Bitcoin

[Cerzi]

Some pretty funny reactions from people who don't seem to understand this here.

I'm on the "its a good idea - clever use of tech" side. Regardless of whether you think you'd use it or not, it's the first time I've seen/heard of a decentralized digital currency, one that has inherent value rather than merely attributed value. CCP can inject ISK into the game whenever they want to, same with any other virtual world currency. In the real world, banks have the capacity to arbitrarily print paper money (obviously they're regulated but they're physical able to). Nobody has the power to create bitcoins out of thin air whenever they please - generating/mining bitcoins requires a substantial investment in hardware.

Yes, a subtantial investment in hardware. I recently upgraded to a new PC, a 2500K sandybridge, which generates around 4300khash/s. According to this calculator, it will be 1291 days running non-stop at this speed before I have a 50% chance of generating, or 5581 days before I have a 95% chance. That's over 10 years of processing time and even then not a guaranteed chance of receiving *50* bitcoins. It's analogous with me wandering around in the gold rush era with my shiny new pick axe that I bought for playing games on, and hoping to strike gold. Maybe if I dug around for 10 years I'd hit some.

[Lusulpher]

Good replies so far. So, I thought that the majority of our ~problems~ ie the Greece going apeshit, Portugal, Ireland etc... were because banks printed too much amount of money to give it to people, business and institution. So when investors were like "hey, I'd like my money back" major shitstorm ensued, or something. But with "marked" money, ie money with an actual id number, banks cannot print any money with nothing to back up this "new" money because it would be considered worthless by the system. It become impossible to print new money backed only by the promise of debt generating wealth. And I have no clue where I'm going with this drunk post. Sorry I know it sounds like a Lulsupher poast. It's hard to express what I mean with my limited english. I remember watching a documentary about the financial system and how it's fucked and one of the proposal was this kind of stuff.

Nope.

American derivatives on bundled mortgages purposely given to first-time homeowners for the purpose of tainting the market.
Then when the companies sank their clients, and collected payouts based on bets AGAINST THEM, the clients gave them ownership of entire communities/economies to make up for the real estate/actual asset amount...Which could not possibly be cashed out in paper. So, governments thought about bankruptcy, even the profitable Socialist Euro ones[decades of money gone in months]...
Banks moved in to pull made up numbers from those countries and then ran to their governments saying the sky was falling...they would know, they rigged it to blow.
And trust me, they got all the Treasuries or they removed Social programmes for the citizens. Greece and Spain/everyone else will never again escape the World banks interest payments. They are now as enslaved as Cuba/Haiti/everyone else. They call it

They are still seizing homes from American families that DON'T owe them! Bundled means they Socialistically-bonded your property to some random person on the planet. And if he stops out of righteous rage. They evict you too. And your presidents can't touch them.

Glorious Chess moves really, wish I had thought of it. We might never see a land grab this big again, HOPEFULLY...[Knights Templar in France was centuries ago]. And this makes Katrina condo gentrification grab, look like a chumpish smash-n'-grab.

itt: Entrepreneurs realizing economies are highly tiered pyramid schemes. And money is based entirely on illusion. Everyone waits for banhammer, because it's only lassez faire, IF you are allowed to play The Game by their rrrrrules. Carry on.


Funfact: NOBODY can explain exactly what a 'derivative' is. Even though it's fair to call it a rigged bet/cheating/organized theft by the last few years of investigations.

"mitigating possible instability caused by central banks. There is a limited controlled inflation hardcoded in the Bitcoin software, but it is predictable and known to all parties in advance.[4] Inflation cannot therefore be centrally manipulated to effect redistribution of value from general users."
Oh yeah, Means of Production not regulated by anyone higher than the direct producer. That hammer is coming. Socialized currency must be murdered.

[Pacefalm]

Oh lulsulpher, never stop posting

[Lusulpher]

Oh lulsulpher, never stop posting

Won't. Iceland nearly lost their shit over England calling up for a grocery chain, because of unregulated derivatives. And TARP came out of my pocket. I could build a space colonization program on Mars for that much money.

Then I wouldn't have to put up with toxic assets...Mars is much safer than this economic model.

[Pacefalm]

I was being sarcastic

[Lallante]

Nope.

American derivatives on bundled mortgages purposely given to first-time homeowners for the purpose of tainting the market.
Then when the companies sank their clients, and collected payouts based on bets AGAINST THEM, the clients gave them ownership of entire communities/economies to make up for the real estate/actual asset amount...Which could not possibly be cashed out in paper. So, governments thought about bankruptcy, even the profitable Socialist Euro ones[decades of money gone in months]...
Banks moved in to pull made up numbers from those countries and then ran to their governments saying the sky was falling...they would know, they rigged it to blow.
And trust me, they got all the Treasuries or they removed Social programmes for the citizens. Greece and Spain/everyone else will never again escape the World banks interest payments
They are now as enslaved as Cuba/Haiti/everyone else. They call it

[b]They are still seizing homes from American families that DON'T owe them![/b] Bundled means they Socialistically-bonded your property to some random person on the planet. And if he stops out of righteous rage. They evict you too. And your presidents can't touch them.

I just have to cut out here to say this is completely fucking lunacy and not how it works AT ALL. Holders of bundled derrivatives dont get foreclosure rights on the bundled debt - they dont even get enforcement rights. Its complete nonsense to suggest that the default of a different borrower bundled with your debt can lead to the foreclosure of your house even if you aren't in default. Complete and utter bullshit.

Glorious Chess moves really, wish I had thought of it. We might never see a land grab this big again, HOPEFULLY...[Knights Templar in France was centuries ago]. And this makes Katrina condo gentrification grab, look like a chumpish smash-n'-grab.

itt: Entrepreneurs realizing economies are highly tiered pyramid schemes. And money is based entirely on illusion. Everyone waits for banhammer, because it's only lassez faire, IF you are allowed to play The Game by their rrrrrules. Carry on.


Funfact: NOBODY can explain exactly what a 'derivative' is. Even though it's fair to call it a rigged bet/cheating/organized theft by the last few years of investigations.

Wrong. A derivative is simply the commodatisation of a risk (usually bundled). Noone can explain exactly what risks go in to a SPECIFIC derivative, that's true. Theres nothing rigged about it, derivatives are still heavily traded to this day.

"mitigating possible instability caused by central banks. There is a limited controlled inflation hardcoded in the Bitcoin software, but it is predictable and known to all parties in advance.[4] Inflation cannot therefore be centrally manipulated to effect redistribution of value from general users."
Oh yeah, Means of Production not regulated by anyone higher than the direct producer. That hammer is coming. Socialized currency must be murdered.

You are a fucking retard. All of this is shit but I've highlighted the true nonsense.

Greece etc are fucked because of their budget defecits. The banking crisis is just a backdrop (it stopped the ponsi-scheme style influx of new cash, leading to the current collapse)

[Hast]

Lallante:

[James Snowscoran]

Everyone must make the attempt at least once Hast

[FatFreddy]

Wasn't Lallante the dude who considered himself to be smarter than most others in the "your younger self" thread?

[Xiang Jiao]

Legitimate question: what is the exchange rate of Bitcoin to ISK and does buying ISK with Bitcoin constitute RMT?

[Lallante]

Wasn't Lallante the dude who considered himself to be smarter than most others in the "your younger self" thread?

You can be smart and dumb at the same time

[Maximillian]

And the thread isn't over till the lunatic sings.

[Lusulpher]

Everyone must make the attempt at least once Hast

:hurr:

I turned on my MSNBC to an interview with a woman who called the police when bankers sent contracters to break into her home...
She had a negotiated deal with the bank, and was not in foreclosure. They sent them anyway to change her locks.
The local cops gave her the impression they were not going to defend her property the next time. She is the least of the victims.

http://www.rawstory.com/rs/2010/10/0...me-foreclosed/
http://abcnews.go.com/Business/video...-home-11825073

820,000 foreclosures on rushed and fraudulent foreclosures...
[youtube:uc87y0ce]I3e71oxkp74[/youtube:uc87y0ce]
Feudalism occurs after the serfs are landless. Property ownership defines the "middle class". that is a modern concept that can be revoked.
Enjoy your new Rooks and Bishops.

Also, I listened to the NPR interviews with economists all over America, I was quoting them on derivatives. The other quote is, "Anyone who says they understand them is a fool or a liar."
You were beaten like a dog 6 months ago.

http://sociology.ucsc.edu/whorulesam...er/wealth.html that data just got more ominous!

[Cerzi]

http://launch.is/blog/l019-bitcoin-p2p- ... ve-ev.html

[Quarantine]

And the thread isn't over till the lunatic sings.

[Wall]

All I saw was "legitimate servers" in the initial description, remembered that 50 million computer botnets are not uncommon, and started to wonder how long it was gonna take.

[kzig]

Yes, a subtantial investment in hardware. I recently upgraded to a new PC, a 2500K sandybridge, which generates around 4300khash/s.

You're doing it wrong. At the moment even 2-year-old ATI GPUs are hitting around 300 Mhash/s - better by a factor of 100, and it's possible to mine on several GPUs per motherboard simultaneously.

Legitimate question: what is the exchange rate of Bitcoin to ISK and does buying ISK with Bitcoin constitute RMT?

I'm fairly sure CCP would ban people for doing that. They'd just need to look for suspicious transactions in-game; exactly the same way they catch other RMT'ers. The general principle is you're only allowed to trade isk for services directly related to EVE, e.g. comms hosting, or for stuff that stays in-game.

As for an exchange rate: I think it's currently about $7.50 per bitcoin, so that extrapolates to 2 per plex, or about 180m isk per bitcoin last time I looked at plex prices.

[Exortius]

It's not like derivatives are voodoo magic or something, go read a book about it or watch a few youtube videos. Hell there's open courses online (MIT et al) that can make it pretty clear.

[Wall]

Also, I listened to the NPR interviews with economists all over America, I was quoting them on derivatives. The other quote is, "Anyone who says they understand them is a fool or a liar."
You were beaten like a dog 6 months ago.

I don't believe that anything you wrote in this post or especially your previous post is a direct quote of a economist on NPR. But NPR has transcripts available for free on their website so I'm sure you can find them and prove me wrong.

[Raine Woot]

I when people say bitcoin is stupid and will never work because it's not real money.