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Thread: Star trek!

  1. #2621
    Movember 2012 Zekk Pacus's Avatar
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    I mean did we prefer treknobabble from the TNG era when everything, and I do mean everything, could be solved by reversing the polarity of the deflector dish?

    Disco season 2 was 2 steps forward 2 steps back for me - too many plotlines that don't really go anywhere and an over-reliance on making literally everything seem like it's galaxy ending, but much better writing for Burnham and some of the other characters. I enjoyed the Saru arc quite a bit.

    The problem they're going to have is the same problem they had in season 1 squared - they're implementing all this epoc-altering tech and not even attempting to explain how they're going to get rid of it before everyone is jammed into their TOS starting positions. At least taking Discovery 1,000 years into the future solves the problem of why that doesn't exist anymore.
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  2. #2622
    Lachesis VII's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zekk Pacus View Post
    I mean did we prefer treknobabble from the TNG era when everything, and I do mean everything, could be solved by reversing the polarity of the deflector dish?

    Disco season 2 was 2 steps forward 2 steps back for me - too many plotlines that don't really go anywhere and an over-reliance on making literally everything seem like it's galaxy ending, but much better writing for Burnham and some of the other characters. I enjoyed the Saru arc quite a bit.

    The problem they're going to have is the same problem they had in season 1 squared - they're implementing all this epoc-altering tech and not even attempting to explain how they're going to get rid of it before everyone is jammed into their TOS starting positions. At least taking Discovery 1,000 years into the future solves the problem of why that doesn't exist anymore.

  3. #2623
    mewninn's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zekk Pacus View Post
    I mean did we prefer treknobabble from the TNG era when everything, and I do mean everything, could be solved by reversing the polarity of the deflector dish?

    Disco season 2 was 2 steps forward 2 steps back for me - too many plotlines that don't really go anywhere and an over-reliance on making literally everything seem like it's galaxy ending, but much better writing for Burnham and some of the other characters. I enjoyed the Saru arc quite a bit.

    The problem they're going to have is the same problem they had in season 1 squared - they're implementing all this epoc-altering tech and not even attempting to explain how they're going to get rid of it before everyone is jammed into their TOS starting positions. At least taking Discovery 1,000 years into the future solves the problem of why that doesn't exist anymore.
    TNG didn't seem that obnoxious compared to the other shows

    But really they need to calm it down with some standard Trek episodes that explore the universe and the characters. Action can still matter even when there's no galaxy spanning event happening.

    This stuff always becomes a matter of upping the ante until there are no more antes to up. If they keep it up S7 of Disco will have purple dude snapping his fingers to erase half the galaxy

  4. #2624
    Straight Hustlin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mewninn View Post
    TNG didn't seem that obnoxious compared to the other shows
    I think a lot of this is merely rose tinted glasses. I have been rewatching TNG as my bed-time fall asleep program and its just as a bad as any of the others. Why just last night (S5E13) Geordi Leforge has the Eureka moment of realizing he can use the technology in his visor to apply the pulse compression routines to the multiphasic tractor beam so that with a few modifications they wont overload the power conduits and redirect the neutron star stellar fragment and save the genetically engineered societ, remarking at the irony, that he a blind man wouldve never been allowed to exist in it.

  5. #2625
    Specially Pegged Donor Overspark's Avatar
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    TNG technobabble was the golden standard of shitty star trek technobabble. All series after that were just pretenders to the throne and just shitty in the same way but not in new and more hurtful ways. Discovery technobabble was very bearable IMHO.

    Season 2 was worse than season 1 in my opinion because everyone had to fucking cry at everything all the time, for minutes on end (dear god that Saru dying swan scene was nerve grating). Other than that it was mostly OK, there was some good Star Trek in there somewhat obscured by fucky writing and directing which we can't really blame the actors for.

  6. #2626
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    If you would actually watch TNG the technobabble was seldom the point. Every problem they had was solved in a way made clear to the audience. The technobabble was mainly for framing

    Solving problems by changing the deflector polarity was a mainly a Voyager thing, it was rare in 7 seasons of TNG. It did happen but less often than people think

    Most people don't know or understand this including the shysters making STD
    Last edited by Paradox; July 30 2019 at 07:43:32 PM.


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  7. #2627
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    My main issue with Discovery though was my stupid expectation that maybe in this episode or maybe in the next one they will actually start traveling and discovering new things. And they kept not doing that which sucked.

  8. #2628
    Lachesis VII's Avatar
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    Well maybe S3 will change that.

  9. #2629
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    Quote Originally Posted by Straight Hustlin View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by mewninn View Post
    TNG didn't seem that obnoxious compared to the other shows
    I think a lot of this is merely rose tinted glasses. I have been rewatching TNG as my bed-time fall asleep program and its just as a bad as any of the others. Why just last night (S5E13) Geordi Leforge has the Eureka moment of realizing he can use the technology in his visor to apply the pulse compression routines to the multiphasic tractor beam so that with a few modifications they wont overload the power conduits and redirect the neutron star stellar fragment and save the genetically engineered societ, remarking at the irony, that he a blind man wouldve never been allowed to exist in it.
    It's the difference between trying to talk up to your audience, and v. obviously talking down to them. TNG technobabble might have ultimately been nonsense, but you could tell the writers cared, and were trying. STD meanwhile doesn't give a shit about the tech talk, and then also inserted awkward inappropriate modern phraseology (YUMMY!) that feels like it was tacked on with a pickaxe by someone who drives to work in a Lambo convertible and thinks all the viewers are stupid popcorn shovelers.

    I like that they attempted to give the bridge crew on Discovery more characterization, some of those bits were really nice and made them feel more like people rather than literal set dressing. But then yeah, two hours of crying over Saru when you know damn well he's not going to die, or introducing a backstory for a character that didn't even have a name until that episode for the express purpose of making us care when she did die, that shit was more obnoxious to me than any lines about reversing the polarity of the deflector dish.
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  10. #2630
    Lachesis VII's Avatar
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    I actually expected that Saru might die. :dunno:

  11. #2631
    mewninn's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Straight Hustlin View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by mewninn View Post
    TNG didn't seem that obnoxious compared to the other shows
    I think a lot of this is merely rose tinted glasses. I have been rewatching TNG as my bed-time fall asleep program and its just as a bad as any of the others. Why just last night (S5E13) Geordi Leforge has the Eureka moment of realizing he can use the technology in his visor to apply the pulse compression routines to the multiphasic tractor beam so that with a few modifications they wont overload the power conduits and redirect the neutron star stellar fragment and save the genetically engineered societ, remarking at the irony, that he a blind man wouldve never been allowed to exist in it.
    Nah I did recent rewatch of TNG. There's just more conflicts that are resolved by the characters rather than a eureka tech moment. Technobabble is used as a framing like someone said

    The difference between TNG writing and say VOY is that Picard would've told Worf to invert the shield deflector to send out a polaron beam and disable the Romulan warbirds. Instead they counter-ambush the Romulans with Klingon warbirds and tell them "You might get us, but we'll also get you"
    Last edited by mewninn; July 30 2019 at 11:33:47 PM.

  12. #2632
    VARRAKK's Avatar
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    If you watch the old star trek shows today, you won't see its importance of the time.
    The ground breaking part with Star Trek was never the story, but the cast and its inclusiveness.

    Thanks to Star Trek you don't notice it anymore, because it is now the norm.
    Gender/sexuality/race equality.

  13. #2633

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    Quote Originally Posted by Zekk Pacus View Post
    I mean did we prefer treknobabble from the TNG era when everything, and I do mean everything, could be solved by reversing the polarity of the deflector dish?
    Honestly, yes, a little bit. The 2nd last episode of Disco S2 is a really good example of the nonsensical, pseudo-realistic, overly in-your-face and immersion breaking technobabble and bad analogies.

    First we get the exchange that's a bit like:

    Show: "We don't have a suit!"
    Me: "Well you could always rebuild one based on the plans you've had for six episodes..."
    Show: "We can build one right away?"
    Me: "And you didn't do that six episodes ago... why?"
    Show: "Oh the suit was coded to Burnham's mom's DNA"
    Me: "Ok, so Burnham is going to have to pilot it, i mean i dont get why they can't change the coding if they're building a new suit but whatever"
    Burnham: "THAT MEANS MY mRNA IS THE CLOSEST MATCH, I MUST PILOT THE SUIT"
    Me: "...they're not even the same thing"

    Then later, in the very same episode, when they spend four minutes dragging out the ~big reveal~ that it's going to be a one way trip, there are literally six lines explaining why charging the thing is going to be like a waterfall flowing into a cup which means it's a one way trip which means she isn't coming back which means she's stuck in the future which means it's a very sad thing, cue crying.

    It's just bad fucking dialog trying to be clever. Technobabble should be short, sharp and papering over the gulf between the fictional universe's mechanics and our understanding of reality, not some pissant writer trying to show how often they read /r/science and beating us around the head with information that is, to someone even remotely sensible, blindingly obvious

  14. #2634
    Lachesis VII's Avatar
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    Don’t disagree with that, but there are plenty of instances of over reliance on macguffin technology in Star Trek. See, e.g., all of Voyager.

    I do agree that the attempt to ground some of the technobabble in present-day science is awkward because it will get things wrong. If you’re making up the science you don’t have to worry about that.
    Last edited by Lachesis VII; July 31 2019 at 03:56:01 PM.

  15. #2635
    Donor Verite Rendition's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by elmicker View Post
    It's just bad fucking dialog trying to be clever. Technobabble should be short, sharp and papering over the gulf between the fictional universe's mechanics and our understanding of reality, not some pissant writer trying to show how often they read /r/science and beating us around the head with information that is, to someone even remotely sensible, blindingly obvious
    It's Moffat Syndrome.
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  16. #2636
    Crystalline Entity's Avatar
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    "I think we could all do with sitting back a bit and detaching ourselves from the situation to really think about how these issues reflect on our future and how we discuss them here and be a bit less aggressive or defensive because everyone has a complicated set of circumstances that has led the to place importance on particular issues and it doesn't meany any of them is less valid, we just need to look at the broader picture"

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  17. #2637
    Lachesis VII's Avatar
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    No Nog cameo for us.

    Sucks that he passed so young.
    Last edited by Lachesis VII; September 22 2019 at 05:54:52 PM.

  18. #2638
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    He was older than I expected. Does that mean that... I am older than I expected?

    How old are we? Are we old now? Is that why everyone we know is dying? Shit.


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  19. #2639

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    He was 24 playing best friend to a 15 year old. So probably just older than you thought.

    I never would have guessed either.

  20. #2640
    Lachesis VII's Avatar
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    Yeah. Nog was supposed to be 16 at the start of DS9; Aaron was rather older.

    But yes some of us are approaching middle age. Folks start dying, etc.

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