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Thread: What monitor(s)?

  1. #1
    JForce's Avatar
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    What monitor(s)?

    My primary monitor is a Dell 2408WFP - a 24" monitor that in its day was the shizzle. I've had it for nearly 5 years, and it's got a dead-pixel line down one side - it goes away after the monitor "warms up", but I know eventually I'll need to replace it.

    I have a second 24" cheapy, which although thinner/lighter is obviously not as nice to look at, image wise.

    What's the current standard when looking at monitors? TFT/IPS blah blah - where are we at with that? I haven't really paid attention - so beyond response time what do I need to look for? My perception is that monitors have been "evening out" - in that the cheaper ones have caught up, and it's not as expensive as it used to be to get a couple/three nice monitors.

    Thoughts/ideas/suggestions?
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  2. #2
    King of the Babe Thread Donor Jolin's Avatar
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    ASUS PB238Q is what I bought for my 2nd monitor, but it's a 23" (mostly cos my first monitor was 23" and I want to keep the same size). Gives me pretty picture quality, an IPS monitor. I'm sure someone can point out better monitors though.

  3. #3
    Movember 2012 Zekk Pacus's Avatar
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    http://www.amazon.co.uk/Dell-Ultrash...1834349&sr=8-1

    Dell U2412M - pretty much the follow up to your 2408WFP and a fantastic monitor.

    There are other options but I assume you have budget to spend, and they're not overly expensive. Find it in your preferred country.
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    Whatever you get I think you'll be disappointed. The 2408 is a very good monitor and there's nothing on the market now that's directly comparable.

    Samsung stopped making S-PVA panels like the one in the 2408 years ago, so you're going to be limited to an IPS or MVA monitor. IPS has slightly better viewing angles than S-PVA, but lower contrast and much poorer black levels. MVA has better contrast and black levels compared to S-PVA, but often suffers from backlight bleed and slow response times and is currently limited to 1080p.

    +1 for the U2412M as a good IPS screen. BenQ's GW2450HM is a decent non-glossy MVA, or Dell's S2440L is you don't mind a reflective coating.

  5. #5
    Tailn's Avatar
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    right now my opinion on monitors is quantity over quality considering that for 120 you can get some great 23" 1080p ones or you can got to 250+ for better quality ips 24", only thing I focus on is LED back-light and Display port.

  6. #6
    Movember 2012 Zekk Pacus's Avatar
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    I currently have a 23" IPS (ASUS PA238Q) sitting next to a 22" TN (BenQ G2220HD) and the difference is night and day. I'd always go for the IPS panel, and you can get a reasonable IPS panel for 120 or so if that's your budget. But if you can spend up, spend up - better OSD, better stands (often worth the price alone), etc.
    'I'm pro life. I'm a non-smoker. I'm a pro-life non-smoker. WOO, Let the party begin!'

  7. #7
    Donor Aramendel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JForce View Post
    My primary monitor is a Dell 2408WFP - a 24" monitor that in its day was the shizzle. I've had it for nearly 5 years, and it's got a dead-pixel line down one side - it goes away after the monitor "warms up", but I know eventually I'll need to replace it.
    Funny. I had *exactly* the same monitor which had *exactly* the same error since 3-4 months.

    I replaced mine a week ago with the Dell 2913WM and am quite happy with it. It has IMO compared to the 2408WFP better colors, especially a better black. And the wider screen is quite handy - I played Crysis 3 over the weekend where the wider screen gave me a fair bit of immersion and also did a bit programming with 2/3 having visual studio and 1/3 a pdf with a tutorial, which otherwise wouldn't have been possible.

    Quote Originally Posted by Bombcrater View Post
    IPS has slightly better viewing angles than S-PVA, but lower contrast and much poorer black levels.
    I have to disagree heavily there. One thing which was very noticeable to me when switching from my 2408WFP to an IPS screen was a significantly better black level on the ips.
    Last edited by Aramendel; February 26 2013 at 02:57:50 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Aramendel View Post
    I have to disagree heavily there. One thing which was very noticeable to me when switching from my 2408WFP to an IPS screen was a significantly better black level on the ips.
    S-PVA can achieve black levels lower than anything IPS can reach, all reputable monitor review sites publish measurements confirming that. It's a facet of the technology, IPS simply can't block as much light as S-PVA. That's not to say I doubt you saw better blacks after switching to IPS, just that it's probably down to something particular to your 2408 than anything general.

  9. #9
    Donor Rudolf Miller's Avatar
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    U2412 tbqfh

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    z0de's Avatar
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    U2410
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  11. #11
    Donor Aramendel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bombcrater View Post
    S-PVA can achieve black levels lower than anything IPS can reach, all reputable monitor review sites publish measurements confirming that. It's a facet of the technology, IPS simply can't block as much light as S-PVA. That's not to say I doubt you saw better blacks after switching to IPS, just that it's probably down to something particular to your 2408 than anything general.
    Yes, but the thing is - were are talking here about the 2408. So theoretical contrast capabilities are kinda pointless.

    Tftcentral actually got when both were calibrated an about 300 points worse contrast ratios from the 2408 than with the 2913 (750 vs 1050) and 60 points better one when not calibrated (1180 vs 1120).
    The seems to me at best an equal contrast for both models, at worst (when calibrated for color accuracy) a clear win for the newer screen.

    Plus were are not talking about factory-new unused S-PVA displays here, but 5 year old ones, which are unlikely to still have the same quality.

    S-PVA might have advantages over IPS, but due to a) capabilities of specific model and b) age of display (wear & tear) those do apply here IMO.
    Last edited by Aramendel; February 26 2013 at 09:44:46 PM.

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by Aramendel View Post
    Yes, but the thing is - were are talking here about the 2408. So theoretical contrast capabilities are kinda pointless.
    The point I was trying to make (and obviously failing miserably) is that your 2408 isn't necessarily going to be representative of anything. It may have sucky black levels, but that doesn't impact on how the 2408 in general (and S-PVA monitors of that era) are likely to perform.

    I have three Dell S-PVA screens; a 2707, 2407WFP-HC and a 2408WFP. The 2707 and 2408 have black levels as good as the day they were unboxed and (in the case of the 2707) unmatchable by anything but a recent MVA panel, but the 2407 has over time developed problems showing blacks and would probably be soundly beaten in that department by any good quality modern IPS.

    It is possible to go from S-PVA to IPS and get similar or superior backs, but it isn't likely. If you see what I mean.

    Tftcentral actually got when both were calibrated an about 300 points worse contrast ratios from the
    The two reviews were done using differing colorimeter hardware so the results aren't necessarily going to be comparable. If I recall correctly the Lacie Blue Eye Pro they used for the 2408 review was eventually found to have issues with wide gamut panels, so the numbers there may well be complete cobblers.

  13. #13
    Donor Aramendel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bombcrater View Post
    The point I was trying to make (and obviously failing miserably) is that your 2408 isn't necessarily going to be representative of anything.
    I got that. My point is that it is. And my point is supported by *every* *single* review I found. It isn't just anecdotal evidence.

    Even if we ignore the calibrated results of the 2408 (I couldn't find similar values in other reviews, so you are likely right there), the uncalibrated results of the tftcentral review repeat in every review of the 2408. Its contrast measurements vary from review to review between ~1050 and ~1250. The contrast of the 2408 S-pVA is good, but not stellar. Its average is in the 1100 area.
    Which is the same the 2913 gets. In every review I've found. It also gets values between ~1050 and ~1250. The early generations of IPS had a contrast disadvantage, but the current generation - not so much (the LG 29 uses the same panel as the Dell 29).

    The reviews support that going from the 2408 you are likely to get similar blacks with a (high quality) IPS. Sorry, but that trumps IMO your anecdotal evidence and theoretical screen capabilities.

    And then there is the specific situation. The 2408 of the OP is, just like mine, very much not "as good as the day it was unboxed". Just like mine the OP gets dead pixel lines until the screen warms up. That suggests an overall degradation in screen quality, just like it happened with mine. It doesn't have to be...but it is likely.

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    thinking about replacing my 2 Syncmaster 2443NW monitors, with 3 newer ones for around 200 - 250 €, any good ones in that pricerange atm or should i stick with mine?

  15. #15
    Al Simmons's Avatar
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    Current monitors suck, they're all 16:9 and 1920x1080 cos of the "full HD" nonsense. You have to pay a ridiculous premium now if you want a 16:10 monitor with a better resolution like 2560x1600. I'm still using an HP 1680x1050 thing from like five years ago and I have like no incentive to bother upgrading to a 1080p display with a shit aspect ratio, and I can't afford the leap up to a grand or whatever for the nice monitors. It's retarded.

  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by lubica
    And her name was Limul Azgoden, a lowly peasant girl.

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    Donor Aea's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lana Torrin View Post
    Fuck that noise. Get the Dell, it's an superior panel in every single way.

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    I'm sure it's frustrating to be sperging about how someone said "no, not doing that yet" - but we've had 7 years to learn to pace ourselves after killing a block. And I dare say -- we've gotten quite good at it.

    Sorry if it doesn't suit the armchair generals who have never committed to anything for more than 2 months, but by now we've learned that we really don't give a shit about what you think v0v.

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