinavian universities; the more equal the access to opportunities got, the more pronounced the gender differences have become. Basically in a society where equality is maximized, the differences in preferences of each gender also gets maximized.

In this case the socio-economic group the children come from dominates their choice of school as that is the only real factor involved, as they know they'll have a decent enough life as-is and thus have no strong incentive to work against it.

[UsernameisValidandNotinUs]

There are no special good schools for rich people, or special good universities for rich people, its all about ability.

oh boy

I wonder if this is true in literally any country? I doubt it.

Wasn't true even for (late) USSR.

Yeah but then all the oligarchs sent their kids to study abroad as soon as the wall came down

So i dunno if it was any good before then

[W0lf Crendraven]

There are no special good schools for rich people, or special good universities for rich people, its all about ability.

oh boy

I wonder if this is true in literally any developed country? I doubt it, but just don't have the scope of knowledge to know for sure.

It is true for Germany though. At least mostly.

[Zeekar]

There are no special good schools for rich people, or special good universities for rich people, its all about ability.

oh boy

I wonder if this is true in literally any developed country? I doubt it, but just don't have the scope of knowledge to know for sure.

It is true for Germany though. At least mostly.

[Stoffl]

There are no special good schools for rich people, or special good universities for rich people, its all about ability.

oh boy

I wonder if this is true in literally any developed country? I doubt it, but just don't have the scope of knowledge to know for sure.

It is true for Germany though. At least mostly.

[W0lf Crendraven]

It is though, some cities like Berlin are very well known for their problems with their schools (parts of the city are a giant dump of workless social failures) but in general that isn't the case.

There is are very few private schools of note, and going there means little in the long run, everyone goes to public schools. And getting into those is a matter of grades and where you live. And universities only really care about grades, if any entrance requirements exist at all, bar the abitur, for 70% or so of degrees school grades are irrelevant.

[Stoffl]

Nope.
See last page

[Frug]

A study from 2012, released slightly after the material I used for my MA Ed studies:

https://www.vodafone-stiftung.de/all...f921626eb87bc7

In German, includes some reasons for the low social mobility.

I need to find my old material from uni, but I expect to have ... lost that.

The studies might have plenty of valid points explaining why people don't do it, but your choice of wording implies something different.

[metacannibal]

50% of my students are on Hartz IV, the rest is just above minimum wage. Really well off students are extremely rare. And that can be found across the nation, as statistics can show you (the senate of Berlin has all school statistics online and public, excerpts, list generator from full statistics, specific schools).

So first it was about how the Germans have a totally unfair school system (FREE UP TO FUCKING PHD WITH A BLOODY FREE STATE GRANTED STUDENT LOAN SYSTEM FFS, TOTALLY UNFAIR!!!).
Then its about SOCIAL MOBILITY and how Germany is AWFUL. Because its hard to make a case how a school system with free access for everyone is unfair.
So SOCIAL MOBILITY IT IS.
OECD says GERMANY RIGHT THERE IN THE MIDDLE and ahead of countries of comparative size or bigger. What works with 5 million oil sponsored scandinavians isnt something you can necessarily replicate to 85m people.

So now we get to the bottom of it, a point I made before.

You are a fucking east german and actually complain about that your ghetto part of the country, and yes fucking berlin is part of that, its the ghetto of all ghettos, are no longer living in an ENTITLEMENT but PERFORMANCE based system. Your complaints are based off a background where 50!!!! of the people are having a perpetual vacation paid for by the state in state sponsored flats with state sponsored money to buy not only food but also all kinds of useless consumption shit, after all most HARTZ4 are actually fat idiots who smoke, so they cant be starving and they seem to be able to afford cigs.

So again, since social mobility is SO BAD in Germany, whats your suggestion? SOCIALISM HAS LEFT THE ROOM AND IS NOT COMING BACK. You fail to realize that the wealth employed to carry your shit-environment forward is only possible in performance based societies, or want to go back to 5hp plastic cars and no bananas "GDR"?

You think there is no social mobility because there is no PRESSURE on the fuckers making them MOVE. The mobility is there.

See the world from a different point of view and travel or whatever. Ask a random black dude on the south side of chicago about all that safety, free education, free flats, free university access, no police shooting niggers. You would be suprised how he would judge that social mobility with such favours. Or that random kid in shithole africa.

[erichkknaar]

Ask a random black dude on the south side of chicago about all that safety, free education, free flats, free university access, no police shooting niggers.

I'm trying to imagine what would happen if some random German guy actually showed up on Cabrini green and actually did this. In those words.

There are probably about 9 movies in there.

[Joe Appleby]

I stopped reading when you make this about me being East German.

I work in West Berlin. Former British Sector to be a bit more precise.

Tapapapatalk

[Varcaus]

Being German not even once.

[W0lf Crendraven]

Nope.
See last page

There is nothing on the last page about that, bar joe claiming his school isnt very nice which is understandable because he is A: In berlin, the biggest slum in the country and B: in the worst kind of school. The previous page was about social mobility mostly, and that had nothing to do with different schools for different wealth. The fact is that if a workers kid is smart enough it goes to the same school any rich kid goes to.

Also, despite all of the above i still maintain that its a fair system. That the system has to reach out and massively help a certain type of kid just so it has a chance to be equal to the normal ones, and it often fails to do so, doesnt make it unfair. Kids with proletarian parents are practically disabled, which sucks. But you dont call the football world cup unfair because there are no people with wheel chairs playing, do you?


I have spoken with my fair share of kids from the Hauptschule, they were all, every single one, dumb as bricks. Sure, thats anecdotal evidence at most but still.

[Elriche Oshego]

Germans calling Berlin a slum.

My fucking sides!

[metacannibal]

Ask a random black dude on the south side of chicago about all that safety, free education, free flats, free university access, no police shooting niggers.

I'm trying to imagine what would happen if some random German guy actually showed up on Cabrini green and actually did this. In those words.

There are probably about 9 movies in there.

64th Parkway Gardens!

[W0lf Crendraven]

Germans calling Berlin a slum.

My fucking sides!

Big parts of it are.

[metacannibal]

I stopped reading when you make this about me being East German.

I work in West Berlin. Former British Sector to be a bit more precise.

Tapapapatalk

I find it highly amusing that you consider east german an insult, do you by that imply that I am correct in my estimation that east germany are a disgrace and want to distance yourself from them?

[Don Rumata]

I stopped reading when you make this about me being East German.

I work in West Berlin. Former British Sector to be a bit more precise.

Yes, but you work in West Berlin as a Stasi agent.

[W0lf Crendraven]

I stopped reading when you make this about me being East German.

I work in West Berlin. Former British Sector to be a bit more precise.

Tapapapatalk

I find it highly amusing that you consider east german an insult, do you by that imply that I am correct in my estimation that east germany are a disgrace and want to distance yourself from them?

M8, a bit more effort please.

[evil edna]

Being German not even once.