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Thread: Oculus/Facebook merger

  1. #1121
    Smuggo
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    Quote Originally Posted by Torashuu View Post
    Your missing the point: It takes time for technology to mature enough before it has a chance at mainstream appeal. VR/AR are still in their first generation comercial release, and it cannot be reasonably expected to have widespread adoption right out the gate. You cannot expect it get widespread adoption before the current drawbacks have been circumvented, if that happens at all.

    As for your statements on what people want out of technology, a cursory examination of history will show people will not know something is usefull before it is there or figure out it has a use other than intented that does make it attractive.

    Though I guess we should prize ourselves lucky with your presence, since you seem to be able to predict future consumer trends. On that note, why are you not a billionaire yet?
    I agree with your first para.

    But I don't think it ultimately has wide, mass market appeal. It is always going to be fairly niche as a product. You're not going to find one in every home in the future. It just doesn't offer an experience everyone can and will partake in as radio, TV or the internet do.

    Also this is not its first generation, VR has been around for donkey's years. I remember using the VR machine in the Trocadero when I was maybe 11 or 12 years old.

  2. #1122
    Sandzibar's Avatar
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    Sounds like my old TrackIR is still the way to go for the time being for sims then.

    So its not quite as full on immersive as a 'proper' VR headset.. but it doesnt cost much.. doesnt need a hefty PC... and as it uses your monitor it also doesnt have shitty resolution issues.

  3. #1123

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    Quote Originally Posted by Smuggo View Post

    I agree with your first para.

    But I don't think it ultimately has wide, mass market appeal. It is always going to be fairly niche as a product. You're not going to find one in every home in the future. It just doesn't offer an experience everyone can and will partake in as radio, TV or the internet do.

    Also this is not its first generation, VR has been around for donkey's years. I remember using the VR machine in the Trocadero when I was maybe 11 or 12 years old.
    And I am saying, you cannot know if it has mass market appeal before the tech has matured. Because you do not know what form such a mature technology has.

    As a tech it will stick around, especially now (big)business has seen to benefit of VR/AR. Because if your boss tells you to strap a gobblygook to your head to you don't have much choice, and it means money for the hardware developers to make it more broadly applicable.
    Last edited by Torashuu; July 11 2017 at 04:18:39 PM.

  4. #1124
    Smuggo
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    Quote Originally Posted by Torashuu View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Smuggo View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Torashuu View Post
    Your missing the point: It takes time for technology to mature enough before it has a chance at mainstream appeal. VR/AR are still in their first generation comercial release, and it cannot be reasonably expected to have widespread adoption right out the gate. You cannot expect it get widespread adoption before the current drawbacks have been circumvented, if that happens at all.

    As for your statements on what people want out of technology, a cursory examination of history will show people will not know something is usefull before it is there or figure out it has a use other than intented that does make it attractive.

    Though I guess we should prize ourselves lucky with your presence, since you seem to be able to predict future consumer trends. On that note, why are you not a billionaire yet?
    I agree with your first para.

    But I don't think it ultimately has wide, mass market appeal. It is always going to be fairly niche as a product. You're not going to find one in every home in the future. It just doesn't offer an experience everyone can and will partake in as radio, TV or the internet do.

    Also this is not its first generation, VR has been around for donkey's years. I remember using the VR machine in the Trocadero when I was maybe 11 or 12 years old.
    And I am saying, you cannot know if it has mass market appeal before the tech has matured. Because you do not know what form such a mature technology has.
    So if it turns into something completely different from what it is now it will have mass appeal? ok...

  5. #1125

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sandzibar View Post
    Sounds like my old TrackIR is still the way to go for the time being for sims then.

    So its not quite as full on immersive as a 'proper' VR headset.. but it doesnt cost much.. doesnt need a hefty PC... and as it uses your monitor it also doesnt have shitty resolution issues.
    I don't want to be a VR shill because it certainly has a way to go.

    But, having used them both....there is no similarity between playing a racer or sim with TrackIR, and playing in VR. You'd think there would be, because it's just "immersion", but that honestly doesn't begin to cover it.

    Problem is that you can't really convey that without experiencing it, which i think is major issue the VR firms have.

    (also the resolution honestly isnt a problem when you are playing).

  6. #1126
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    What needs does VR address though? To have mass appeal a product has to address a need that can be easily identified by members of key demographics.

    VR provides immersion, but it isn't addressing a 'need' by providing immersion.
    Quote Originally Posted by Paul Mason
    It is absurd that we are capable of witnessing a 40,000 year old system of gender oppression begin to dissolve before our eyes yet still see the abolition of a 200 year old economic system as an unrealistic utopia.

  7. #1127
    Smuggo
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alex Caine View Post

    Problem is that you can't really convey that without experiencing it, which i think is major issue the VR firms have.
    This is exactly what I'm getting at. TV, radio, even the internet, you can see someone else use it and instantly understand the benefit and just benefit from it yourself.

    But VR, like 3D, means you need all the kit and gotta put something and so on, people just won't do it and thus won't be exposed to it and therefore it will never gain mass market appeal.

  8. #1128
    Donor Sparq's Avatar
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    As an aside (am in bed about to sleep, cannot into long post) I was hot for Google Glass and am sad it got shelved. Ultimately it didn't have a broad enough use case but I would have loved having one for tasks, especially as it would have grown to incorporate Assistant. I also think it had some misfortune in being unnecessarily politicised back when people were really freaking out about silicon valley gentrification - that was the final nail.

    I was also hot for Project Ara and very sad the big G didn't go all-in on it because in the long term I think it could have been strongly pro-consumer.

  9. #1129

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    Quote Originally Posted by Smuggo View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Alex Caine View Post

    Problem is that you can't really convey that without experiencing it, which i think is major issue the VR firms have.
    This is exactly what I'm getting at. TV, radio, even the internet, you can see someone else use it and instantly understand the benefit and just benefit from it yourself.

    But VR, like 3D, means you need all the kit and gotta put something and so on, people just won't do it and thus won't be exposed to it and therefore it will never gain mass market appeal.
    Oh, i agree with people that say its not mass market. I doubt it ever will be.

    I was just pointing out that it is honestly a totally different (and better) experience than just "TrackIR up close". which some people think of it as.

  10. #1130
    Sandzibar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alex Caine View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Smuggo View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Alex Caine View Post

    Problem is that you can't really convey that without experiencing it, which i think is major issue the VR firms have.
    This is exactly what I'm getting at. TV, radio, even the internet, you can see someone else use it and instantly understand the benefit and just benefit from it yourself.

    But VR, like 3D, means you need all the kit and gotta put something and so on, people just won't do it and thus won't be exposed to it and therefore it will never gain mass market appeal.
    Oh, i agree with people that say its not mass market. I doubt it ever will be.

    I was just pointing out that it is honestly a totally different (and better) experience than just "TrackIR up close". which some people think of it as.
    Well i will bow to your knowledge and experience with both entities.

    Maybe I will pick up a headset when they are dirt cheap and give it a go.

  11. #1131

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sandzibar View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Alex Caine View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Smuggo View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Alex Caine View Post

    Problem is that you can't really convey that without experiencing it, which i think is major issue the VR firms have.
    This is exactly what I'm getting at. TV, radio, even the internet, you can see someone else use it and instantly understand the benefit and just benefit from it yourself.

    But VR, like 3D, means you need all the kit and gotta put something and so on, people just won't do it and thus won't be exposed to it and therefore it will never gain mass market appeal.
    Oh, i agree with people that say its not mass market. I doubt it ever will be.

    I was just pointing out that it is honestly a totally different (and better) experience than just "TrackIR up close". which some people think of it as.
    Well i will bow to your knowledge and experience with both entities.

    Maybe I will pick up a headset when they are dirt cheap and give it a go.
    Try one first if you get the chance, but it's honestly great IF you can drop the cash on one and not care.
    It's not something i would ever "aspire" to owning though...its just a really cool add on.

  12. #1132
    Smuggo
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alex Caine View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Smuggo View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Alex Caine View Post

    Problem is that you can't really convey that without experiencing it, which i think is major issue the VR firms have.
    This is exactly what I'm getting at. TV, radio, even the internet, you can see someone else use it and instantly understand the benefit and just benefit from it yourself.

    But VR, like 3D, means you need all the kit and gotta put something and so on, people just won't do it and thus won't be exposed to it and therefore it will never gain mass market appeal.
    Oh, i agree with people that say its not mass market. I doubt it ever will be.

    I was just pointing out that it is honestly a totally different (and better) experience than just "TrackIR up close". which some people think of it as.
    Yeah I have never doubted it is a good experience and I wasn't attempting to do so there either.

  13. #1133
    Super Moderator Global Moderator QuackBot's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Duckslayer View Post

    Basically this. Its incredible to try.
    That was my topkek of the day to play online. Yeah i also want this to be the defining characteristic of the republican nominee voter.

  14. #1134
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    'Summer or Rift' price drop to 399 USD for six weeks with Touch included.
    https://arstechnica.com/gaming/2017/...99-with-touch/

  15. #1135
    Donor erichkknaar's Avatar
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    A very smart man whom I respect immensely once said to me if you want your game to be successful, never require peripherals.

    I think this probably holds true. I'm happy for the current VR R&D, because I think it's going to be excellent for sims and other things like driving games. Experiences where you are seated, and moving you head around controls your viewpoint as you ride your sim bicycle or whatever.

    It's never really going to be that much bigger than the dudes who already buy warthogs and fake cockpits, because it kind of appeals to those same dudes. People sure are throwing a lot of R&D money into it though.

  16. #1136

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    Quote Originally Posted by erichkknaar View Post
    A very smart man whom I respect immensely once said to me if you want your game to be successful, never require peripherals.

    I think this probably holds true. I'm happy for the current VR R&D, because I think it's going to be excellent for sims and other things like driving games. Experiences where you are seated, and moving you head around controls your viewpoint as you ride your sim bicycle or whatever.

    It's never really going to be that much bigger than the dudes who already buy warthogs and fake cockpits, because it kind of appeals to those same dudes. People sure are throwing a lot of R&D money into it though.
    I mostly agree, but i would add that i'm not a massive sim gamer, have never bought a Warthog of cockpit, and yet enjoy my VR headset enormously.

    I think i'd personally rephrase your point to "it appeals to tech/gaming enthusiasts", rather than just sim ones. Still very much the niche end of the market though.

    Personally, when it comes to mass appeal, i expect AR to be much bigger in the long run. It's so much more useful on a day to day level.

  17. #1137
    Donor erichkknaar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alex Caine View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by erichkknaar View Post
    A very smart man whom I respect immensely once said to me if you want your game to be successful, never require peripherals.

    I think this probably holds true. I'm happy for the current VR R&D, because I think it's going to be excellent for sims and other things like driving games. Experiences where you are seated, and moving you head around controls your viewpoint as you ride your sim bicycle or whatever.

    It's never really going to be that much bigger than the dudes who already buy warthogs and fake cockpits, because it kind of appeals to those same dudes. People sure are throwing a lot of R&D money into it though.
    I mostly agree, but i would add that i'm not a massive sim gamer, have never bought a Warthog of cockpit, and yet enjoy my VR headset enormously.

    I think i'd personally rephrase your point to "it appeals to tech/gaming enthusiasts", rather than just sim ones. Still very much the niche end of the market though.

    Personally, when it comes to mass appeal, i expect AR to be much bigger in the long run. It's so much more useful on a day to day level.
    What I mean is that there will be some good stuff, but I think VRs longevity is in the enthusiast market, not the consumer market.

  18. #1138

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    Quote Originally Posted by erichkknaar View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Alex Caine View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by erichkknaar View Post
    A very smart man whom I respect immensely once said to me if you want your game to be successful, never require peripherals.

    I think this probably holds true. I'm happy for the current VR R&D, because I think it's going to be excellent for sims and other things like driving games. Experiences where you are seated, and moving you head around controls your viewpoint as you ride your sim bicycle or whatever.

    It's never really going to be that much bigger than the dudes who already buy warthogs and fake cockpits, because it kind of appeals to those same dudes. People sure are throwing a lot of R&D money into it though.
    I mostly agree, but i would add that i'm not a massive sim gamer, have never bought a Warthog of cockpit, and yet enjoy my VR headset enormously.

    I think i'd personally rephrase your point to "it appeals to tech/gaming enthusiasts", rather than just sim ones. Still very much the niche end of the market though.

    Personally, when it comes to mass appeal, i expect AR to be much bigger in the long run. It's so much more useful on a day to day level.
    What I mean is that there will be some good stuff, but I think VRs longevity is in the enthusiast market, not the consumer market.
    Yep. Which is a problem, because the enthusiast market certainly can't cover the money firms are sinking into R&D.
    So either they have misjudged massively (unlikely for all of them), or they plan to use the tech/bits of it in more widespread situations later on and see a market that will develop, somehow.

  19. #1139
    Donor erichkknaar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alex Caine View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by erichkknaar View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Alex Caine View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by erichkknaar View Post
    A very smart man whom I respect immensely once said to me if you want your game to be successful, never require peripherals.

    I think this probably holds true. I'm happy for the current VR R&D, because I think it's going to be excellent for sims and other things like driving games. Experiences where you are seated, and moving you head around controls your viewpoint as you ride your sim bicycle or whatever.

    It's never really going to be that much bigger than the dudes who already buy warthogs and fake cockpits, because it kind of appeals to those same dudes. People sure are throwing a lot of R&D money into it though.
    I mostly agree, but i would add that i'm not a massive sim gamer, have never bought a Warthog of cockpit, and yet enjoy my VR headset enormously.

    I think i'd personally rephrase your point to "it appeals to tech/gaming enthusiasts", rather than just sim ones. Still very much the niche end of the market though.

    Personally, when it comes to mass appeal, i expect AR to be much bigger in the long run. It's so much more useful on a day to day level.
    What I mean is that there will be some good stuff, but I think VRs longevity is in the enthusiast market, not the consumer market.
    Yep. Which is a problem, because the enthusiast market certainly can't cover the money firms are sinking into R&D.
    So either they have misjudged massively (unlikely for all of them), or they plan to use the tech/bits of it in more widespread situations later on and see a market that will develop, somehow.
    I think the people that started oculus and those who joined like Abrash and Carmack are probably realistic about it but Zuckerberg and the coat tail riders who came with him massively miscalculated, tbh.

  20. #1140
    Smuggo
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    No guys it'll be as popular as the mobile phone...

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