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Thread: Oculus/Facebook merger

  1. #1221
    Keckers's Avatar
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    So you're moving goalposts?

    Just look at this forum and the number of people with high end gaming rigs, VR isn't even mainstream here.
    Quote Originally Posted by Paul Mason
    It is absurd that we are capable of witnessing a 40,000 year old system of gender oppression begin to dissolve before our eyes yet still see the abolition of a 200 year old economic system as an unrealistic utopia.

  2. #1222

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    Quote Originally Posted by rufuske View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Alex Caine View Post
    I take it back. I said "nobody is arguing that it's going to become mainstream", but it appears that Lallante is.

    I can't see it. As stated, i love my Rift (it even makes Mechwarrior Online fun!), but i'm NOT an average consumer. I'm a nerd with a large amount of disposable income, with a wife that is also a gamer so she "gets it", and doesn't mind me spending a few hours every so often dead to the outside world.

    Thats a pretty nichce thing.
    MW:O supports vr? Since when?
    Not natively...got to hack it up a bit with something like VorpX, but it works:
    https://steamcommunity.com/app/34220...7935546497398/

    To be fair, i should clarify that it DID work, when i still played MWO at all. I'm assuming it hasn't broken since, but caveat emptor on this.

    More importantly though, last info (from March) is that mechwarrior 5 will have VR support from the ground up.

  3. #1223
    Smuggo's Avatar
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    ze goalposts have moved again...

  4. #1224
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lana Torrin View Post
    I do feel the argument for this is along the same lines as 3d TVs aren't dead and the industry never expected to make any money.

    Sales of VR headsets and games are well below where they were expected to be. Pretty much anyone that wanted a vive or rift picked it up in the first few weeks. Since then sales globally have been recorded in the single digit hundreds a week.. Any other device that can only sell a few hundred units a week globally is an out and out failure. The wiiu was the laughing stock of the games industry and when it was canceled years after being introduced it was still selling a few thousand a week.

    VR focused game companies are going broke after getting 80% market penetration. There isn't a big enough market to sell to.

    VR is dead.

    Live with it.
    There is a market, but not at that price point. And prices are coming down.
    Hiro Cor

  5. #1225

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    Quote Originally Posted by Keckers View Post
    So you're moving goalposts?

    Just look at this forum and the number of people with high end gaming rigs, VR isn't even mainstream here.
    Can't seize the means of production in VR so our Comrades are not impressed.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lana Torrin View Post
    I do feel the argument for this is along the same lines as 3d TVs aren't dead and the industry never expected to make any money.

    Sales of VR headsets and games are well below where they were expected to be. Pretty much anyone that wanted a vive or rift picked it up in the first few weeks. Since then sales globally have been recorded in the single digit hundreds a week.. Any other device that can only sell a few hundred units a week globally is an out and out failure. The wiiu was the laughing stock of the games industry and when it was canceled years after being introduced it was still selling a few thousand a week.

    VR focused game companies are going broke after getting 80% market penetration. There isn't a big enough market to sell to.

    VR is dead.

    Live with it.
    This has nothing to do with 3dTVs, and i strongly suspect anybody who ever though the expensive VR headsets are going to become 'mainstream' is a fucking moron, but once down in price it sure as hell has a market.

    Afaik Sony is pretty happy with the PS VR for example, and even suffered supply shortages, so don't go telling me this shit is dead as i strongly suspect you're talking out of your ass. You're willfully ignoring one of the products available in this conversation too which is hilarious.
    Last edited by Isyel; July 13 2017 at 12:49:24 PM.

  6. #1226
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    It's dead Jim.

  7. #1227
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    VRIP
    My Attorney has advised me to remove my new signature until further notice...

  8. #1228

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    Quote Originally Posted by Smuggo View Post
    It's dead Jim.
    More alive than communism.

  9. #1229

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    Quote Originally Posted by erichkknaar View Post
    All the R&D has built a platform the next 10 years of PC high end simming, and some other niche experiences will really be able to leverage to the great benefit of the community. That's definitely not nothing. The drone community probably also does in some ways, as the latency improvements really help out the FPV guys in that community too. I don't think the investors necessarily get the most immediate return, but the tech developed continues to improve and I'm pretty sure some novel uses will come.
    Nope, because thats all still uncompressed VGA, because bandwidth and compression/decompression latency. Some folks are working on it to get it down, but it still is in the 100-80ms range, 4 times too slow. Even if you get the timing right, you need much more bandwidth which requires bigger hardware.

  10. #1230
    Donor erichkknaar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Torashuu View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by erichkknaar View Post
    All the R&D has built a platform the next 10 years of PC high end simming, and some other niche experiences will really be able to leverage to the great benefit of the community. That's definitely not nothing. The drone community probably also does in some ways, as the latency improvements really help out the FPV guys in that community too. I don't think the investors necessarily get the most immediate return, but the tech developed continues to improve and I'm pretty sure some novel uses will come.
    Nope, because thats all still uncompressed VGA, because bandwidth and compression/decompression latency. Some folks are working on it to get it down, but it still is in the 100-80ms range, 4 times too slow. Even if you get the timing right, you need much more bandwidth which requires bigger hardware.
    Wireless VR headsets have the same problem, is what I'm saying...
    meh

  11. #1231

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    Nah mate, its not the same problem, because FPV doesn't have it. Unless you are a numbnuts who can't deal with anything less than full HD screens. And contrary to your headset and desktop PC, on a quad you don't have infinite space for antennas or a powersupply practially without limit. Then there is the bit where if you use mutliple channels, you can't fly with mates anymore because you are hogging all the bands. Latency is but a tiny bit of the equation of choosing your FPV setup.

  12. #1232
    Donor erichkknaar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Torashuu View Post
    Nah mate, its not the same problem, because FPV doesn't have it. Unless you are a numbnuts who can't deal with anything less than full HD screens. And contrary to your headset and desktop PC, on a quad you don't have infinite space for antennas or a powersupply practially without limit. Then there is the bit where if you use mutliple channels, you can't fly with mates anymore because you are hogging all the bands. Latency is but a tiny bit of the equation of choosing your FPV setup.
    I understand all that. I'm saying that you will still benefit from the research they are still going to do on immersive full-space technology.
    meh

  13. #1233

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    edit: I'm a idiot, you are correct erichkknaar. Currently NTSC/PAL encoding is used, if they manage to come up with a faster encoding system I'll be more than happy to use it. That and lower delay in the camera hardware.
    Last edited by Torashuu; July 15 2017 at 06:58:23 AM.

  14. #1234
    Donor erichkknaar's Avatar
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    The goal would be getting it in the 2-18ms range.
    meh

  15. #1235
    Specially Pegged Donor Overspark's Avatar
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    An interesting read for people who like sci-fi books is Rainbows End by Vernor Vinge. It is a very credible look into the "near" future where AR is ubiquitous.

    IMHO AR/VR (yes there is a distinction between the two but it'll become more blurry in the future) definitely is going to be more prevalent than smartphones are right now, but it is going to take a hell of a lot of technological improvements and thus time before we get there. Facebook and Valve aren't idiots, this stuff was never going to be paying for itself at this point in time.

    I'm a nerd gamer with decent disposable income wanting to buy and play E : D on a VR rig and I haven't bought a Vive/Rift yet. Waiting for a more affordable 2nd generation with better tech before I take the plunge. Current discounts are tempting but still not tempting enough.

  16. #1236
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    Quote Originally Posted by Overspark View Post
    I'm a nerd gamer with decent disposable income wanting to buy and play E : D on a VR rig and I haven't bought a Vive/Rift yet. Waiting for a more affordable 2nd generation with better tech before I take the plunge. Current discounts are tempting but still not tempting enough.
    That is what I would like to do too. Instead I have head tracking and got myself a nice 27 1440p for some nice fidelity (because mega ultrawide is unpractical for me).

    My guess is that we should better wait a couple of gpu generations together with a MK II Rift/Vive with whatever they can mash in it technology- or performance-wise (be it better screens, higher res, lower price or a more seamless, polished experience). What we got right now is nice but not worth the money IMO. Especially on the GPU front :/
    <Devec> hello captain Tyrehl
    <Devec> sailor of the persian seas
    Quote Originally Posted by Paradox
    I swear you are some sort of biological weapon developed in the early '90's for the Yugoslav wars but they lost track of you at some point and now you're waging a psychological war on Western Europe without a clue what you're doing.

  17. #1237

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    And people here keep ignoring the existence of PS VR but at least they're the ones actually pushing towards making this more widespread and affordable, which is good for the health of the tech overall.

  18. #1238
    Specially Pegged Donor Overspark's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Isyel View Post
    And people here keep ignoring the existence of PS VR but at least they're the ones actually pushing towards making this more widespread and affordable, which is good for the health of the tech overall.
    We're mostly PC gamers in here and the PS VR is the least impressive hardware from a technical perspective. I agree it's doing it's job by making VR more approachable, but it's a follower, not a leader.

  19. #1239
    Donor erichkknaar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Overspark View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Isyel View Post
    And people here keep ignoring the existence of PS VR but at least they're the ones actually pushing towards making this more widespread and affordable, which is good for the health of the tech overall.
    We're mostly PC gamers in here and the PS VR is the least impressive hardware from a technical perspective. I agree it's doing it's job by making VR more approachable, but it's a follower, not a leader.
    It IS the market leader, however.

  20. #1240
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    Quote Originally Posted by erichkknaar View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Overspark View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Isyel View Post
    And people here keep ignoring the existence of PS VR but at least they're the ones actually pushing towards making this more widespread and affordable, which is good for the health of the tech overall.
    We're mostly PC gamers in here and the PS VR is the least impressive hardware from a technical perspective. I agree it's doing it's job by making VR more approachable, but it's a follower, not a leader.
    It IS the market leader, however.
    It is, and its a pretty good example of why VR isn't going to 'suddenly get better'. As a unit its running on generally lower performance hardware than your average PC VR, has a lower resolution screen, worse sensors (is in its less accurate, not inaccurate, just less than the other 2) and generally agreed that its of a lower standard than both the Vive and the Rift. Almost everyone that has used and and also used a Vive or Rift say the Vive and Rift are better, and yet its still the best seller.. That says the market does not care about the quality or higher specs, it cares about the price. That doesnt mean that quality isn't important (it is) but it means that people aren't willing to pay more for a better experience, presumably because they don't put a very high value on that experience.

    HTC and Facebook aren't stupid, they have seen this.. This is why the talk for the next generation has shifted from 'better quality, higher resolution' to 'price reduction, wireless'.. They are following the market.
    Quote Originally Posted by lubica
    And her name was Limul Azgoden, a lowly peasant girl.

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