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Thread: Political Shots Fired Thread

  1. #17641
    XenosisMk4's Avatar
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    Why is Smuggo not banned and Rak is banned?

    They're literally the same thing

  2. #17642
    XenosisMk4's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Keckers View Post
    Surely there's a spectrum of belief between accepting gender dysphoria is real and sexual reassignment surgery is the best fix for it?

    Because I'm more than happy to accept trans people aren't just being attention seeking, but I'm not convinced surgery is always in their best interests.
    Probably not helped by the various studies that show that surgery IS the best fix for it, tbh.

  3. #17643
    Donor Pattern's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Contemporary Poster View Post
    Morality is a framework for responsible and effective freedom. Total freedom should be always be constrained by morality. Just because you can do something doesn't mean you should.
    Complete rubbish. Freedom starts and ends with the individual, when you start to impinge on others individual freedoms with arguments of morality, you're no better than every religion that has done this since the beginning of time.

    You keep claiming that you're not a catholic... and yet...

  4. #17644
    Keckers's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by XenosisMk4 View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Keckers View Post
    Surely there's a spectrum of belief between accepting gender dysphoria is real and sexual reassignment surgery is the best fix for it?

    Because I'm more than happy to accept trans people aren't just being attention seeking, but I'm not convinced surgery is always in their best interests.
    Probably not helped by the various studies that show that surgery IS the best fix for it, tbh.
    I've not seen those, just the ones which show spikes in suicide ideation after surgery.
    Quote Originally Posted by Paul Mason
    It is absurd that we are capable of witnessing a 40,000 year old system of gender oppression begin to dissolve before our eyes yet still see the abolition of a 200 year old economic system as an unrealistic utopia.

  5. #17645
    XenosisMk4's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Keckers View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by XenosisMk4 View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Keckers View Post
    Surely there's a spectrum of belief between accepting gender dysphoria is real and sexual reassignment surgery is the best fix for it?

    Because I'm more than happy to accept trans people aren't just being attention seeking, but I'm not convinced surgery is always in their best interests.
    Probably not helped by the various studies that show that surgery IS the best fix for it, tbh.
    I've not seen those, just the ones which show spikes in suicide ideation after surgery.
    With people like Smuggo around I'm not surprised

  6. #17646
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pattern View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by The Contemporary Poster View Post
    Morality is a framework for responsible and effective freedom. Total freedom should be always be constrained by morality. Just because you can do something doesn't mean you should.
    Complete rubbish. Freedom starts and ends with the individual, when you start to impinge on others individual freedoms with arguments of morality, you're no better than every religion that has done this since the beginning of time.

    You keep claiming that you're not a catholic... and yet...
    Why is setting down moral boundaries an impingement on liberty exactly? The basics of Christian morality are perfectly acceptable standards by which to live our lives, why the rejection of them? You seem to be confusing personal autonomy with freedom IMO.

  7. #17647
    big diiiiiiiiick Movember 2012Donor Dark Flare's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Contemporary Poster View Post
    What are the biological foundations then?

    The way I see it is either you think is there is no distinction between men and women, in which case why does it matter which you are that you need to change it?

    Or you recognise there are important and intrinsic differences in being a man or a woman in which case simply changing you physical appearance would not be sufficient. Indeed you can at most look like you are from the opposing gender, but you haven't actually become that gender.

    I'm also concerned this is being pushed on very young children with little regard for what it will do to them and with absolutely no concern over whether parents actually want this to happen. Also no one voted for it either so under what mandate is this change being forced upon us?
    wew strawman

    You can't just say "It's one of these two things, now choose" as an attempt to remove reasonability from it.

    Top tip: There are differences between men and women and sometimes a person has those differences mentally but not physically and needs physical surgery to fix that misalignment. hth.
    Quote Originally Posted by Amantus
    whats tyhe appear of a shnitifuck cu nt eve onlio9ne corpotraTION DICKOLHEAD FUCKIN AS

  8. #17648
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dark Flare View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by The Contemporary Poster View Post
    What are the biological foundations then?

    The way I see it is either you think is there is no distinction between men and women, in which case why does it matter which you are that you need to change it?

    Or you recognise there are important and intrinsic differences in being a man or a woman in which case simply changing you physical appearance would not be sufficient. Indeed you can at most look like you are from the opposing gender, but you haven't actually become that gender.

    I'm also concerned this is being pushed on very young children with little regard for what it will do to them and with absolutely no concern over whether parents actually want this to happen. Also no one voted for it either so under what mandate is this change being forced upon us?
    wew strawman

    You can't just say "It's one of these two things, now choose" as an attempt to remove reasonability from it.

    Top tip: There are differences between men and women and sometimes a person has those differences mentally but not physically and needs physical surgery to fix that misalignment. hth.
    But it doesn't fix anything they're still a man

  9. #17649

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    Quote Originally Posted by Keckers View Post
    Surely there's a spectrum of belief between accepting gender dysphoria is real and sexual reassignment surgery is the best fix for it?

    Because I'm more than happy to accept trans people aren't just being attention seeking, but I'm not convinced surgery is always in their best interests.
    That's fair enough, but the discussion is about whether a child has the right to determine how they should be addressed, which seems like a fairly minor thing to me.

  10. #17650
    big diiiiiiiiick Movember 2012Donor Dark Flare's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Contemporary Poster View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Dark Flare View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by The Contemporary Poster View Post
    What are the biological foundations then?

    The way I see it is either you think is there is no distinction between men and women, in which case why does it matter which you are that you need to change it?

    Or you recognise there are important and intrinsic differences in being a man or a woman in which case simply changing you physical appearance would not be sufficient. Indeed you can at most look like you are from the opposing gender, but you haven't actually become that gender.

    I'm also concerned this is being pushed on very young children with little regard for what it will do to them and with absolutely no concern over whether parents actually want this to happen. Also no one voted for it either so under what mandate is this change being forced upon us?
    wew strawman

    You can't just say "It's one of these two things, now choose" as an attempt to remove reasonability from it.

    Top tip: There are differences between men and women and sometimes a person has those differences mentally but not physically and needs physical surgery to fix that misalignment. hth.
    But it doesn't fix anything they're still a man
    I think it's probably up to them to decide if it's fixed it and made their life better, not you.
    Quote Originally Posted by Amantus
    whats tyhe appear of a shnitifuck cu nt eve onlio9ne corpotraTION DICKOLHEAD FUCKIN AS

  11. #17651
    Keckers's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by El Capitano View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Keckers View Post
    Surely there's a spectrum of belief between accepting gender dysphoria is real and sexual reassignment surgery is the best fix for it?

    Because I'm more than happy to accept trans people aren't just being attention seeking, but I'm not convinced surgery is always in their best interests.
    That's fair enough, but the discussion is about whether a child has the right to determine how they should be addressed, which seems like a fairly minor thing to me.
    Yeah it literally doesn't matter since I can't see it causing or even indirectly leading to harm.
    Quote Originally Posted by Paul Mason
    It is absurd that we are capable of witnessing a 40,000 year old system of gender oppression begin to dissolve before our eyes yet still see the abolition of a 200 year old economic system as an unrealistic utopia.

  12. #17652
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dark Flare View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by The Contemporary Poster View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Dark Flare View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by The Contemporary Poster View Post
    What are the biological foundations then?

    The way I see it is either you think is there is no distinction between men and women, in which case why does it matter which you are that you need to change it?

    Or you recognise there are important and intrinsic differences in being a man or a woman in which case simply changing you physical appearance would not be sufficient. Indeed you can at most look like you are from the opposing gender, but you haven't actually become that gender.

    I'm also concerned this is being pushed on very young children with little regard for what it will do to them and with absolutely no concern over whether parents actually want this to happen. Also no one voted for it either so under what mandate is this change being forced upon us?
    wew strawman

    You can't just say "It's one of these two things, now choose" as an attempt to remove reasonability from it.

    Top tip: There are differences between men and women and sometimes a person has those differences mentally but not physically and needs physical surgery to fix that misalignment. hth.
    But it doesn't fix anything they're still a man
    I think it's probably up to them to decide if it's fixed it and made their life better, not you.
    Not when these ideas are being pushed on young and impressionable children it isn't. In any event, it still doesn't change their gender only their appearance

  13. #17653

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    Quote Originally Posted by The Contemporary Poster View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Dark Flare View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by The Contemporary Poster View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Dark Flare View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by The Contemporary Poster View Post
    What are the biological foundations then?

    The way I see it is either you think is there is no distinction between men and women, in which case why does it matter which you are that you need to change it?

    Or you recognise there are important and intrinsic differences in being a man or a woman in which case simply changing you physical appearance would not be sufficient. Indeed you can at most look like you are from the opposing gender, but you haven't actually become that gender.

    I'm also concerned this is being pushed on very young children with little regard for what it will do to them and with absolutely no concern over whether parents actually want this to happen. Also no one voted for it either so under what mandate is this change being forced upon us?
    wew strawman

    You can't just say "It's one of these two things, now choose" as an attempt to remove reasonability from it.

    Top tip: There are differences between men and women and sometimes a person has those differences mentally but not physically and needs physical surgery to fix that misalignment. hth.
    But it doesn't fix anything they're still a man
    I think it's probably up to them to decide if it's fixed it and made their life better, not you.
    Not when these ideas are being pushed on young and impressionable children it isn't. In any event, it still doesn't change their gender only their appearance
    Beating children is fine, but exposing them to new ideas is not.

    Seems clear.

  14. #17654
    big diiiiiiiiick Movember 2012Donor Dark Flare's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Contemporary Poster View Post
    Not when these ideas are being pushed on young and impressionable children it isn't.
    Citation very needed.
    In any event, it still doesn't change their gender only their appearance
    a c c o r d i n g t o y o u
    Quote Originally Posted by Amantus
    whats tyhe appear of a shnitifuck cu nt eve onlio9ne corpotraTION DICKOLHEAD FUCKIN AS

  15. #17655
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nicholai Pestot View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by The Contemporary Poster View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Dark Flare View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by The Contemporary Poster View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Dark Flare View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by The Contemporary Poster View Post
    What are the biological foundations then?

    The way I see it is either you think is there is no distinction between men and women, in which case why does it matter which you are that you need to change it?

    Or you recognise there are important and intrinsic differences in being a man or a woman in which case simply changing you physical appearance would not be sufficient. Indeed you can at most look like you are from the opposing gender, but you haven't actually become that gender.

    I'm also concerned this is being pushed on very young children with little regard for what it will do to them and with absolutely no concern over whether parents actually want this to happen. Also no one voted for it either so under what mandate is this change being forced upon us?
    wew strawman

    You can't just say "It's one of these two things, now choose" as an attempt to remove reasonability from it.

    Top tip: There are differences between men and women and sometimes a person has those differences mentally but not physically and needs physical surgery to fix that misalignment. hth.
    But it doesn't fix anything they're still a man
    I think it's probably up to them to decide if it's fixed it and made their life better, not you.
    Not when these ideas are being pushed on young and impressionable children it isn't. In any event, it still doesn't change their gender only their appearance
    Beating children is fine, but exposing them to new ideas is not.

    Seems clear.
    I didn't say beating children is fine and it won't become true no matter how often you say it. Confusing children about their bodies at a time when they are likely already confused by puberty and forcing hormone treatments and blockers on them with no regard for the long term consequences is very dangerous and has not been debated in the country instead the LGBT lobby has forced it on us in cahoots with governments

  16. #17656
    Donor Sofia Roseburn's Avatar
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    If only there was a rather lengthy medical evaluation process to go through to be prescribed those kinds of things. That'd be a rather good idea, don't you think?


    Quote Originally Posted by Doomed Predator
    Sofia Roseburn; quiet, well mannered librarian by day; blood crazed, psychotic demigod by night.

  17. #17657
    big diiiiiiiiick Movember 2012Donor Dark Flare's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Contemporary Poster View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Nicholai Pestot View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by The Contemporary Poster View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Dark Flare View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by The Contemporary Poster View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Dark Flare View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by The Contemporary Poster View Post
    What are the biological foundations then?

    The way I see it is either you think is there is no distinction between men and women, in which case why does it matter which you are that you need to change it?

    Or you recognise there are important and intrinsic differences in being a man or a woman in which case simply changing you physical appearance would not be sufficient. Indeed you can at most look like you are from the opposing gender, but you haven't actually become that gender.

    I'm also concerned this is being pushed on very young children with little regard for what it will do to them and with absolutely no concern over whether parents actually want this to happen. Also no one voted for it either so under what mandate is this change being forced upon us?
    wew strawman

    You can't just say "It's one of these two things, now choose" as an attempt to remove reasonability from it.

    Top tip: There are differences between men and women and sometimes a person has those differences mentally but not physically and needs physical surgery to fix that misalignment. hth.
    But it doesn't fix anything they're still a man
    I think it's probably up to them to decide if it's fixed it and made their life better, not you.
    Not when these ideas are being pushed on young and impressionable children it isn't. In any event, it still doesn't change their gender only their appearance
    Beating children is fine, but exposing them to new ideas is not.

    Seems clear.
    I didn't say beating children is fine and it won't become true no matter how often you say it. Confusing children about their bodies at a time when they are likely already confused by puberty and forcing hormone treatments and blockers on them with no regard for the long term consequences is very dangerous and has not been debated in the country instead the LGBT lobby has forced it on us in cahoots with governments
    Literally same argument used by homophobes.

    But children haven't all suddenly become gay or mentally damaged as a result of teaching that being gay is acceptable.
    Quote Originally Posted by Amantus
    whats tyhe appear of a shnitifuck cu nt eve onlio9ne corpotraTION DICKOLHEAD FUCKIN AS

  18. #17658
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sofia Roseburn View Post
    If only there was a rather lengthy medical evaluation process to go through to be prescribed those kinds of things. That'd be a rather good idea, don't you think?
    Why prescribe them to children at all?

  19. #17659
    Donor Sofia Roseburn's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Contemporary Poster View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Sofia Roseburn View Post
    If only there was a rather lengthy medical evaluation process to go through to be prescribed those kinds of things. That'd be a rather good idea, don't you think?
    Why prescribe them to children at all?
    Why not? I'm interested in what reasons you can come up with as a medical professional that would make doing so a risky option. Try and take your own ethics out of it, I dare you.


    Quote Originally Posted by Doomed Predator
    Sofia Roseburn; quiet, well mannered librarian by day; blood crazed, psychotic demigod by night.

  20. #17660

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    Quote Originally Posted by The Contemporary Poster View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Nicholai Pestot View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by The Contemporary Poster View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Dark Flare View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by The Contemporary Poster View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Dark Flare View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by The Contemporary Poster View Post
    What are the biological foundations then?

    The way I see it is either you think is there is no distinction between men and women, in which case why does it matter which you are that you need to change it?

    Or you recognise there are important and intrinsic differences in being a man or a woman in which case simply changing you physical appearance would not be sufficient. Indeed you can at most look like you are from the opposing gender, but you haven't actually become that gender.

    I'm also concerned this is being pushed on very young children with little regard for what it will do to them and with absolutely no concern over whether parents actually want this to happen. Also no one voted for it either so under what mandate is this change being forced upon us?
    wew strawman

    You can't just say "It's one of these two things, now choose" as an attempt to remove reasonability from it.

    Top tip: There are differences between men and women and sometimes a person has those differences mentally but not physically and needs physical surgery to fix that misalignment. hth.
    But it doesn't fix anything they're still a man
    I think it's probably up to them to decide if it's fixed it and made their life better, not you.
    Not when these ideas are being pushed on young and impressionable children it isn't. In any event, it still doesn't change their gender only their appearance
    Beating children is fine, but exposing them to new ideas is not.

    Seems clear.
    I didn't say beating children is fine and it won't become true no matter how often you say it. Confusing children about their bodies at a time when they are likely already confused by puberty and forcing hormone treatments and blockers on them with no regard for the long term consequences is very dangerous and has not been debated in the country instead the LGBT lobby has forced it on us in cahoots with governments
    Last I saw was an announcement that the government wanted to have a debate about it and was entering into consultation with experts about how/when/if things should be changed.

    Where have these new measures of which you speak been applied? Or is just the exploration of the possibility too much for you?

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