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Thread: Some are more equal than others?

  1. #221
    XenosisReaper
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    What if I just don't care about other people?

  2. #222
    Donor Sponk's Avatar
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    Reminds me of an article I read about self-defence.

    A cop was talking to a group of women about what things they do if they notice someone walk behind them at night. They said stuff like "carry keys in my hand so I can get into the car faster", "make sure to stay in well-lit areas" etc.

    Then he asked a group of men the same thing, and they were like 'Well, nothing. What? Why does it make a difference? What's the right answer?'

    Fact is, it's hard enough to put yourself in the shoes of people a lot like you, let alone in the shoes of someone with wildly different experiences.
    Contract stuff to Seraphina Amaranth.

    "You give me the awful impression - I hate to have to say - of someone who hasn't read any of the arguments against your position. Ever."


  3. #223
    Movember '12 Best Facial Hair Movember 2012Donor Lallante's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by XenosisReaper View Post
    What if I just don't care about other people?
    i.e. you are a sociopath?

  4. #224
    XenosisReaper
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lallante View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by XenosisReaper View Post
    What if I just don't care about other people?
    i.e. you are a sociopath?
    My 2D love is all I need

  5. #225
    Super VIP Dot Kransthow's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by XenosisReaper View Post
    What if I just don't care about other people?

    Then check your privilege cis-scum

  6. #226
    XenosisReaper
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kransthow View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by XenosisReaper View Post
    What if I just don't care about other people?

    Then check your privilege cis-scum
    I can't find that Psycho-Pass image with the makeup, but if I could I would post it

  7. #227
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lallante View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Sponk View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Kransthow View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Lallante View Post
    Very on topic. I dont like the way the article is written, but it certainly frames the argument and IMO is fundamentally correct:
    http://jezebel.com/5965429/oh-god-pl...ocial-movement
    Needs more checking of privilige
    Straight White Male: Life on the lowest difficulty setting
    Anyone who doesn't agree with this is fundamentally lying to themselves or too stupid to have the necessary perspective to imagine what life is like for other people.

    It should be painfully obvious to everyone that being a straight white male in the Western world is, in general terms, an incredible and enormous advantage throughout life.

    Thankfully, though this remains fundamentally true, its also LESS true than it has been at any previous point in history. I'd say we are about 2/3 of the way there, maybe more.
    That appears to be a 2 page long definition of the word privilege. The author contends that the problem with sexism and racism both is that white males don't know the meaning of the word privilege?

    Without disagreeing I can already call this a shitty article. Like distributing dictionaries will solve your problem....where's the real content? *waits for lall to take this post as clear denial of the privilege concept on my part*
    Last edited by Synapse; March 19 2013 at 01:27:46 AM.

  8. #228
    Super VIP Dot Kransthow's Avatar
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    If I see the words "straight white male" one more time I sware I am going to stop checking my privilege.

  9. #229
    Movember '12 Best Facial Hair Movember 2012Donor Lallante's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Synapse View Post
    That appears to be a 2 page long definition of the word privilege. The author contends that the problem with sexism and racism both is that white males don't know the meaning of the word privilege?
    No, that isn't in any way what the point of the article is. He isn't trying to explain what the "problem with sexism and racism is", he is trying to explain what "privilege" actually means in an easily understandable way without descending to the usual one line snide backbiting shit the internet (and especially FHC) normally does when that word is mentioned. Privelage is one symptom of sexism/racism, not "the whole problem".
    Without disagreeing I can already call this a shitty article. Like distributing dictionaries will solve your problem....where's the real content? *waits for lall to take this post as clear denial of the privilege concept on my part*
    He isn't trying to solve the problem, just help normally hostile people get some perspective so they can better understand the language used by people who are trying to solve the problem.

    Case in point, Krans post above.

  10. #230
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    I'm just going to repost my second sentence, since you ignored it:

    The author contends that the problem with sexism and racism both is that white males don't know the meaning of the word privilege?

    ...and that krans doesn't understand that word either....Is that your position too lall?

  11. #231
    Movember '12 Best Facial Hair Movember 2012Donor Lallante's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Synapse View Post
    I'm just going to repost my second sentence, since you ignored it:

    The author contends that the problem with sexism and racism both is that white males don't know the meaning of the word privilege?

    ...and that krans doesn't understand that word either....Is that your position too lall?

    I've just told you that ISNT what he is contending.
    No, that isn't in any way what the point of the article is. He isn't trying to explain what the "problem with sexism and racism is"

  12. #232
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    Huh, ok. Then I don't think any significant numbers of people are confused about the meaning of the word privilege, and I'll just leave it at that.

  13. #233
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    blah blah blah, you'd all be speaking Chinese if they hadn't burned their boats in 1421. I doubt they'll make the same mistake again.
    Contract stuff to Seraphina Amaranth.

    "You give me the awful impression - I hate to have to say - of someone who hasn't read any of the arguments against your position. Ever."


  14. #234
    Donor Aea's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by I Legionnaire View Post
    I'm gonna go out on a limb here.

    The way I see it the "white man" has over the last 50,000 years gone around conquering, pillaging, and generally causing havoc all over creation. We started by bashing Neanderthals' skulls in with sharpened rocks, and recently we've wielded credit as a way to retard progress in Latin American countries and Africa. Let that sink in, white males have been doing this for longer than North America had humans present.

    It's only been since the Enlightenment that the conversation around equal human rights has been around, women's rights maybe since the Victorian era, and gay rights are a product of the 20th century.
    I think it's only natural for there to be resistance from white men to the idea that we should feel bad for being in charge.


    Call me racist, sexist, bigot what you will, but here's what I think.
    It was white men that sailed across the Atlantic. It was white men that made it to the poles. It was white men that invented the atom bomb. It was white men that went to the moon.
    It's certainly not intelligence, or motivation that drives this difference. There's something Europeans have that drives a few to push the envelope, to see what is beyond the boundaries of our knowledge, and yes to conquer and exploit when it suits us.

    So to everyone who says I don't know anything about hardship, or privilege or how I should feel bad about how objectified women are I say... Too fuckin bad.
    I'm a white man, and I'm going to make the world into what I want it to be, and until you figure out how to compete with us or change the playing field you'll stay where you are. Downtrodden, unprivileged, objectified, and subjugated.


    Anyhow, much of my point is moot. The education system is western countries is doing a good job of molding angry young men into well-functioning cogs that treat everyone nicely.






    Forgive the somewhat joke answer within the context of the Serious Business thread, but I feel like you're misinterpreting European successes. A large majority of the success of the European people was entirely a function of geography, there's a book called Guns, Germs, and Steel (and a documentary if you wish to watch an overview instead) that covers why Europeans had a good base for early success, which helped established large civilizations. It snowballs from there and certainly a series of good opportunities puts Europeans on top of the world for the past several centuries.

  15. #235
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    Quote Originally Posted by I Legionnaire View Post
    I'm gonna go out on a limb here.

    WEEEEEEE ARE THE CHAMPIONS
    MY FRIEEEEEEEENDS
    Self-Serving Bias
    Self-serving bias, sometimes called a self-serving attributional bias, refers to individuals attributing their successes to internal or personal factors but attributing their failures to external or situational factors. This bias is a mechanism for individuals to protect or enhance their own self-esteem. For example, a student who attributes a good grade on an exam to his or her own intelligence and hours of studying but a poor grade to the professor’s poor teaching ability and unfair test questions is exhibiting the self-serving bias. Studies have shown that similar attributions are made in various situations, such as the workplace, interpersonal relationships, sports, and consumer decisions.

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  16. #236
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tarminic View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by I Legionnaire View Post
    I'm gonna go out on a limb here.

    WEEEEEEE ARE THE CHAMPIONS
    MY FRIEEEEEEEENDS
    Self-Serving Bias
    Self-serving bias, sometimes called a self-serving attributional bias, refers to individuals attributing their successes to internal or personal factors but attributing their failures to external or situational factors. This bias is a mechanism for individuals to protect or enhance their own self-esteem. For example, a student who attributes a good grade on an exam to his or her own intelligence and hours of studying but a poor grade to the professor’s poor teaching ability and unfair test questions is exhibiting the self-serving bias. Studies have shown that similar attributions are made in various situations, such as the workplace, interpersonal relationships, sports, and consumer decisions.
    As an aside, i've read a study linking this to resistance against longterm medical depression. nbs maybe.

  17. #237
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    Until you come up with a biological foundation for this "white awesomeness" I'm going to have to continue assuming you're just looking for a convenient way to justify an unfounded belief in racial superiority...

    Which I suppose is as good as any other unfounded hypothesis supported by only circumstantial evidence, aka completely useless.

  18. #238
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    Quote Originally Posted by I Legionnaire View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Tarminic View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by I Legionnaire View Post
    I'm gonna go out on a limb here.

    WEEEEEEE ARE THE CHAMPIONS
    MY FRIEEEEEEEENDS
    Self-Serving Bias
    Self-serving bias, sometimes called a self-serving attributional bias, refers to individuals attributing their successes to internal or personal factors but attributing their failures to external or situational factors. This bias is a mechanism for individuals to protect or enhance their own self-esteem. For example, a student who attributes a good grade on an exam to his or her own intelligence and hours of studying but a poor grade to the professor’s poor teaching ability and unfair test questions is exhibiting the self-serving bias. Studies have shown that similar attributions are made in various situations, such as the workplace, interpersonal relationships, sports, and consumer decisions.
    By posting this I'm assuming you meant to say, "I have nothing constructive to add to the conversation, and am unwilling or unable to discuss the possible validity of a view counter to my own.". That about right?
    I mean, I figured the standard interpretation of my post would be that your "Europeans have some innate quality that makes them ambitious" response is a decent example of a self-serving bias, with a smattering fundamental attribution error. But you are, of course, free to disagree.

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  19. #239
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    Quote Originally Posted by I Legionnaire View Post
    My point wasn't that Europeans are better in any other sense than being able to subjugate someone else makes you "better" ,morality aside.
    I didn't interpret it as a moral statement, I only pointed out the probable bias in asserting that europeans have some innate quality that makes them more ambitious than the other population groups existing at the time. I also think it's a bit ignorant of history, but I didn't assume any malicious intent on your part.

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  20. #240
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    Quote Originally Posted by I Legionnaire View Post
    Thanks, but you're not arguing against culturally inherited ambition? I'll cede that biological imperative as root cause is a silly argument.

    BTW most of my references are from Max Weber and David Landis.
    I could, but I not sure if I don't feel qualified enough to do so. It's been about 14 years since my last sociology class. Plus it's friday afternoon and I don't feel like opening a bunch of tabs in wikipedia at the moment.

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