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Grarr Dexx
April 9 2011, 07:49:07 PM
My night elf dick is bigger than yours.

Ruri
April 9 2011, 08:11:44 PM
My arena 2's record is almost .400.

Our team is called the Pittsburgh Pirates.

We will likely end up with a better record than the actual baseball team.

Rans
April 9 2011, 08:15:33 PM
I can't even find my old huntress on armory, rip rip rip

Grarr Dexx
April 9 2011, 08:49:30 PM
http://eu.battle.net/wow/en/character/b ... r/advanced (http://eu.battle.net/wow/en/character/bloodhoof/Karakkonor/advanced)

My dick's really big.

Rachag
April 9 2011, 09:22:16 PM
Playing as a Subtlety Rogue is full of fucking win! :twisted:

Namamai
April 9 2011, 10:30:01 PM
:herp:

Sad truth - I actually spent enough time doing old content to build a Thunderfury yesterday.
If only I had played a sword-using class when it was new content :(

mira o'karr
April 9 2011, 11:39:00 PM
dont know what is up with the extra shit posting to start this off but ...

gearing my DK right now. close to the gear level for heroics without buying shit of the ah.

blood tanking has got to be the easiest tanking there is but i am wondering, i hear they are changing threat generation with 4.1
any one who can point me to the details?

Grarr Dexx
April 10 2011, 12:27:57 AM
It's mostly because tanks are gearing for survivability now. I'm sure it'll be fixed by making hit/exp a bit more important, or making big threat moves less dependant.

mira o'karr
April 10 2011, 02:33:47 PM
wouldnt be too bad i think.
currently i am completely ignoring hit (in the sense that, if it is on there, great but i m not actively seeking it out) and reforging every thing that isnt hit or exp into mastery.

still far from being able to tank HC and the dps queues are killing me :D

Djakku
April 10 2011, 07:36:08 PM
Tried logging in the other day, discovered account was inactive, didn't bother resubbing.

Koll
April 10 2011, 08:28:59 PM
Finished my Sulfuron hammer for my 60 warrior. Can't be fucked farming MC with him though just for the novelty of having a 60 legendary at 60 so will level him up and have it as something I can just carry around at 85.

Mavolio
April 10 2011, 09:27:53 PM
i got my hammer recently, did my 1st run in like 2 years eye drops. Go back with friend to farm ingots 2nd eye drops. 2 runs, 2 eyes shame i cant equip them both on my pala :(

pratell
April 11 2011, 05:30:05 AM
dont know what is up with the extra shit posting to start this off but ...

gearing my DK right now. close to the gear level for heroics without buying shit of the ah.

blood tanking has got to be the easiest tanking there is but i am wondering, i hear they are changing threat generation with 4.1
any one who can point me to the details?

blood tanking is ez pz, and the amount of dps you can generate is rediculous.

Idara
April 11 2011, 03:35:59 PM
Got first piece of 372 yesterday, chest from H. halfus.

Did a bunch of attempts on H chimaeron, but that didn't pan out.

Jindo Minian
April 11 2011, 04:12:35 PM
Fucking Chimaeron.
If only knocking the bot offline wasn't so damn random, the worse one was yesterday. Disabled the bot so we all rush to group together just as he hits phase 2. Nice and easy kills he got there, 10 people all standing in one place.

orcane
April 11 2011, 08:09:36 PM
Bawww, uni is blocking access to WoW so I can't use public WLAN and their shitty VPN implementation to play from work (or from Ukraine for that matter...) anymore. QQ

Levelled my huntard to 70, but now I can't be arsed to level on. Fucking WotLK levels...

Idara
April 12 2011, 06:54:53 PM
I got two of the BoA 226-iLevel archaeology 1-hander axes for my shaman/rogue when they get to 71.

So now I gotta actually get there.

orcane
April 12 2011, 08:39:38 PM
It's good I don't do archaeology then. But seriously even those probably wouldn't convince me to go on in a hurry. A friend of mine who's quite the altoholic and has a much higher boredom/grind tolerance than I do (he's Barud the Insane for a reason) took almost three months to get his priest alt on the new server he transferred to from 70 to 80. He did 1-70 within a week or two next to raiding 5 days/week. 80-85 in a weekend. But Northrend levels made him stop playing that alt altogether several times - he even returned to our server to level his old scribe alt to 85 and farm heroic and PvP gear instead.

RazoR
April 12 2011, 08:42:26 PM
worst thread in other games forum

Warpath
April 12 2011, 08:46:20 PM
It's good I don't do archaeology then. But seriously even those probably wouldn't convince me to go on in a hurry. A friend of mine who's quite the altoholic and has a much higher boredom/grind tolerance than I do (he's Barud the Insane for a reason) took almost three months to get his priest alt on the new server he transferred to from 70 to 80. He did 1-70 within a week or two next to raiding 5 days/week. 80-85 in a weekend. But Northrend levels made him stop playing that alt altogether several times - he even returned to our server to level his old scribe alt to 85 and farm heroic and PvP gear instead.


Got a Warrior i have leveled from 35 to 71 in about a week and a half, last week or so though i haven't felt any inclination to play him due to the crappy northrend quests.

orcane
April 12 2011, 08:55:50 PM
worst thread in other games forum
Good to see you're still useless outside of gun and tank threads :razor:

Ok wtf, a Razor smiley? I'll have to emoragequit this forum now.

RazoR
April 12 2011, 09:12:31 PM
worst thread in other games forum
Good to see you're still useless outside of gun and tank threads :razor:

Ok wtf, a Razor smiley? I'll have to emoragequit this forum now.http://dobrochan.ru/src/jpg/1010/success-baby-asshole.jpg

Grarr Dexx
April 13 2011, 04:17:15 PM
I finally decided to quit. Made up some lame excuse about how my graphics card was going to shit and now I've decided to fade out into nothing.

pratell
April 13 2011, 06:44:45 PM
i don't think i've ever told anyone i was quitting. i just stop logging on.

orcane
April 17 2011, 01:17:58 AM
I log on once in a blue moon right now. Then I quickly remember why I hate giant pseudo-anonymous online communities (ohwai).

Let's tank a random normal dungeon for fast/easy/stress free 140 JP on my alt, right. I get healing role instead, fuck it, can't be hard, I can heal heroics while watching TV. Get a level 84 DK tank in 3/4 DPS gear, no reforging or enchants, in Lost City. Guy almost dies to every pack of 3+ mobs (ie. most of them in there) without Divine Light spam, eventually dies while I'm feared. Battle rez, we win. As soon as that fight is over, me OOM and him unbuffed, he runs over to the boss immediately (not pulling him with anything, just body pulling and waiting for a few seconds). He's at 10% health after 5 seconds and I just drop group - CBA to even yell at retards anymore.

Warpath
April 29 2011, 05:14:21 PM
Whats with the guild finder tool? Applied for a couple of guilds, no reply after an hour or two so log out for the night. log in the following morning to find my applications are no longer there but no way of knowing if i had been rejected or what :s (was for casual guilds taking almost any nabs)

Mavolio
April 29 2011, 05:48:54 PM
new contnet is a massive fail. ZA is just a copy and paste and ZG is too hard for randoms to understand what to do.

Helen
April 29 2011, 05:53:01 PM
Holy shitballs do not miss playing this game at all.

Idara
April 29 2011, 05:56:40 PM
I haven't even done the 'new' content on my chars yet.

I just don't give a fuck.

Warpath
April 29 2011, 05:58:42 PM
I just don't give a fuck.


Neither do i really, but there's fuck all out there that's any better...

Mavolio
April 29 2011, 06:09:15 PM
There is some nice new mechanics in ZG tho, will be nice to see what they can do with firelands which should be out soon™

Voulture
April 29 2011, 08:56:01 PM
I got bored with this game completely in 5 months. Mind i started 2 months before cata so I enjoyed both wotlk and cara and tried myself in 2vs2 and 3vs3 in my full pvp alt in both expensions. Even Eve took me like 4 years to quit. It's a good game but so fucking repeating i couldn't stand another dungeon or another raid, day after day same shit. Seriously, how can you play this game for like 5 years O.o

Jindo Minian
April 30 2011, 12:51:16 AM
I'm a little bored of it myself right now. I only log in to raid and today we did ZA to test.
I never did the original so it's new to me.
Will try ZG sometime too, i love ZG.

To be honest i'd rather play Rift though, the classes and combat are better.

Idara
April 30 2011, 05:30:24 PM
Apparently paladins are now warlocks.

Seriously Blizzard, well done on the armour. :psyduck:

orcane
April 30 2011, 07:10:49 PM
It deserves a "wtf is this shit" image macro, but on the other hand I'm so beyond caring, even doing that much is :effort:

Ruri
May 1 2011, 02:04:25 AM
The revamped Zul'Aman and Zul'Gurub are very fun, quite punishing if your gear isn't up to snuff and generally requiring a solid performance even out of the dps. They do sort of feel like mini-raids, at least they will until average gear levels make them a faceroll, as what happens with all Wow content eventually.

Still waiting on GW2 for something genuinely different though. Till then there's plenty of other things to do.

Mavolio
May 1 2011, 02:21:58 AM
revamped Zul'Aman

ZA is exactly the same except you can do it in a 5 man at lvl 85. It must have taken them alll week to make it.

Shaikar
May 1 2011, 02:32:01 AM
new contnet is a massive fail. ZA is just a copy and paste and ZG is too hard for randoms to understand what to do.I like new ZG, am hoping they do lots more in the same vein. I am however avoiding doing it with a pug for the same reasons, because the average pugger redefines terribad and I can't imagine enjoying it with a full pug. Hopefully they'll stick with it though, the game is in dire need of new mechanics and less facerolling.

/e ZA isn't exactly the same as it was, eg Nalorakk is a different fight. It's definitely had a lot less done to it than ZG though, pretty disappointing in comparison for sure.

orcane
May 1 2011, 09:40:27 AM
Well obviously it's not exactly the same because you can't put dual-tank fights into a 5-man and without that Nalorakk would have been a pure Patchwerk fight, but adding charge management (to the existing charge mechanic) or adding Lich King's valkyr mechanic to Akil'zon isn't exactly mindblowing, fresh content either way.

Which isn't necessarily bad, a lot of current players have never stepped into ZA, but by that reasoning they should remake all the other obsolete content so the lazy fucks, who can't be arsed to go back to a dungeon that doesn't shit out current level-cap epics, have a reason to run it. And Blizzard saves months of development time because all they have to do is tune HP/damage values and spend an afternoon updating boss mechanics slightly.

I had one group in ZG where the other guys went all "ah, common sense then" when Venoxis and further fights were explained and he went down before he got a 2nd "vulnerability" phase in. Generally the best thing is that if you're familiar with the instances due to running either the old or new versions enough, running with PUGtards who fail on every corner is even more hilarious. Or sad. Whatever.

Devec
May 1 2011, 10:31:29 AM
Is anyone really still actively playing this game or just coming back once in a while in short bursts? Granted my only experience with wow was grinding a hunter up to level 37 and then only to quit with wtf have I been playing the last few weeks and why was I not having fun.

mira o'karr
May 1 2011, 10:56:28 AM
orcane? current guild is looking for a tank/heal paladin. want to transfer over? :D

casual 2 days raiding (mo/wed) in autum/winter we ll prolly go back to 3 days. nice mix of swiss, austrian and germans.
good fun bunch.

orcane
May 1 2011, 11:28:23 AM
Oh god Germans. Oh wait :P

mira o'karr
May 1 2011, 11:38:10 AM
yea i know ... german server /o\
was not too keen at first either but turned out better than expected

Warpath
May 1 2011, 11:48:38 AM
Nab question, whats the fastest way of gaining guild rep and helping to advance the guild lvl as a lowbie player? just joined a lvl16 guild with a new char i rolled on a new server and at this rate it's gonna take 90+ days to get from neutral to friendly as I'm only occasionally gaining a point or so from the occasional quest hand in or when i ding :cut:

mira o'karr
May 1 2011, 11:56:17 AM
i think just leveling to 85 and doing quests will get you there quite quickly.

you ll pick up more guild rep the higher you get in level.

Warpath
May 1 2011, 12:08:41 PM
Thnx, was wondering if it would speed up at higher lvl's. At the moment I'm only getting one point every several quest hand ins which isn't that great.

orcane
May 1 2011, 03:14:19 PM
The thing is, guild rep is tied to guild XP which is tied to XP, and tuned for level 85 XP values. Apparently guild challenges are supposed to fix part of that problem, but in general it's just another side effect of the oh-so-awesome guild XP system. Don't count on contributing till you're getting closer to the level cap. And with contributing to guild XP comes guild rep.

Edit: Holy TMI batman, I'm usually happy when someone gets a conversation going in a PUG but this, WTF. This warlock joins, first thing she's telling us is that she's pregnant. As the run goes on we learn (if we wanted to or not), she's pregnant with twins, polyamorous, her 18yo girlfriend whom she will marry soon is pregnant as well, both by their common boyfriend. Both of those she met while binge drinking after getting raped by some acquaintance, who was beaten up by her father over it. But she's obviously still scarred for life, on the inside and on the outside. We also learned that she got a criminal record for going to the grocery store naked, and we had a real-time report of any fondling of her boobs going on. Doesn't Attention Whoring 101 teach how making up too much shit at once doesn't necessarily make your story more believable? :psyduck:

mira o'karr
May 1 2011, 06:24:56 PM
and you have a problem with german servers???

:P

orcane
May 1 2011, 06:28:54 PM
Well I imagine the whole thing in German and that would be even more :razor: :razor: :monocledowns:

Mavolio
May 1 2011, 06:59:47 PM
Nab question, whats the fastest way of gaining guild rep and helping to advance the guild lvl as a lowbie player? just joined a lvl16 guild with a new char i rolled on a new server and at this rate it's gonna take 90+ days to get from neutral to friendly as I'm only occasionally gaining a point or so from the occasional quest hand in or when i ding :cut:

You can get a guild rep tabard as well at some point tho i cant remember what lvl your guild has to be. Once you start to raid with the guild or run instances with them it wont take very long to get exalted with your guild.

Warpath
May 1 2011, 07:45:43 PM
Nab question, whats the fastest way of gaining guild rep and helping to advance the guild lvl as a lowbie player? just joined a lvl16 guild with a new char i rolled on a new server and at this rate it's gonna take 90+ days to get from neutral to friendly as I'm only occasionally gaining a point or so from the occasional quest hand in or when i ding :cut:

You can get a guild rep tabard as well at some point tho i cant remember what lvl your guild has to be. Once you start to raid with the guild or run instances with them it wont take very long to get exalted with your guild.


Yeah, guild has access to those already, gotta farm a couple of hundred gold first though. As this is my only char on this server. And due to only starting him yesterday he's on lvl 23 or so.

orcane
May 1 2011, 08:08:40 PM
WTF affliction, fucked up UI, demo glyphs, messing up rotation still, no soul swap due to lack of macro... +30% damage over me playing destro previously.

Either I sucked that bad at destro or this is gonna get a nerf-bat really fucking soon :o

Jindo Minian
May 1 2011, 08:49:42 PM
This patch is so fucking buggy...i'm getting pissed off.

Drakma
May 2 2011, 12:27:35 AM
As a level 84 arcane mage, let me just say this is probably the most OP character in WoW right now.

with a mere iLvl of 304 I am the top damage dealer in almost everything I do on my realm. It's not uncommon for me to take on 3 or 4 allies in a bg and barely get below 50% HP.

And then I log on one day to find out that the recent patch has INCREASED my damage... I'm loving it now, but I know a nerf will be incoming.

Hehulk
May 2 2011, 07:28:12 AM
Arcane burst was always silly, which is clearly good for PVP. Problem was it didn't translate well to passable raid DPS.

May 2 2011, 10:33:41 AM
You are just playing against bad peoples if you think Arcane is OP for anything other than single target zerging boss's. Anyone decent would have you shut down and fistfucked before you got a cast off, you have to remember arcane blast is still a very long cast. Unfortunatley its been turned back into a single button joke spec again as long as the mages mana lasts, to be honest they need to totally scratch and rework the tree.

http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/h3eu ... mgitscurii (http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/h3euadsfc2ny58mz/sum/damageDone/?s=3191&e=3721#Omgitscurii)

orcane
May 2 2011, 11:28:24 AM
No question there, but if it's blatantly OP in single target boss fights and weak in PvP or add/AoE fights, that's okay then?

mira o'karr
May 2 2011, 09:45:41 PM
wtf were they thinking when they put akil'zon in.

they really do hate healers.
cant even LFD any more because every fucking troll instance i get in i m joined to a group standing at that boss.
preferably groups that stack no matter how often you tell them.
or better yet. 3 melee + tank.

vomit

orcane
May 2 2011, 10:37:42 PM
He brings back not-so-great memories of trying to PUG (well half PUG, half guildies) ZA on my mage and hunter in 2.4, usually groups already failed on Akil'zon so hard we never got a second or even first chest, and I knew we wouldn't be killing the bosses I needed (Hex Lord and Zul'jin back then).

Just left a guild group + 1 PUG (healer) because they turned on asshat mode and kept trying to kick the healer. They already wasted our time enough by first requeueing about 10 times then picking normal heroic instead of troll one, then started taking BRBs and sitting around for a minute here and there. Every death was due to one of us standing in whirlwinds or "void zones" in Stonecore. I vetoed about 10 kicks before I decided to just let them get some other guild mate who was more into bullying people in PUGs. Wasting 5 or 10 minutes in the process and risking to get an even "worse" healer, no thanks.

mira o'karr
May 2 2011, 11:00:41 PM
just respecced my mage to arcane and did ZA

EL OH EL

while it might not be a raid spec it is definately fun for 5 mans. crits every where :D

Mavolio
May 2 2011, 11:01:10 PM
I vetoed about 10 kicks

I have to wait 2 hours to start a vote kick now :(

orcane
May 2 2011, 11:54:08 PM
Maybe I'm too nice but in general I just kick when I really have to (although I can be petty sometimes and kick people for ninjaing gear from me, or refuse to drop group to make idiots waste their kicking privileges on me). If someone is LD or AFK for too long, kick. If someone is obviously not suited for the job (especially healers or tanks), kick. If you're joining a level 72 group and do 300 DPS because you're auto-following most of the time, and auto-attacking bosses otherwise, you leave. If you're being an asshat and don't contribute at all or port out of the dungeon, kick.

However I really hate just kicking people for the hell of it. Especially kicking someone who's not slowing down or otherwise negatively affecting a run. What do we gain for kicking guys like today's healer? Like refusing to rez him and make him run back for 2-3 minutes, all it does is wasting our own time. If I was healing myself I'd let stupid DPS or tanks die on every corner if they decided to go John Rambo on me and sit down in fire puddles etc. as long as it's not wiping us for real.

mira o'karr
May 4 2011, 11:06:45 PM
recruited 3 new people due to summer attrition and did our first 10 man run with them.
very nice. non of them had prior cata raid experience and we cleared stuff as per usual.
better than running with randoms (and better than the 3 people they filled in for tbh.)
i was about to give up and quit for the summer but now i feel we could actually progress.
hope they ll stick around.

Mavolio
May 4 2011, 11:31:35 PM
how much have you cleared? were you doing 10 or 25 man?

Our guild just p.much died as i quit then the other healer quit, we got to 8/13 hc 10 man tho only raiding twice a week which is p.good and gave us a lot of opportunity to mock guilds with worse progress who raided like 4-5 times a week :P

orcane
May 5 2011, 08:54:22 AM
we were 9/12 in normal modes, working on Cho'gall

now we're back to wiping to Halfus 12 times in 2 hours, require 5+ attempts to kill omnom council - I might not even sign up for raids anymore because it's just such a waste of time, and right now I CBA to PUG heroics (because I can't even get these morons to make guild groups for troll heroics, and having 1-2 other DPS join me doesn't exactly help) to meet the requirements of the "right" guilds

quitting time is coming up I figure, have too many SP games I want to play anyway

mira o'karr
May 10 2011, 06:30:24 AM
funny what difference it makes when you dont have to carry 3 retarded DPS.
with the new guys we killed 2 new bosses yesterday. raiding is fun again. \o/
now if we could just replace our fail GM :D

orcane
May 10 2011, 10:51:32 AM
This is the quality of our DPS (and generally our raid team):

http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/mjc5inc4xs0zwgbf/

Unfortunately, I forgot to set LoggerHead to auto-log BWD because the Chimaeron and Atramedes logs would be even more hilarious. Now, I'm by no means playing well, but at this point I just can't be arsed to fix my UI ie. to unfuck my problems with multidotting and tracking destro's 1337 shitty timers. All it would do is raising my damage contribution from ~25% to 30+. At least we're actually killing most of our previous farm bosses again. TAC and (realistically not) Cho'gall attempts tonight, this will be :obama:

Grarr Dexx
May 10 2011, 01:48:39 PM
Your dpsers are pretty fucking shite :monocledowns:

Hehulk
May 10 2011, 05:19:13 PM
Wow :psyduck:

Idara
May 10 2011, 06:15:38 PM
How the fuck do you have a lock, rogue and 2x shaman doing ~equal damage done as a tank.

orcane
May 10 2011, 06:41:48 PM
I've been asking myself the same question. The problem is that nobody bothers to criticize them and I'm apathetic to the whole thing by now so I'm not going to.

As long as we get to kill bosses, apparently it doesn't matter that some people do less damage than we did at level 80 in ICC. When we wipe we blame it on more obvious fuckups like people dying after 10 seconds in the fight, me fucking up my DXE config so I just AoE the fuck out of our moving ranged team on V&T because I don't see engulfing magic, etc. The healers have the gear and play well enough so taking way longer than reasonable isn't wiping us (but it showed on alt runs with much lesser geared healers who just couldn't keep up 10 minutes for idiots doing 45k RDPS to kill omnom council).

I just don't know how to go on. Right now I'm strongly considering option A: quit and don't look back. Because option B: find new guild requires too much :effort: - I'd have to farm PUGs for more "BiS in content I can access without competent guildies" gear, clean up my UI, stop doing raids semi-AFK and get decent logs while everyone around me is making sure every attempt turns into a clusterfuck within two minutes. Then I'd have to find the right guild, aim too low and I'll be back to trying to gouge my eyes out with a rusty spoon, too high and the best I can expect is "sorry, not experienced/good enough" (often doublespeak for "sure we put all these :nice: words in our recruitment ads but we really only want someone from a higher rated guild than ours/with gear of our progression and beyond").

There is no option for going on like this, doing terrible raids and meanwhile participating in all the grindy shit Blizztards built into this expansion, just so I can keep playing for the sake of it.

Hehulk
May 10 2011, 07:14:23 PM
option B: find new guild requires too much :effort: - I'd have to farm PUGs for more "BiS in content I can access without competent guildies" gear, clean up my UI, stop doing raids semi-AFK and get decent logs while everyone around me is making sure every attempt turns into a clusterfuck within two minutes. Then I'd have to find the right guild, aim too low and I'll be back to trying to gouge my eyes out with a rusty spoon, too high and the best I can expect is "sorry, not experienced/good enough" (often doublespeak for "sure we put all these :nice: words in our recruitment ads but we really only want someone from a higher rated guild than ours/with gear of our progression and beyond").

Wow.

So, your not going to put yourself out there, because no-ones going to want you anyway so what's the fucking point?

:psyduck:

Until very recently I was basically the recruitment officer for my guild (I recently swapped servers and guilds to join a re-roll project), and my outlook for judging potential recruits was do they look like they have a brain. A well written application and some properly enchanted gear that makes you look like you give a shit goes a long way. Experience isn't hard to get, people with a brain, as your clearly well aware, is the trickier bit and while I don't know your raiding skills from adam, the fact that your aware of what you could do to maximize output is to me at least a good sign.

orcane
May 10 2011, 08:11:09 PM
What, no. Putting myself out there, finding new guild - all possible. But I'm kind of beyond fucking around with bads and people who CBA improving, and have a history of trying guilds that aren't really looking for what they say they're looking for. So I'd have to spend more time than usual to check out guilds. That + other "prep logistics" quickly approaches "why bother" territory for me.

Fools Paradise would just say I'm bitter :nostradamus:

mira o'karr
May 11 2011, 08:11:42 AM
what happened to.fools. is she still playing?

Sent from my GT-P1000 using Tapatalk

orcane
May 11 2011, 08:39:57 AM
Saw her running around on her hunter and druid in earlier Cata, haven't seen her in 2 or 3 months now though.

Intigo
May 11 2011, 12:47:07 PM
rip klauz of al'akir, now under new management

mira o'karr
May 15 2011, 10:51:33 AM
who is klauz of alakir?

Helen
May 15 2011, 11:34:52 AM
who is klauz of alakir?

Some one who gave up on this fucking game.

mira o'karr
May 15 2011, 12:07:50 PM
yea i figured but according to armory klauz didnt even make it to 85. so i would have guessed he gave up long ago.

Pacefalm
May 16 2011, 05:04:44 PM
To be fair you were wiping near the end & the shaman already died halfway which explains some of the disparity between Dmg done from dps / dmg done from tank.

Though that doesn't mean they are actually good (otherwise why did they die in the first place)

But yeah what you're going through now is basically exactly what I've been feeling. Me and maybe 2 or 3 core members boosted my useless other guildies all the way through ICC up untill LK, where it's not really possible to boost a group of weaker players as they will just wipe the raid time and time again. But I stayed with them.

Cata though, these people needed boosting to get through the HEROICS, let alone start raiding. I couldn't be arsed anymore and quit playing. Just reactivated my acc 1 month to do the troll HC's with the core members I spoke of, and see if I stay playing, but tbh if you want to quit, for me there was no urge to get back to the game. It's easy to give up a semi-addiction like this.

Helen
May 16 2011, 10:34:30 PM
yea i figured but according to armory klauz didnt even make it to 85. so i would have guessed he gave up long ago.

Fuck grinding. :obama:

orcane
May 16 2011, 11:20:51 PM
If getting to 85 feels to grindy already, it makes sense to quit there. Because it just gets worse after :obama:

Helen
May 17 2011, 12:22:33 AM
If getting to 85 feels to grindy already, it makes sense to quit there. Because it just gets worse after :obama:

Hah I just lost the will to play after leveling up about 10 "toons" to 80 then Cata came and I tried but eurgh this fucking game, its nothing like EvE where its fairly easy to work out which corp(guild) is pretty chill and actually talk.
For a game with so many fucking players it feels like a single player game with a bunch of retarded bots posting shit.

Idara
May 17 2011, 09:38:11 PM
"We're working to let you play with your friends on different servers. But we're gonna charge you to do it because we can. Fuck our subscribers."

mira o'karr
May 18 2011, 06:30:25 AM
"We're working to let you play with your friends on different servers. But we're gonna charge you to do it because we can. Fuck our subscribers."


new feature?

cant access any of the wow related sites. what is this about?

orcane
May 18 2011, 07:44:04 AM
With the continued popularity of the Dungeon Finder, many players have been asking for a way to group up with real-life friends who play on other realms to take on instances together. Today, we wanted to give you a heads up about a new feature currently in development that will allow players to invite Real ID friends of the same faction to a party regardless of the realm they play on, and then queue up for a 5-player regular or Heroic dungeon.

As this is a fairly complex service to develop, we don’t have a release date to share quite yet. It’s important to note that as with some of the other convenience- and connectivity-oriented features we offer, certain elements of the cross-realm Real ID party system will be premium-based, though only the player sending the invitations will need to have access to the premium service. We'll have more details to share with you as development progresses -- in the meantime, you may begin to see elements of the feature appear on the World of Warcraft PTR.
Blizzard is quickly becoming another dev like Cryptic, but unlike Cryptic milking their customers with a "full paid expansions + full subscriptions + micro (and not-so-micro-) transactions" model actually seems to work out.

Pacefalm
May 18 2011, 10:40:23 AM
Go Activision!

Grarr Dexx
May 18 2011, 10:48:32 AM
God forbid people play with their friends in an MMO for only 15 bucks :psyduck:

Lumy
May 18 2011, 11:05:49 AM
God forbid people play with their friends in an MMO for only 15 bucks http://images.code-box.sk/psyblizz.gif
Better, imho.

Idara
May 18 2011, 02:05:09 PM
The biggest thing that pisses me off is that you meet people that play all the time.

At work I know of at least 4 people, all of whom are on different servers.

Because of the sharded servers to begin with, you're fucked to start. Unless you pay money to server transfer.

Now you have to pay to use tech that they're trying to say is "complex". I'm calling bullshit since LFD can do it just fucking fine.

Mavolio
May 18 2011, 04:20:22 PM
Game has been fine for how ever many years without being able to group with people on another server. If they want to charge for that its fair enough its not like people can rly complain as no other mmo lets you do that and its not a core part of the game or gives people who do use it an advantage over those that dont.

Warpath
May 18 2011, 04:21:56 PM
The realm change system nowadays seems to be just an automated script anyway, which happens as soon as you pay for it (or has for me the last couple of times)

pratell
May 18 2011, 06:59:44 PM
The realm change system nowadays seems to be just an automated script anyway, which happens as soon as you pay for it (or has for me the last couple of times)
Confirmin' dis.

orcane
May 18 2011, 08:26:50 PM
Game has been fine for how ever many years without being able to group with people on another server. If they want to charge for that its fair enough its not like people can rly complain as no other mmo lets you do that and its not a core part of the game or gives people who do use it an advantage over those that dont.
I'm not sure that works as an argument. The game has been fine for many years without features X, Y or Z, does that mean they should ask for extra money now everytime they come up with something new, because subscription and full price for the expansions doesn't cover their fees or something? I mean obviously we could be playing vanilla WoW, that was fine too, so we shouldn't really complain.

Besides, extending the pool of people to run dungeons with, without having to rely on dungeon finder PUGs, can be construed as an advantage over those who don't use it. Also it's clearly players' own damn fault for not playing with all acquaintances and friends on the same server, out of about five million WoW servers per region.

arian snow
May 18 2011, 08:35:06 PM
4 months ago I resubbed my 5 year old lvl 60 priest to play with some mates.

Getting to lvl 85 is pretty fucking easy and not really grindy, the quests in Cataclysm are pretty cool even, if a bit easy.

I quickly got to lvl 85, and all was good, started raiding with the guild, however then they decided that they weren't enough people and merged with a more hardcore guild, so now unless I want to play 3 nights a week and do the grind to get flasks I'm basicly not able to play with my mates.

5 man heroics are too easy and quickly become trite, so there is nothing to do anymore, caught in limbo between raids and dungeons.

Wow is way too static, there just isn't any middleground! The general wow populace isn't what you want to group with, so unless you have 10 mates with the same aspirations as you, you are out!

Fuck it!

May 19 2011, 11:39:29 AM
There is no grind to raid, has not really been for years. Currently if your clearing the instances your getting ~100-150(?)g a boss each as well as ~3-5 trash epics a week depending on your luck, selling these nets you easily enough gold to pay for every person to get free flasks with a cauldron and free potions enough to double pot every pull, if you do this and dont wipe often everyone actually earns gold from raiding. With disenchanted epics everyone gets free BiS enchants the only thing we have our people put there hands in there pockets for is gems and repairs on progress wiping, which probably comes to 2-300g a week, hardly a game breaker and again easily covered if your farming boss's.

Would agree to a certain extent about the middle ground from a recruitment perspective, a vast majority of the population certainly on this server are really not very good at the game, we struggle badly to find new people who can actually play to a respectable standard. From my point of view I dont want people to come along and just be average, you have to be better than the person your replacing or standing in for, its really not very hard to execute the prio systems that every dps class works by now and so its difficult to even comprehend how some people are so terrible. This can probably be blamed on what people mentioned above about character x-fers, last time I did it it was done in 20 minutes so its easy to find a quick boost somewhere. Lots of the current hard modes are heavily centered around execution, managing buffs and debuffs, heavy movement and all the stuff bad players fail at handling. There are not many nuke fights anymore and this is what the general player likes, to stand still and unload on a huge hp bar for 5 minutes, there are not many of those encounters now certainly on hc.

Grarr Dexx
May 23 2011, 03:31:52 AM
Decided to put some effort into levelling my bear. I dinged 85 yesterday, bought a cheap boe helmet from gbank and two very cheap troll boes. Together with both Leatherworking epics and the Alchemy Stone I managed to start off relatively strong as soon as I finished the level.

Today, I am raid ready: http://eu.battle.net/wow/en/character/bloodhoof/ursulla/advanced

I only managed to get half-way to Wildhammer exalted so far (I've only done 7 heroics and 3-4 troll heroics), still need to start on Therazane pre-quests and even though I managed to get the head tanking enchant from my hunter through BoA, I will still have to grind the Earthern Ring rep for the Signet. From there on out it'll be trying to max out my valor points on a weekly base to fill my slots with set pieces and other epics, and where not possible, other troll epics.

Mavolio
May 23 2011, 02:22:33 PM
Currently if your clearing the instances your getting ~100-150(?)g a boss each as well as ~3-5 trash epics a week depending on your luck, selling these nets you easily enough gold to pay for every person to get free flasks with a cauldron and free potions enough to double pot every pull, if you do this and dont wipe often everyone actually earns gold from raiding.

Cata raiding was p.nice for how easy it was to get raiding mats. I remember in classic where i had to go farm stuff like demonic runes to min/max my char to ensure that we could kill a boss. It was a lot of effort compared to now where i could just buy off the ah every week and still turn a very nice profit from raiding.

orcane
May 23 2011, 07:12:06 PM
hurr, keys back to cluttering up my already full bags and bank

but apparently 2005 wanted its features back

Idara
May 23 2011, 07:53:39 PM
Why the fuck are they half assing it?

They're removing something that keeps clutter down.

But they aren't adding anything to get rid of arch/vanity/holiday item clutter. Or the keys that we'll still have.

Grarr Dexx
May 23 2011, 08:04:41 PM
Tabards!

orcane
May 23 2011, 08:09:32 PM
Can't you just buy 99% of all tabards from a tabard vendor? I don't get why people get orgasms about potential tabard storage so much...

Idara
May 23 2011, 09:02:27 PM
Yeah, but some need their respective currency to buy.

Like you need apexis shards for Ogri'la and Glowcaps for Sporeggar.

I just want to be able to clear my bank of the vanity holiday items tbh.

Grarr Dexx
May 24 2011, 05:11:08 PM
So far raid bosses downed on my Bear are Argaloth, Halfus, Double Dragon. All PUGS. Halfus and DD was done half an hour ago, took maybe all of an hour to clear trash and do the two bosses before we had to wrap up. Since it resets tonight, we'll start pugging both instances more intensively starting next week.

Mavolio
May 24 2011, 05:41:52 PM
gz on killing them! now you have the achi you dont have to join fail groups either which is quite nice!

Intigo
May 24 2011, 06:03:05 PM
who is klauz of alakir?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oj5IAvc8Z6A&hd=1

this amazing Rogue

WoW was fun back in the days

May 24 2011, 06:17:38 PM
What am I missing in that vid, he is what looks like full t4 rogue ganking some backpeddaling nubs that are levelling in Grizzly Hills, they dont even target him back. Lasts about a minute, could have had them all dead in about 15 seconds. The arena pass 2011 is up now just check out xfire for live streams of some better pvp.

Intigo
May 24 2011, 06:21:51 PM
I was levelling in my lvl 70 arena gear

u mad~~~~~

Mavolio
May 24 2011, 06:26:05 PM
What am I missing in that vid

Not much, its just another "crit vid" where it shows 1 guy doing super well but without any context. High tier arena stuff can be ok tho as both parties have similar gear and are expecting to be attacked.

I remember 99% of PvP vids in vanilla wow were just some guy recording 24/7 in their Tier 2/2.5/3 gear till they get some lucky crits and own 2-3 people in scrub blues and calming that showed super skills.

edit: lol i use to raid with Dabbmundur back in the day. We were in The Alliance RG1

Brisi
May 24 2011, 06:40:09 PM
Whatever you think of arena pvp, it definately is the most boring esport to watch (that i've seen). it's just not entertaining in any way to see people pillar-humping for whatever period of time until the perfect cc-combo goes off and one team wins.

orcane
May 24 2011, 07:22:36 PM
So 4.2 basically brings about a 20% nerf to T11 encounters vOv

Also no more dodge from agility for plate tanks, yay (not)

Pacefalm
May 24 2011, 07:28:58 PM
As if you were stacking agility to begin with

Its at worst a few % after horn/soe

orcane
May 24 2011, 07:47:48 PM
stacking, no

but it made certain agility/mastery items superior to some of the terribly itemized crap Blizzard made for plate tanks, it also made leg enchants for tanks useful, and a handful of agility/mastery trinkets to boot - "a few %" is exactly what we're going after with min-maxing

Grarr Dexx
May 24 2011, 09:58:53 PM
Cho'gall heroic down on my main Hunter:

http://img62.imageshack.us/img62/9899/chogallkill.jpg

zangorus
May 24 2011, 11:15:11 PM
Grand marshal pretbc motherfuckers

Mavolio
May 24 2011, 11:50:14 PM
Grand marshal pretbc motherfuckers

wasn't that when it only required time not skills tho?

Hehulk
May 25 2011, 12:15:27 AM
The reroll guild I'm in just started raiding tonight, knocked out 7/12 in a 4 hour window. Feeling good about my decision a month ago now :)

Waagaa
May 25 2011, 12:30:03 AM
Grand marshal pretbc motherfuckers

wasn't that when it only required time not skills tho?

time + premades, but yes. :) Solo grinding GM was pretty painful.

cullnean
May 25 2011, 10:04:15 AM
yeah was rank 10 warlock, was never ever gonna get any further without

A - Getting in a premade guild and waiting my turn to be boosted
B - Quitting my job

Jindo Minian
May 25 2011, 10:13:44 AM
I am quite bored of this game again.
There is nothing to do once you get 85 if it's not a raid day.

orcane
May 25 2011, 11:01:55 AM
I am quite bored of this game again.
There is nothing to do once you get 85 if it's not a raid day.
There's a lot to do. And all of it feels like playing Lineage 2.5 :obama:

Jindo Minian
May 25 2011, 11:14:05 AM
Dungeon grind = Over my dead body.
Kills trolls = People are too dumb for Trolls.
Farm for gold? Pointless.
Farm for Potions or whatever? No need.

I fail to see what there is to do. I'm not gonna level up a 5th twink to get bored again.

orcane
May 25 2011, 11:23:10 AM
The things are there but you refuse to do them. Which is completely valid but the option to just waste hours on dungeon, honor, rep, token, achievement or whatever grinding is definitely there for the people who can't let go.

Aramendel
May 25 2011, 11:55:45 AM
Jepp. What you are saying isn't "There is nothing to do" but ""There is nothing to do I like". Which is perfectly fine. But one thing you cannot really accuse WoW is that it has little content at 85.

You can do PvP, achievment farming, instances, mount farming, rep farming, archaelogy (*shiver*), playing the AH, etc. It's all in the end pointless of cource, but ..well.. it is an MMORPG. ALL you do there is pointless.

Mind, I quit WoW a while ago (again) because I realized that I (again) do stuff only cause I got (again) addicted and not cause it was still fun to do.

Jindo Minian
May 25 2011, 12:34:20 PM
But i can accuse it of not having anything to do and no content.
It doesn't matter if the things exist along with the option to do them if neither of those are fun.

I mean, who logs in excitedly saying "OMG, i can't wait to kill those 8000 Naga i need get the fucking Hippogryph."
It really can't be that hard to come up with something fun to do at 85 surely, aside from Raids...which to be fair aren't always interesting either depending on who you are playing with.

Aramendel
May 25 2011, 12:45:47 PM
But i can accuse it of not having anything to do and no content.
It doesn't matter if the things exist along with the option to do them if neither of those are fun.
No, you cannot. Because it is phrased as general fact. Which it isn't. It has nothing "fun" to do FOR YOU. Not in general. In short:

- "It has no content" -> wrong.
- "It has no content which I find fun" -> correct.

"Content" is no defined by you liking it. Content is stuff one can possibly do, plain and simple. WoW has plenty of stuff to do at 85. If only stuff which everyone liked counted then there would be no content in any game whatsoever, never. Because *nothing* is liked by everyone.



I mean, who logs in excitedly saying "OMG, i can't wait to kill those 8000 Naga i need get the fucking Hippogryph."

No, but they log in "I can't wait to get that fucking Hippogryph."
Some people just like to collect things.

ThonEney
May 25 2011, 01:33:43 PM
Jepp. What you are saying isn't "There is nothing to do" but ""There is nothing to do I like". Which is perfectly fine. But one thing you cannot really accuse WoW is that it has little content at 85.

You can do PvP, achievment farming, instances, mount farming, rep farming, archaelogy (*shiver*), playing the AH, etc. It's all in the end pointless of cource, but ..well.. it is an MMORPG. ALL you do there is pointless.

Mind, I quit WoW a while ago (again) because I realized that I (again) do stuff only cause I got (again) addicted and not cause it was still fun to do.
The problem is that all of those contain the word grinding.

Shaikar
May 25 2011, 01:37:20 PM
Yeah, much better off playing one of the many games that don't involve repetitive or pointless tasks - have a complete list of alternatives:

Trindermon
May 25 2011, 01:40:17 PM
No, but they log in "I can't wait to get that fucking Hippogryph."
Some people just like to collect things.

What Hippogryph and what nagas? i want to grind another mount! lol.

Warpath
May 25 2011, 01:50:56 PM
No, but they log in "I can't wait to get that fucking Hippogryph."
Some people just like to collect things.

What Hippogryph and what nagas? i want to grind another mount! lol.

http://www.wowwiki.com/Cenarion_War_Hippogryph

:?:



Reins of Poseidus is another to keep an eye open for, seen this going for 400k on on servers ah

Aramendel
May 25 2011, 04:38:51 PM
The problem is that all of those contain the word grinding.

True. But it is still content.

Name MMORPG endgame content which is not essentially grinding. There isn't any I can think of. You might as well complain that a FPS has no puzzle sections than complaining that MMORPG endgame content has grinding. And before saying that they should make Endgame content which does not require grinding think how exactly that could be done with halfway the same effort you need to design content which does require grinding.

Just because you would like a personal jet-helicopter for 1000$ it does not make it something which can be build.

orcane
May 25 2011, 06:14:42 PM
Well I don't really agree that endgame content necessarily means grinding. Apart from the subjective nature of the topic (not everyone considers the same things as grindy), content isn't really created equal, if we look at the game as a whole the main goal in PvE is to progress through raids and kill bosses. Some people might be happy enough to keep paying 15$/month for what's essentially side-quests like farming achievements, special items or reps for the hell of it, but in the end that's just entirely optional, and I dare say: second class content you may or may not do while using WoW as a 3D chat client.

Of course to some people the intended endgame isn't interesting so they would disagree that the things they like doing, like farming stuff that's even more pointless in the scope of the game, is somehow inferior. And others would then argue that even raiding is grinding because you just do it over and over and over again. But I definitely think there's grind, and there's "grind", and the optional occupations at 85 right now (even more so with 4.2's new daily area, ugh) are of the former category.

Ashaz
May 25 2011, 06:27:56 PM
Jepp. What you are saying isn't "There is nothing to do" but ""There is nothing to do I like". Which is perfectly fine. But one thing you cannot really accuse WoW is that it has little content at 85.

You can farming, mount farming, rep farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming,

yea. Look at all those options! :mrgreen:

Derpy'eart
May 25 2011, 06:35:02 PM
All I see you people talking about is endgame pve. has blizzard fucked the balance up that bad? 70 3v3 arena was pretty fun.

Lilalaunebör
May 25 2011, 06:56:01 PM
Dont know about arenas (or anything really since i quit 3 month ago), but arena and the new ranked battlegrounds were the only thing keeping the game going for a lot of people i knew, many formerly dedicated 40man raider among them.
That said there was the power creep of accomodating 5+ more abilities that did create more issues in the balancing compared to lvl70. Often a class would be fotm op just to be raped in the face with the next overhaul (pallys im looking at you, also the ups and downs of afflis).

orcane
May 25 2011, 07:05:07 PM
Yeah like arenas at 70 were any balanced...

Alistair
May 25 2011, 08:08:53 PM
I tend to agree with the "content exists, but I just don't like any of it anymore" school when it comes to WoW.

Everything in game feels very much of a "been there, done that....a million times" vibe. Almost all WoW content boils down to grinding/farming for some looks item, or some slight-upgrade weapon. Even PvP Battlegrounds lost it's appeal for me after years of playing it effectively the same way. Like my start over EVE thread, doing an AV today will never have the appeal that doing AV in the early days (where one AV could take 8 hours to run) did.

Wow, despite their best efforts, now feels old and outdated to me almost accross the board. It looks ancient to my eyes graphics wise, and the gameplay has not changed in any meaningful way really, it's still all about the grind.

Worse, longtimers have had so much time that having a half-dozen max level toons is commonplace, and thats alot of playing the same content over, and over, and over. Hard not to be bored with it at this point.

In truth, Blizzard can probably run WoW as is for years more, and still make absolute bank with it. But if they're really truly smart, they'd be working now on a transition, a replacement for WoW moving everything forward to current standards, and with a broader, more open World Gameplay option available. Think World of Starcraft, WoW style gameplay combined with many elements of EVE (Sandbox, lawless/player owned space/locations, free market, player produced goods, etc). Even if teh idea sickens you, it would be a smash hit.

As it is, almost every WoW player I've known over the years has either quit, or gone inactive, or is desperately seeking something to replace WoW with. Star Wars is the one most look at now as a possible replacement.

End of teh day, it's hard to find teh same enjoyment in a 6 year+ old game that one did in it's early days. At some point we all have to move on, the players and Blizzard both.

ElweSingollo
May 25 2011, 11:59:20 PM
In truth, Blizzard can probably run WoW as is for years more, and still make absolute bank with it. But if they're really truly smart, they'd be working now on a transition, a replacement for WoW moving everything forward to current standards, and with a broader, more open World Gameplay option available. Think World of Starcraft, WoW style gameplay combined with many elements of EVE (Sandbox, lawless/player owned space/locations, free market, player produced goods, etc). Even if teh idea sickens you, it would be a smash hit.

Last I checked Blizzards developement cycle had an MMO listed in developement called titan expected for release 2012 ish though there are no details regarding where they are going with it in terms of who/what/how etc.

Grarr Dexx
May 26 2011, 12:07:29 AM
All I see you people talking about is endgame pve. has blizzard fucked the balance up that bad? 70 3v3 arena was pretty fun.

If you were a rogue with Glaives maybe.

Pacefalm
May 26 2011, 12:21:28 AM
Yeah, much better off playing one of the many games that don't involve repetitive or pointless tasks - have a complete list of alternatives:
lol'd

Ruri
May 26 2011, 01:20:38 AM
Worse, longtimers have had so much time that having a half-dozen max level toons is commonplace, and thats alot of playing the same content over, and over, and over. Hard not to be bored with it at this point.

Honestly, with heirlooms you only see about 1/4 of the content you're meant to while leveling normally, even less if you have the full set from your guild bank. So it's entirely possible that leveling four characters (assuming ~25% bonus exp, and that's low) you'll see completely different content each time. And the work they did on some of these places since Cataclysm is quite cool.

Of course 98% of the quests can be boiled down to some variant of a lazy ass NPC saying "Hey, go get me a Coke." The number of Cokes may vary, and you may have to kill a lot of creatures/people/plants to take their Cokes, or travel across continents to find the right kind of Coke, but in the end that's still the basic quest philosophy.

Edit: That's why I couldn't get into Rift btw, the graphics are nicer and the souls might be cool and all, but I still couldn't shake the feeling that I was just fetching some fantasy jackass their hourly allotment of tasty beverages.

Mavolio
May 26 2011, 01:49:59 AM
I'm not sure why people are shocked that there isn't much to do after 5-6 years. I'm sure blizzard go to sleep with a big gin on their face about how they are getting people to keep playing after all this time. The Dungeon system blizzard implemented a while back didn't rly help things as much as they hoped either. While its a lot easier to get a group now the sense of community has just vanished as you never group with the same people more than once so you can do 10+ instances with no one talking.

I think Cata was an attempt to fix some of the problems the game in terms of end game but it felt a bit rushed which didn't rly help. For example the 10 man raiding was one of the major things they added for cata but it kind of failed as the game balancing wasn't any where near as well done as 25 man. This resulted in a fair number of guilds just falling apart as they couldn't even manage the normal mods. They did add some new mechanics in cata as well tho not all of them were implemented into the raid content that was available at release so maybe fire lands will show more different types of mechanic that will bring some old players back.

Maybe the quest hob zone they are adding as well will give people more stuff to do as the sun well quest area was a lot of fun with all the ganking.

orcane
May 26 2011, 07:31:20 AM
Well it certainly gives you a lot of daily quests to grind in order to unlock more daily quests :P



Worse, longtimers have had so much time that having a half-dozen max level toons is commonplace, and thats alot of playing the same content over, and over, and over. Hard not to be bored with it at this point.

Honestly, with heirlooms you only see about 1/4 of the content you're meant to while leveling normally, even less if you have the full set from your guild bank. So it's entirely possible that leveling four characters (assuming ~25% bonus exp, and that's low) you'll see completely different content each time. And the work they did on some of these places since Cataclysm is quite cool.
I think the problem is more closely related to what you do when you get to the level cap again (the exact same thing as with the last alt, farm points and reputation to gear up so you're not entirely useless?), and that the new quest experience drops off for 20 more or less terrible levels, which makes constantly running new alts through the solo content still a pointless experience at some point.

ThonEney
May 26 2011, 08:08:51 AM
The problem is that all of those contain the word grinding.

True. But it is still content.

Name MMORPG endgame content which is not essentially grinding. There isn't any I can think of. You might as well complain that a FPS has no puzzle sections than complaining that MMORPG endgame content has grinding. And before saying that they should make Endgame content which does not require grinding think how exactly that could be done with halfway the same effort you need to design content which does require grinding.

Just because you would like a personal jet-helicopter for 1000$ it does not make it something which can be build.
I understand that there is a grind its in all the games but wow has it just too much even pvping is grinding untill a point.

sinergistic
May 26 2011, 08:16:36 AM
Name MMORPG endgame content which is not essentially grinding.


Planetside.

Aramendel
May 26 2011, 09:38:47 AM
Well I don't really agree that endgame content necessarily means grinding.

I mean grinding in terms of "repetitive gameplay", not in "non-entertaining gameplay". Those do not need to be connected to make something "grinding", you can have a blast doing something, if you do the same thing over and over again it is still grinding.

In order to have no grind you would have to design an unending chain of unique content which you do not repeat. Basically continue to progression from 1 to 85 ad infinitum. That cannot be done with todays technology, unless you pay 100$ / month suscriptions to pay the people creating the content.

The main reason MMORPGs have grind is not because it is a so entertaining gameplay style, but because it has a very good gameplay gained / design time invested ratio.
As a result the endgame of all MMORPGs is based on grind really. Be it because you play in the same arena for the xth time, having a raid boss on farm since months or getting your 2635th achievement. Or do the same roam with the same ship setups for the xth time. Or farm the same rats again and again. EVE isn't different there. Or Rift. Or Warhammer. Or (haha) Aion.

Endgame content in an MMORPG means grinding. Complaining about it makes as much sense as complaining that all you do in shooters in shooting. And demanding that there should be non-grind endgame content only shows that you haven't really thought it through.

Of cource there is Grind and there is GRIND. But you do not really have "kill 8000" nagas grind in WoW anymore. The worst you get today is the dailies grind, other MMORPGs aren't really better (or worse) there.


I understand that there is a grind its in all the games but wow has it just too much even pvping is grinding untill a point.

How exactly has it more than other MMORPGs? That doesn't really seem to be the case to me. Actually I take that back - WoW has more grinding endgame options than other MMORPGs. but that isn't because other MMORPGs have more non-grind endgame content, but because they less endgame options.

If game A has 5 grindy endgame options and game B has 20 grindy endgame options game B has more grind. But that does not make game A better - if anything B is better because there you'll have a higher chance to find a grind you find entertaining.



Name MMORPG endgame content which is not essentially grinding.

Planetside.

And that is an MMORPG how exactly? You might just as well use Team Fortress as example.

And nevermind that you could do only Battlegrounds and Arenas in WoW and have the same playstyle as Planetside. You still consume the same content over and over again, in both games.

Grarr Dexx
May 26 2011, 10:39:28 AM
And this is bad why? If you're having fun why would anyone give a shit what his activity is pigeonholed as?

Jindo Minian
May 26 2011, 11:42:03 AM
And this is bad why? If you're having fun why would anyone give a shit what his activity is pigeonholed as?

Which was my point all along. It doesn't matter what you want to call it, if it isn't even remotely interesting it might as well just not exist. It's basically the same thing. However if something is fun, it doesn't matter if technically it is repeatative. Because it's fun and people want to have fun.

If you want to pigeonhole it, every single sport ever invented is repeatative.


On a WoW note, finally killed the Council yesterday. That was fun but argh, frustrating. Died with Captain Planet having 70k once and then 10k left the try after.

ThonEney
May 26 2011, 12:43:00 PM
How the hell is EVE grindy, yeah you can grind but it gives you the choice not to and quite a few ways to achieve it.

Aramendel
May 26 2011, 01:07:15 PM
And this is bad why? If you're having fun why would anyone give a shit what his activity is pigeonholed as?

Where did I write that it is bad?


Which was my point all along. It doesn't matter what you want to call it, if it isn't even remotely interesting it might as well just not exist. It's basically the same thing. However if something is fun, it doesn't matter if technically it is repeatative. Because it's fun and people want to have fun.

:facepalm:

The point which you apparently *still* no comprehend is that FUN IS SUBJECTIVE. So you can rate the fun of an activity ONLY FOR YOURSELF.

You rate "x has no content" because you do not like the content. Which is :psyduck: Are you really unable to comprehend that not everyone has the same preferences as you do? To you really do not understand that
X has no content
and
X has no content I like
are two very different things?


How the hell is EVE grindy, yeah you can grind but it gives you the choice not to and quite a few ways to achieve it.

So you never do the same roams and earn your isk with an activity which does not repeat itself (which I find extremly doubtful)? If you go by that logic WoW is not grindy either because you can PvP and a BG and Arena never plays out exactly the same. Oh, and you are far less reliant on money than in EvE. So WoW is by that logic less grindy than EVE.

mira o'karr
May 26 2011, 02:28:30 PM
so i started leveling an undead horde hunter to see what they had done to the starter zones. really good fun and well improved.

best quest so far is the first quest in hillsbrad foothills. the quest that makes you the quest giver.
after two fairly funny wow stereotypes i was presented with the ultimate... a blood elf on a celestial steed.
comment from an npc next to me "thank you aaaand good night"

it made me lol :D

yes, game is grindy and some times tedious but it is full of little gems like this quest.
it is casual enough for me to log in once or twice a week and talk on TS while bashing on some dragon.
i still like.

orcane
May 26 2011, 02:34:58 PM
we finally got past the first phase of Cho'gall by stacking ranged DPS - 4 hunters, 1 shadow priests and one warlock (only down to 5% but w/e, I think we actually have a chance now...)

encounter balance wat

Pacefalm
May 26 2011, 02:53:54 PM
Didn't want those melee class player's subscription anyways

Grarr Dexx
May 26 2011, 02:58:40 PM
What? Cho phase 1 isn't even that difficult for melee. Are your players getting hit by shadow crashes or something?

Koll
May 26 2011, 03:11:54 PM
Finally got my priest to level 85 last night. It's my fifth 85 and I did about 90% of this guys levelling from 10-85 via PvP with a brief stop off at 60 to do half a dozen MC runs to get benediction. I did a deal with a guildy in which I would use my Paladin to build him a Hammer in exchange for him letting me tag along on his eye of raggy runs to get the eye of divinity. on the last run he did I got the eye of Divinity and he got the eye of Sulfuras. I traded him the Hammer and he got his legendary and I wondered off to go get Benediction. The staff now lives in my bags awaiting the day Blizz introduces vanity slots so i can forever have it equipped. Now that Blizz have removed the drop item and quest chain for Benediction and there is no other staff in game (to my knowledge) that shares its model it's even rarer.

Aramendel
May 26 2011, 03:16:51 PM
What? Cho phase 1 isn't even that difficult for melee. Are your players getting hit by shadow crashes or something?

Agreed. The only issue I see is that you need good AOE in that fight, if you have too much melee without it it could be a problem. We killed him easily with 2 melee / 3 ranged ourselves. Although 1 melee was a frost DK, which have good ranged AOE.

May 26 2011, 04:18:32 PM
Dont put melee anywhere near the blobs on Cho'gall. You can even have melee stay on the boss to nuke through the phase much faster as you only need to kill the adherants in time for them expoloding, tank can easily handle interupts on ten man, less adherants, less potential corruption.

mira o'karr
May 26 2011, 04:31:58 PM
we finally got past the first phase of Cho'gall by stacking ranged DPS - 4 hunters, 1 shadow priests and one warlock (only down to 5% but w/e, I think we actually have a chance now...)

encounter balance wat

please tell me that is on normal so my guild are not the only noobs stuck on him :D

orcane
May 26 2011, 05:11:11 PM
remember that log from a few pages back, of course it's on normal :D

"isn't even that difficult for melee" only works if said melee are any good, here we have the ranged DPS being the best DPS players in the guild + encounter design favouring classes which almost never move in the whole fight = at least it lets us get close to killing him instead of wiping between 30 and 50%

edit: only took about eleventy tries and a few 1-5% wipes, but we actually won. :tumbleweed:

Idara
May 26 2011, 10:19:53 PM
Oh for fucks' sake.

Holy Shield has been redesigned. This talent is now an activated ability off the global cooldown. It grants 20% increased block amount to a paladin's shield blocks for 10 seconds, with a 30-second cooldown.

So we're losing our smoothing effect Holy shield gave us for some bullshit 1/3 uptime Shield Block ability from warriors.

Fucking class homogenization, jesus christ.

ThonEney
May 26 2011, 11:13:58 PM
Nope don't consider most of those grindy, guess it really depends. The thing is i might even sub because everything else got boring and a few friends are playing this.

Grarr Dexx
May 27 2011, 12:05:43 PM
Give my bear a ranged interrupt already :cut:

Shaikar
May 27 2011, 12:07:36 PM
What do you need one for?

I have staff for that sort of thing.

Snowman
May 29 2011, 02:47:19 AM
I got an email from blizzard giving me a free 5 day trial, what's the fastest way to get a dragon to ride (horde warlock, lvl 74).

Last time I played was when blizzard offered me a 5 day trial over a year ago (I think).

Koll
May 29 2011, 02:50:36 AM
I got an email from blizzard giving me a free 5 day trial, what's the fastest way to get a dragon to ride (horde warlock, lvl 74).

Get to 80, have someone boost you through culling of strath heroic and kill the extra boss. 100% drop chance of bronze drake mount.

You could also camp Storm Peaks in the hopes of catching the timelost proto drake. Also a 100% drop chance but nowhere near as high a chance of him spawning whilst you're online and then you finding and killing him before someone else does. You could also farm Wyrmrest rep and just buy the red drake mount from them.

Mavolio
May 29 2011, 02:56:21 AM
find some one with that potion thing that turns them self into a dragon you can ride.

Snowman
May 29 2011, 03:04:51 AM
I got an email from blizzard giving me a free 5 day trial, what's the fastest way to get a dragon to ride (horde warlock, lvl 74).

Get to 80, have someone boost you through culling of strath heroic and kill the extra boss. 100% drop chance of bronze drake mount.

You could also camp Storm Peaks in the hopes of catching the timelost proto drake. Also a 100% drop chance but nowhere near as high a chance of him spawning whilst you're online and then you finding and killing him before someone else does. You could also farm Wyrmrest rep and just buy the red drake mount from them.
How tough is the proto drake and does it require 80 as well?

Mavolio
May 29 2011, 03:13:12 AM
http://www.wowhead.com/search?q=proto+drake#mounts

That mount will prob be the easiest to get if you can get an 85 to boost you. I think its lvl 77 for the flying mount skill as well not 100% tho.

Hehulk
May 29 2011, 10:28:42 AM
http://www.wowhead.com/search?q=proto+drake#mounts

That mount will prob be the easiest to get if you can get an 85 to boost you. I think its lvl 77 for the flying mount skill as well not 100% tho.

It's 60 for basic flying now, 68 for cold weather flight which did use to be 77. Epic flight (280%) at 70 and master (310%) at 80

Warpath
May 29 2011, 10:45:08 AM
Or if you can get 50 "normal" mounts you get a drake for free?

Grarr Dexx
May 29 2011, 12:16:58 PM
Got Raven Lord from a CTA bag with my druid, instead of sending it to my hunter :facepalm:

Snowman
May 29 2011, 04:26:33 PM
Or if you can get 50 "normal" mounts you get a drake for free?
That's a lot of gold :ohnoes:

Also it would require a lot of rep grinding since I am only honored with the other horde factions.

Warpath
May 29 2011, 06:03:36 PM
Also it would require a lot of rep grinding since I am only honored with the other horde factions.


Go buy the tabards for the horde factions and go into RFC and aoe everything down, it will take what 5 mins a run?

Snowman
May 29 2011, 07:52:07 PM
Also it would require a lot of rep grinding since I am only honored with the other horde factions.


Go buy the tabards for the horde factions and go into RFC and aoe everything down, it will take what 5 mins a run?
I just randomly bought one for the look and had no idea about the bonus, then did a few dungeons with the finder and am almost through honoured with the trolls :lol:

orcane
May 30 2011, 02:06:21 AM
http://eu.battle.net/wow/en/character/d ... f/advanced (http://eu.battle.net/wow/en/character/draenor/sgpwolf/advanced)

these gems, what is this, I don't even

Shaikar
May 30 2011, 02:19:20 AM
http://eu.battle.net/wow/en/character/draenor/sgpwolf/advanced

these gems, what is this, I don't evenThat's a quality epic gem.

From 4 years ago.

And a fine example of why I wouldn't touch the dungeon finder with a bargepole. :)

ElweSingollo
May 30 2011, 03:17:49 AM
http://eu.battle.net/wow/en/character/draenor/sgpwolf/advanced

these gems, what is this, I don't evenThat's a quality epic gem.

From 4 years ago.

And a fine example of why I wouldn't touch the dungeon finder with a bargepole. :)

ye gods a bow with strength and expertese on it too melee hunter ftw? :lol:

orcane
May 30 2011, 04:00:50 AM
at least he did around 5-6k DPS, unlike his two DK guildies who did 4k each

when one of them went LD the healer and me kicked all three so we could finish HoO

Grarr Dexx
May 30 2011, 07:22:07 PM
Oh yeah hunters, had one a while back with a strength bow, a leather helmet and best of all, a scorpid pet with the agi/str buff slot still open.

On a different note, took a pug to BWD with my bear alt yesterday, we get to work on magmaw, the two drudges before magmaw dropped two boe's: maldo's sword cane and theresa's booklight. I outrolled everyone on the cane and put it on the AH for 30k buyout. It sold. Boggles my mind that people still buy boe's at that price with troll epics and firelands around the corner. Anyways, we managed to drag the BWD pug to 5/6 with only one wipe on maloriak and chimaeron, which was surprisingly succesful given that it took us two hours tops.

Mavolio
May 30 2011, 07:49:58 PM
put it on the AH for 30k buyout. It sold. Boggles my mind that people still buy boe's at that price

30k isn't that much any more. Especially as only people who play a lot bother to buy epics and you can make 30k in a few days p.easy

Snowman
May 30 2011, 08:52:46 PM
Still working towards that mount.

I am half way to 79 but don't know where to level now, or what major things I should be doing. I did that cut scene quest thing w/ Arthas and the gate last in the dragon place and now don't know where I should go.

Grarr Dexx
May 30 2011, 09:01:49 PM
Stormpeaks. Go to a place called K3. You should hit 80 before you're done with all the branches that come from there.

orcane
May 30 2011, 09:08:36 PM
TBH even though I'm too lazy to make more money out of the one I have and wouldn't spend more than 10k on anything at this point, for someone with the money and no raid guild 30k is probably worth it over wasting time with idiot PUGs in troll heroics. These things go for so much because a) the general population isn't raiding, b) there's no equivalent gear available from "easy" content and c) everyone plays DPS.

The alternative for a mage/warlock are a dagger from the 3rd ZA chest, a staff from the last boss in ZG, an archaeology rare staff, conquest point staff/spellblade or the new version of Julak-Doom's BoE (which I have never, ever seen on the AH since 4.1 launched). For a holy paladin it's the PvP mace or a drop from Zul'jin Mk.2. Or that sword. This sword is simply the easiest/best failsafe option for those classes.

Voulture
May 30 2011, 10:14:29 PM
Stormpeaks. Go to a place called K3. You should hit 80 before you're done with all the branches that come from there.
Just wanted to add that chain for sons of hodir is amazing and well worth doing to the end. Especially if you ware in for some nordic mythology. I hate question and i loved those ones. Not that i play anymore or something but dont miss it ;)

Hehulk
May 30 2011, 11:17:19 PM
New spangly raiding guild just finished up our first week of raiding a day early. 12/12 cleared. Tomorrow we're aiming for a full clear in BWD again, then heroic halfus on thursday. :Feelsgoodman:

Snowman
May 31 2011, 05:07:20 AM
This item level system is dumb.

For Trial of the Champion you need a 180 average, but most of the gear which I've got over 180 is just stats (lots of spirit) which iirc isn't as good for warlocks.

e: couple items + lvl 80 achieved :v:


http://www.wowhead.com/search?q=proto+drake#mounts

That mount will prob be the easiest to get if you can get an 85 to boost you. I think its lvl 77 for the flying mount skill as well not 100% tho.

I have master riding trained now but I have no idea where these various raids are, and I should probably try to find a guild to mooch off of now I guess...

orcane
May 31 2011, 07:38:14 AM
It is dumb (BoA items are level 1 items, but on par with the best blues/some epics of a given level) but also exploitable, fill bags with high level gear that's otherwise shit, queue, profit.

Sadly WotLK was all about "make spirit work for all casters" so it's on a vast majority of dungeon drops and quest items. Then they decided that TBC was the best time ever and scrapped that and now all you get as a amge/warlock is OOC regen from it.

:derper:

Forever Calzone
May 31 2011, 10:58:18 PM
Got a question for people, I saw from Totalbiscuit's site that he's ditching wow based on blizzard nerfing raiding(lolagain) I played from beta up until the release of wrath and had the joys of raiding a plenty. Just curious how much can they really nerf it anymore? Did it get a buff with wrath/wutever that new one is or is it literally just degrading to hello kitty online with some bejeweled mixed in?

Grarr Dexx
May 31 2011, 11:58:16 PM
It's only normal modes, but they basically took all the normal modes down 20% in the health, damage and danger levels, making them all pretty much faceroll.

On another note, we got Sinestra down to 8% tonight. If you thought phase one to three get hard, you wait til Essence of the Red drops off.

Pacefalm
June 1 2011, 12:39:00 AM
Got a question for people, I saw from Totalbiscuit's site that he's ditching wow based on blizzard nerfing raiding(lolagain) I played from beta up until the release of wrath and had the joys of raiding a plenty. Just curious how much can they really nerf it anymore? Did it get a buff with wrath/wutever that new one is or is it literally just degrading to hello kitty online with some bejeweled mixed in?
Compared to Wrath, Cata raiding is much harder. Even normal modes are more difficult than some of the 'hard' modes in wrath. Blizzard is realising they are losing too many "not great" players because they can't progress even in normal modes. So they nerf normal mode but keep hardmode the same so the cool kids still have some toys to play with.

orcane
June 1 2011, 01:26:08 AM
That and there's no point in having challenging normal modes nobody raids because they'll just farm easier heroics for the same points and/or move straight to Firelands.


Got a question for people, I saw from Totalbiscuit's site that he's ditching wow based on blizzard nerfing raiding(lolagain) I played from beta up until the release of wrath and had the joys of raiding a plenty. Just curious how much can they really nerf it anymore? Did it get a buff with wrath/wutever that new one is or is it literally just degrading to hello kitty online with some bejeweled mixed in?
I'd say the current normal modes are about on par with raiding in 2.4 (that's with level 141 badge gear and removed attunements) - doable but challenging normal modes, somewhat hard end bosses, then heroic modes about as hard and exclusive as SWP was.

But then it's not easy to compare raid difficulty now and then. With 10 = 25-man raiding, no more attunements, no resist fight anymore, much less need, let alone potential for raid stacking, trivial consumables with guild flask cauldrons and group food, raid difficulty is almost entirely in the encounter mechanics these days. In vanilla it was mostly in logistics, while TBC difficulty and accessibility was all over the place. T4 launched hilariously over-tuned, SSC/TK, MH and the first third of BT were somewhat easy but Kael'thas and Vashj were orders of magnitude harder, and required to enter MH/BT in the first place. SWP was Naxxramas Mk.2 in terms of wasting dev resources to get some 1% of their players new shiny content to try, and required an idiotic amount of raid stacking.

After the failure of TBC's raid model that culminated in SWP, WotLK was supposed to allow a large(r) part of the player base to raid and after launching undertuned entry level raids (Naxx 2.0 and two single-boss encounters) they experimented a lot with raid formats to allow the advanced players to have their challenge while still allowing Joe User to enjoy the lore, get some (inferior) shiny gear et al.

Ulduar had certain uniquely activated/executed hard modes and an optional hard-only boss, Trial of the Crusader came entirely in two difficulty modes and so did Icecrown Citadel. Hard modes were mostly hard, but there were always options for the "lesser" players - ICC even had a zone-wide buff that eventually added 30% to damage/healing/HP after about half a year. And naturally gear quality increased as "casuals" got access to previous-tier badge gear and craftables, as well as two new tiers of dungeons/heroics. All that allowed the average players to raid even without a proper guild.

Now we can argue that Cata has more stuff to do at 85 so people don't need to be shoehorned into raiding anymore, on the other hand the quality of those options often doesn't compare to raiding (see previous page of this thread, it's all about farming or collecting things) so a lot of those people who got to enjoy raiding in WotLK are currently left out again.

If that guy's quitting over T11 normal mode encounters no hardcore guild is gonna bother with anymore (or hasn't been bothering with for the past weeks/months), he's quite frankly an idiot.

Derpy'eart
June 1 2011, 02:47:24 AM
I think he just wants to cast more sc2 instead.
Also, my previous question about pvp wasn't really answered: how bad is arena balance right now? And how's the rated bg system working out?
Any point in subbing and leveling to 85 just for pvp? (i quit at tbc)

Pacefalm
June 1 2011, 03:03:16 AM
AFAIK arena balance is "fine", it's been much worse in the past. Rated bg's might have been overhyped a bit. It's basically the same as organising a premade, except with harder enemies. Also the matchmaking has some issues last I heard, but those might have been fixed.

But TBH WoW is much more of a PVE oriented game, to the point where playing it just for the PVP would be like buying Rock Band just for the vocals: it's a specialised part of a greater whole, and while it works and you can have fun with it, there are other games that do it better.

But that might just be me.

OutSane
June 1 2011, 03:09:50 AM
Eve-Burnout.

This game still any decent? Need something to burn out on different.

Is it worth starting down this perilous road?

Pacefalm
June 1 2011, 03:18:11 AM
No doubt WoW is a good game. Free trial is 2 weeks I think so you can just try it out and see if you like it. Myself I have burned out on WoW though (played for over 2 years).

OutSane
June 1 2011, 04:00:10 AM
Yea, just looking for a temporary change..i still like eve...just having a hard time caring atm..playing it way too much methinks.

Pretty much decided on trying to be a mage/warlok/druid, do any races/class combos really stick out and might be fun?

Also expansions, they required right off the bat or can i afford to hold off for the time being until i get to the point i would need them?

Any other random tidbits of info you can pass along a dirt newbie would be nice.

orcane
June 1 2011, 08:15:35 AM
You can safely ignore expansions these days until you reach level 60 (trial is capped at 20 I think?). The new old world is available to everyone, here's what you'll miss:

death knight (WotLK) - requires existing level 55+ character on the account somewhere[/*:m:oiam7ec5]
new tradeskills (TBC: jewelcrafting; WotLK: inscription) - but you can buy their products on the AH[/*:m:oiam7ec5]
draenei/blood elf races and starting zones (TBC) - now these are mostly worse than the remade old race zones[/*:m:oiam7ec5]
goblins/worgen and their starting zones (Cataclysm)[/*:m:oiam7ec5]
old-world flying (Cataclysm) - actually flying in general but that requires level 60 and above in the first place[/*:m:oiam7ec5]
access to expansion zones - there are few reasons to go there without the appropriate level to begin with[/*:m:oiam7ec5]

If you plan to play this past the trial anyway it's worth checking for cheap offers or battle chests, getting vanilla WoW only may actually be more expensive.

Snowman
June 1 2011, 10:41:24 AM
When do Heroics reset? I got into a random heroic strath and the healer just quit after looting the necromancer guy before the town hall...

orcane
June 1 2011, 11:50:23 AM
0800 (0900 with DST) France time or something?

Snowman
June 1 2011, 04:38:07 PM
Another question.

I got a [Battered Hilt] (http://www.wowhead.com/item=50380)

Should I use it or sell it? (Warlock)

Same run I also got http://www.wowhead.com/item=50273

Shaikar
June 1 2011, 04:41:37 PM
Another question.

I got a [Battered Hilt] (http://www.wowhead.com/item=50380)

Should I use it or sell it? (Warlock)Do you badly need cash or do you want the achievement? (Assuming it's still there and you don't already have it.)
I'd use it, it's easy to get more than enough cash than you need anyway.

ThonEney
June 1 2011, 05:24:33 PM
Another question.

I got a [Battered Hilt] (http://www.wowhead.com/item=50380)

Should I use it or sell it? (Warlock)Do you badly need cash or do you want the achievement? (Assuming it's still there and you don't already have it.)
I'd use it, it's easy to get more than enough cash than you need anyway.
http://www.wowhead.com/item=50051
You can get that

Snowman
June 1 2011, 05:37:00 PM
Is there anything you can do about the healer griefing in strath :(

ThonEney
June 1 2011, 05:55:47 PM
Must mention how randoms are horrible. Just got into scarlet monastery, we have a druid tank with heirlooms who's also the same lvl as mobs. He couldn't tank more than 1 mob and hung around like a retard for a minute or two after every pull after trying to talk to him to see if he's afk/friend playing whatever and no response i called him a major retard and a noob and got kicked lol.

orcane
June 1 2011, 06:38:56 PM
Unless you're an achievemunz whore yourself or want to do the questline for shits and giggles, I'd actually sell it because a level 251 weapon will last you exactly nowhere (you can buy superior green BoE weapons off the AH if someone puts up the right random enchantment type) even if you don't do Cataclysm zones.


Is there anything you can do about the healer griefing in strath :(
As in?

And regarding randoms, last weekend I kicked a rogue, then a hunter in heroic Grim Batol because they would keep failing, standing outside the center of shadow gale and attack the wrong adds first on Erudax. Didn't kick them for actually failing but for not telling us they didn't know/not acknowledging instructions when we told them what to do. I'm done dragging silent bots through heroics, who just join, faceroll, fail, rinse, repeat without a word. If you don't know the fight, ask. If you fail and we tell you how to improve, try to improve. Don't just continue doing the same thing that killed you and us twice before. And if you're not the only guy doing 4k DPS I will kick you both because I'm not going to essentially 3-man all fights. :slaver:

Idara
June 1 2011, 06:42:48 PM
How do people do less DPS than in wrath, I don't fucking understand.

5-man heroic, one boss, arcane mage, MM hunter, a god damn Muti rogue all did 8.5k DPS on a god damn patchwerk fight.

After the fight I just say "p. gud dps" and drop group.

I have no patience for people who can't even be bothered to try.

orcane
June 1 2011, 06:47:21 PM
What, I could actually live with people doing 8500. Recently I regularly get not one, but 2-3 guys doing around 5k. That's almost as hilarious as the guys doing 300 DPS in Utgarde Keep at 70...

Donte
June 1 2011, 08:02:04 PM
heck, my rogue was kicked from a group yesterday for only doing 21k dps on the altarius fight in vortex pinacle.

i did take a bit of damage though, as the tank was also trying to stay upwind.

Mavolio
June 1 2011, 08:41:00 PM
i did take a bit of damage though, as the tank was also trying to stay upwind.

How can he keep agro if he doesn't? The tank can stand upwind and the dps can still attack from behind at the same time without getting the debuff.

orcane
June 1 2011, 09:00:23 PM
What kind of retard designed Al'akir? In before "lol it's easy" etc., but did they run some moronic challenge of "who can pile more RNG on a raid boss"?

June 1 2011, 09:09:47 PM
Not really tbh just dont bother to move for lightning as intended^^

Grarr Dexx
June 1 2011, 11:48:15 PM
What kind of retard designed Al'akir? In before "lol it's easy" etc., but did they run some moronic challenge of "who can pile more RNG on a raid boss"?

Our 25 man guild has just been talking about organizing separate 10 mans to get everyone loot/achievements for Al'Akir, as it is a horrible fight on heroic mode :razor:

Lilalaunebör
June 2 2011, 01:47:53 AM
People do less dps than in wrath if they are green equipped due to the terribad hit/ability scaling between 83 and 85. Without group quests / shadow thingamajig highlands / dungeon loot you can end up below 5k when dinging fresh 85.

Currently thinking about reactivating, any interesting additions since 4.0? I cleared BWD/Citadel/Throne normal and 4 hardmodes when i quit, so if the content is still the same it wouldnt be worth it.

ElweSingollo
June 2 2011, 02:33:08 AM
People do less dps than in wrath if they are green equipped due to the terribad hit/ability scaling between 83 and 85. Without group quests / shadow thingamajig highlands / dungeon loot you can end up below 5k when dinging fresh 85.

Currently thinking about reactivating, any interesting additions since 4.0? I cleared BWD/Citadel/Throne normal and 4 hardmodes when i quit, so if the content is still the same it wouldnt be worth it.

Content still the same only new things are the troll dungeons (Zul Amun and Zul Gurub reinvented as heroic 5 mans) so if you goign to reactivate for new stuffs wait for the next patch to come as that will be bringing the Firelands raid and T12 gear.

Idara
June 2 2011, 03:07:21 AM
I'll call bullshit on people doing 5k DPS at 85.

If you've got any idea how to play your class, there's no way you'll allow yourself to perform so terribly.

Koll
June 2 2011, 04:02:27 AM
Opinions on Priest healers at the moment? Are they any good? I have a druid, a priest, and a pala all at 85 and a shaman at 71 and levelling fast and i'm looking to turn one of them into an end game healer. My priest levelled 15-80 as a disc dungeon healer (PuGs) with little difficulty but that was pre cata so i've respeced him to holy atm as that seems more mana friendly and by far the more popular option.

I'm about to jump online and do some early morning PuGs to try it out. Can I make a decent end game priest healer or is one of the other healing classes significantly better and I should just stick with that instead?

June 2 2011, 08:56:28 AM
I'll call bullshit on people doing 5k DPS at 85.

If you've got any idea how to play your class, there's no way you'll allow yourself to perform so terribly.

There is no system in built to meter your performance, people dont know they are doing that bad or even probably care.

Warpath
June 2 2011, 09:03:47 AM
Pretty terribad player here, and on my rogue still in a load of greens or blues below ilvl 333 and below hit/exp cap and i was still pulling 10k in norm/heroic dungeons. And this was when constantly cocking up my rotations ect.

Jindo Minian
June 2 2011, 10:25:20 AM
You people and your damage meters. How would you survive without recount?
Look, it's very simple, if the fight is not a DPS race (which most aren't) and you aren't dying and no one is standing in shit and interrupting when they should, who gives a fuck what their DPS is? The boss goes down all the same and you get your loot.

Also the scaling is completely different between Wrath and Cataclysm so the DPS meters aren't exactly accurate for comparison. Plus there are certain classes that will always be low because they can't cheat and spam AE as they have none.

On another note, i don't see what all the fuss was with Cho'Gall, on our first attempt with shitty composition (only ranged were a Priest and a Mage and we have a DK that wouldn't even qualify to run a Heroic Dungeon) we got him to 7% health.

orcane
June 2 2011, 12:19:17 PM
When I'm tanking or healing I really only start to look at damage done when I get the impression fights are taking too long. The thing is, in WotLK it didn't really matter, there were like three bosses in all heroics where low DPS was bad. Nowadays, the fights aren't DPS races in terms of enrage mechanics, but they can still be because eventually healers will be OOM and you will wipe halfway through an enrage timer (people with low DPS usually aren't too good at avoiding optional damage either).

My latest experiences with terribad DPS have been Grim Batol and Halls of Origination. The longer it takes the more invocations Drahga will summon, and every single one of those is another chance for people to screw up and explode the group. Erudax with low DPS is just suicidal because corruptors won't die and you end up with a fuckton of unavoidable group damage. I've had Anraphet fights where we ended up at -80% total health after crumbling ruin kept stacking. Setesh fights where I was running around with like 20 mobs on my ass because killing portals is hard.

While I agree the comparison to 4.0.1 DPS at 80 and anything before that is flawed, no class scales so bad that 5000 DPS in a level 85 heroic is acceptable. If you can't do DPS, go learn how to play and gear up in normal instances. And while there's no built-in system, those who care can use one of at least two mods - or get told by others. I have yet to be in a group where no one else was running meters of some sort and pointed out if someone did unacceptable DPS.


Opinions on Priest healers at the moment? Are they any good? I have a druid, a priest, and a pala all at 85 and a shaman at 71 and levelling fast and i'm looking to turn one of them into an end game healer. My priest levelled 15-80 as a disc dungeon healer (PuGs) with little difficulty but that was pre cata so i've respeced him to holy atm as that seems more mana friendly and by far the more popular option.

I'm about to jump online and do some early morning PuGs to try it out. Can I make a decent end game priest healer or is one of the other healing classes significantly better and I should just stick with that instead?
Holy priests are excellent raid healers and can be quite potent at tank healing (not that a 25-man raid with 5-7 healers is going to pick a holy priest for that job though), don't know about bubbly priests because I can't stand that spec. People are probably going to tell you to heal as a paladin because of loleasy mana and beacon of win, especially for tank healing, but I sincerely loathe holy combo points and their toolkit is still kind of limited.

Grarr Dexx
June 2 2011, 02:14:35 PM
You people and your damage meters. How would you survive without recount?
Look, it's very simple, if the fight is not a DPS race (which most aren't) and you aren't dying and no one is standing in shit and interrupting when they should, who gives a fuck what their DPS is? The boss goes down all the same and you get your loot.

Also the scaling is completely different between Wrath and Cataclysm so the DPS meters aren't exactly accurate for comparison. Plus there are certain classes that will always be low because they can't cheat and spam AE as they have none.

On another note, i don't see what all the fuss was with Cho'Gall, on our first attempt with shitty composition (only ranged were a Priest and a Mage and we have a DK that wouldn't even qualify to run a Heroic Dungeon) we got him to 7% health.

All fights are a damage race vs the healer's mana. The more he has at the end of a fight, the faster you can get to the next encounter and finish the dungeon faster. If people aren't up to snuff in my dungeons, I either kick them or quit myself.

Jindo Minian
June 2 2011, 02:23:59 PM
[quote="Jindo Minian":1b0u9zfi]You people and your damage meters. How would you survive without recount?
Look, it's very simple, if the fight is not a DPS race (which most aren't) and you aren't dying and no one is standing in shit and interrupting when they should, who gives a fuck what their DPS is? The boss goes down all the same and you get your loot.

Also the scaling is completely different between Wrath and Cataclysm so the DPS meters aren't exactly accurate for comparison. Plus there are certain classes that will always be low because they can't cheat and spam AE as they have none.

On another note, i don't see what all the fuss was with Cho'Gall, on our first attempt with shitty composition (only ranged were a Priest and a Mage and we have a DK that wouldn't even qualify to run a Heroic Dungeon) we got him to 7% health.

All fights are a damage race vs the healer's mana. The more he has at the end of a fight, the faster you can get to the next encounter and finish the dungeon faster. If people aren't up to snuff in my dungeons, I either kick them or quit myself.[/quote:1b0u9zfi]

You will drink anyway. The time is the same.
Wrath really turned people into spoilt little brats in this game.
However i admit, if i had a Rogue, Hunter, Mage or DK pulling 5k dps at 85 i'd be wondering what the fuck they are doing.
But a Shaman, Druid, Warlock, Warrior, Paladin or Priest? Doesn't matter, as long as they aren't making it worse for anyone else then there is nothing wrong. And i'm usually the healer in this circumstance, a Shaman no less. You can't expect people in 333 gear or less to break 10k single target, it's not gonna happen.

orcane
June 2 2011, 03:58:20 PM
I agree that DPS alone shouldn't matter, and some people (especially with a hardcore raiding perspective) have seriously warped ideas of what PUG members should do. If you want 10-15k DPS from every member of your group, you should go with guildies. The other day I had a tank - in Grim Batol - complain how he hates people with green gear in heroics. That's just being an idiot.

But I can expect any DPS to do 7-8k on the simpler boss fights (ie. without extensive add/movement phases or gimmick shit like Ozruk). As flawed as the comparison is, we did that with weaker talents/spells, 5 character- and 80-90 item levels less. Don't get me wrong, I don't mind people who play reasonanbly well doing "low DPS" because of their gear, or those who don't know the fights if they follow tactics and instructions we tell them, either. But if you just join and expect loot and points without telling us you don't know what the hell you're doing, get the fuck out.

Ultimately what I care about is being able to finish heroics which are already too long (stupid Blizztards) in a timely manner. If it takes 10 minutes longer I can live with that. If it takes half an hour longer because our healer can't keep up and people keep dying/group keeps wiping while DPS who should be doing 10k are doing 5k, I'm no longer willing to give bad people free rides, as it's unfair for those who do try to prepare and play well enough.

It's unfair to queue for heroics with 2/3 of all gem sockets empty (or filled with stamina gems), almost no enchants and mostly level 339-352 PvP gear, just as it's unfair to keep wiping the group due to not paying attention "because it's just a game", or just as unfair as constantly going afk - if you don't have the motivation or time to properly prepare for, and run a heroic dungeon that can take up to an hour, don't fucking queue.

Idara
June 2 2011, 04:27:12 PM
I've left multiple times on Throne of Tides during the first couple pulls when the tank refuses, flat out refuses to ask for CC on the double healer teams.

Not only are both not CCd, interrupting classes clearly don't have their interrupts on their bars because they just sit there freecasting their heals.

I would agree that running with guild members has spoiled me. But a few of us recently got a few more alts to 85 and did some random heroics after hitting 85 and cheating the ilevel system by carrying arch BoEs etc to get above the 329 ilevel requirement.

Fresh 85s with a few pieces of gear bought and they pull 15k DPS as hunters on fights, trap properly etc and I'm on my shaman healer, first healer ever managing to stay at nearly 100% for most pulls.

Maybe it's just my luck I but I always get stuck with healers who go OOM on trash packs (CCd trash packs) on my ilevel 360+ prot paladin and epic wearing DPS who can't do half what they could.

All it takes is to have a bit of bother to look up EJ and get the basics of your class down.

Ruri
June 2 2011, 04:58:36 PM
Maybe it's just my luck I but I always get stuck with healers who go OOM on trash packs (CCd trash packs) on my ilevel 360+ prot paladin and epic wearing DPS who can't do half what they could.

Another thing that dps need to be good at is not eating avoidable damage. That puts a bigger stress on healer mana than anything. These days if someone stands in the green killing you shit to below 50% I just let them go, I've found it makes things run much smoother and either the offending faceroller gets a clue or dies, bitches at me, and I vk them.

Mavolio
June 2 2011, 05:21:28 PM
I never minded people doing less dps than a guild member could as long as it looked like they were doing their rotation. The only ppl that rly annoyed me were people who clearly had no idea how to play their class at max lvl. It takes 3 mins to look up their rotation on a wiki site and then they can contribute to the best of their ability which is all i ever expected.

orcane
June 2 2011, 05:39:42 PM
What you mean autoattack doesn't cut it?

ElweSingollo
June 2 2011, 10:12:01 PM
What you mean autoattack doesn't cut it?

had a pretty much fully epic geared Boomkin bitching about my hunter who at the time was in blue/greens and who I hadn't played in ages with a really shit polearm cause I made one mistake in Throne of Tides I checked recount and sure enough Boomie was 3rd on dps behind me and a mage who was similarly geared to me with a few more 346 heroic blues with me deing first mage second. Moonkin was doing 10k dps when I queried him critizising me by saying hang on your doing less dps than me yet are in fully epic gear he said lol I am a healer in healer gear :facepalm: . So I told to fuck off and go heal a dungeon instead of pretending to dps pretty sure if I had his gear on a moonkin (not played mine extensively since Wrath it has to be said) I would be doing a helluva lot more than 10k.

Snowman
June 2 2011, 11:26:14 PM
find some one with that potion thing that turns them self into a dragon you can ride.

http://i.imgur.com/NqYZPl.jpg (http://i.imgur.com/NqYZP.jpg)

Sudden
June 3 2011, 01:29:35 AM
If you hate yourself go grind rep with Netherwing

Idara
June 3 2011, 03:37:19 AM
If you hate yourself go grind rep with Netherwing

That is hardly the worst rep grind there is.

Esp. now since you might have the whole island (and therefore all the Netherwing Egg spawns) to yourself.

orcane
June 3 2011, 10:12:22 AM
To yourself and 5 other 80-85s who are thinking the same thing you mean :P

Jindo Minian
June 3 2011, 10:19:25 AM
What you mean autoattack doesn't cut it?

had a pretty much fully epic geared Boomkin bitching about my hunter who at the time was in blue/greens and who I hadn't played in ages with a really shit polearm cause I made one mistake in Throne of Tides I checked recount and sure enough Boomie was 3rd on dps behind me and a mage who was similarly geared to me with a few more 346 heroic blues with me deing first mage second. Moonkin was doing 10k dps when I queried him critizising me by saying hang on your doing less dps than me yet are in fully epic gear he said lol I am a healer in healer gear :facepalm: . So I told to fuck off and go heal a dungeon instead of pretending to dps pretty sure if I had his gear on a moonkin (not played mine extensively since Wrath it has to be said) I would be doing a helluva lot more than 10k.

He's talking out of his arse as Spirit on a Boomkin counts towards hit rating. So he should never miss.
Boomkin rotation is a bit of a bitch though, i got my freshly 85 Boomkin and did a dungeon with guildies and did an awful 4.5k dps throughout BRC. I changed my talents a little, read up a little more and started doing 7-8k instead with exactly the same gear. (i actually switched out of the odd bits of supposed DPS gear to the healer gear and it went better). The fact that Boomkins actually get a damage bonus for running around like a retard is amusing though.

Grarr Dexx
June 4 2011, 01:03:58 AM
You can hardly call moving moonfire a dps boost though :p

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WCcUtGRK2ZY Here's us killing Sinestra as realm first on Bloodhoof EU. I was cheering on the sidelines cause I couldn't ride out the night.

Jindo Minian
June 4 2011, 12:36:17 PM
Well it IS a damage bonus. Albeit a rather odd one.
Name one other class that has to keep moving to keep a buff up.

I think it's quite amusing actually.

Shaikar
June 4 2011, 12:50:19 PM
Not a net one though, running around spamming moonfire like an idiot will still see you do a lot less damage than standing still casting actual nukes. All it does is make moonkin a bit less terrible at fights requiring frequent movement (ie almost all of them currently) than they used to be, because they used to be truely dire at those.


I think we'll see Sinestra some time after 4.2 :razor:

June 4 2011, 12:59:39 PM
Balance damage is rediculous anyway you can juse sunfire spam, starfall and plant mushrooms in heroics and do 20k. Wouldnt call two dots one of two fillers and a proc a "hard rotation" either. If your losing dps on movement fights your just not doing it right, pretty much. Had a Fury Warrior complaining yesterday in some dungeon because the tank was running around like a cock, as some do, his main complaint was that he does not get rage when he is moving...er what..haha.

Shaikar
June 4 2011, 01:18:10 PM
Oh, 5m? My bad, had a reading fail and didn't spot that was the yardstick in use. :)

Snowman
June 9 2011, 01:01:37 AM
What's the best method/way to start gearing for pvp/pve from the vendors as a warlock?

After hitting 85 I basically hammered out the random dungeon bonus thing and bought myself a hat (~1500 justice remaining). I've also done some pvp (horde are way better at lvl 85 than lower levels on this server)and have ~2200 Honor, 50 conquest and 18 Tol Barad things.

Is there anything in particular I should try to get?

Also I really have no idea about pvp stats (or pve stats like mastery for that matter).

ElweSingollo
June 9 2011, 02:32:48 AM
If gold isn't to much of a concern or you have tailoring as your craft get the boe crafted belt (http://eu.battle.net/wow/en/item/54503) and trousers (http://eu.battle.net/wow/en/item/54506) other than that maybe get the vendor pvp wrists or feet to give you ilevel a bit of a boost and there after I would just go for which ever item is going to give you the best boost over what you have atm. If your not getting a weapon to drop for you grind out tokens for the Tol Barad main hand iirc it's basically as good as anything pre zandalar heroic or raid.

http://eu.battle.net/wow/en/character/m ... Ath/simple (http://eu.battle.net/wow/en/character/moonglade/inzilb%C3%AAth/simple)

my warlock is above I am pretty crappy with it but maybe give you an idea of things to look out for and which heroics you can run.

Grarr Dexx
June 9 2011, 03:57:36 AM
http://eu.battle.net/wow/en/character/b ... r/advanced (http://eu.battle.net/wow/en/character/bloodhoof/karakkonor/advanced)

Shit niggas I don't give a fuck. Also,

http://eu.battle.net/wow/en/character/b ... a/advanced (http://eu.battle.net/wow/en/character/bloodhoof/ursulla/advanced)

Also, page 13 snipe.

orcane
June 9 2011, 10:13:47 AM
What's the best method/way to start gearing for pvp/pve from the vendors as a warlock?

After hitting 85 I basically hammered out the random dungeon bonus thing and bought myself a hat (~1500 justice remaining). I've also done some pvp (horde are way better at lvl 85 than lower levels on this server)and have ~2200 Honor, 50 conquest and 18 Tol Barad things.

Is there anything in particular I should try to get?

Also I really have no idea about pvp stats (or pve stats like mastery for that matter).
For PvP, your choices are limited anyway - get resilience, your warlock PvP set pieces, spirit-less weapons/offhands/wands and when there's actually two equal level items with different stats besides resilience, you'll have to ask people who actually bother with PvP unlike me. Unless you want to go conquer arenas and rated BGs ASAP, I would wait for current conquest gear to become honor gear next season/patch, which should be in 2-3 weeks.

For PvE it's slightly harder. If you don't plan to raid any soon, you can keep your hit rating rather low (around 0% miss chance against +2 mobs). Otherwise you'll have to get more hit rating, up to the "hit cap" of 1742 points. But since intellect is about twice as strong as hit rating for your DPS, you shouldn't drop to lower item level pieces in order to achieve this. Both destro and affliction generally work well with a stat priority of int > sp > hit > haste > crit > mastery. Demo is a bit different, there mastery takes the place of haste IIRC. Elitist Jerks have detailed threads for all specs with example priorities and more info on (haste) thresholds, info on how to "sim" your own character etc.

If you want to gear up for PvE, there are several crafted/BoE items if you can afford them, and if you can stand it archaeology has a nice staff and ring, and a somewhat useful trinket (more of a healing trinket though). Getting all 2 or 3 archaeology epics is full of RNG and may take ages, however.

Keep running heroics for gear/points, make sure to wear the appropriate tabards and do quests and dailies for the factions. The order in which I suggest to wear tabards for rep is something like Ramkahen ~= Earthen Ring (both have no or few dailies and limited quest rep but great rewards) > Dragonmaw (several dailies and lots of quest rep) > Therazane (lots of dailies, shoulder enchant isn't wildly better than the honored version) > Hyjal (you get revered from zone quests, there's no exalted reward you want).

If you care about PvE I can post you a list of "failsafe" items you might want to check out.

Snowman
June 9 2011, 07:18:18 PM
http://us.battle.net/wow/en/character/laughing-skull/vivisection/advanced

My crappy gear

e: how do I put a specific gear set which I might not be wearing at the time?

orcane
June 9 2011, 07:28:54 PM
Crap, I wrote the list and left the txt file at work. Will redo during raid later.

Sudden
June 10 2011, 12:49:11 AM
What's the best method/way to start gearing for pvp/pve from the vendors as a warlock?

After hitting 85 I basically hammered out the random dungeon bonus thing and bought myself a hat (~1500 justice remaining). I've also done some pvp (horde are way better at lvl 85 than lower levels on this server)and have ~2200 Honor, 50 conquest and 18 Tol Barad things.

Is there anything in particular I should try to get?

Also I really have no idea about pvp stats (or pve stats like mastery for that matter).

Get a friend for 2's and work on capping out your weekly conquest every week doing arena's to get your Vicious set. Also do lot's of BGs so you can at least get a Bloodthirsty item in every slot. (this is obviously for pvp)

orcane
June 10 2011, 10:45:14 AM
e: how do I put a specific gear set which I might not be wearing at the time?
On the armory you can't, it shows whatever you logged out in. You'd have to use a character profiler like http://www.wowhead.com/profiler or http://chardev.org/ which is a wee bit overkill for your purpose I figure.

sahtila
June 10 2011, 02:33:09 PM
Would not spend too much effort/gold to gear up now, as new content patch is like 2 weeks away and most of current gear will be replaced really fast. After patch its possible to buy current valor gear with 5 men hc dungeon points, so then getting nice 359 epic level gear is just bit of 5 men hc grind.

Though at least DMC:Volcano will stay decent even after patch so one could purchase it now and it would not get wasted.

Snowman
June 10 2011, 09:30:47 PM
Will the update rollover the pve gear as well?

I have been kind of lazy w/ heroics so I was considering just banking the points for later.

Grarr Dexx
June 11 2011, 12:04:12 AM
All the PVE 359 gear will be available for JP too, although the devs have seemed to taken the position that your valor points and justice points you have now won't exceed 4000 even after the conversion.

ElweSingollo
June 11 2011, 01:09:13 AM
All the PVE 359 gear will be available for JP too, although the devs have seemed to taken the position that your valor points and justice points you have now won't exceed 4000 even after the conversion.

So valour points get turned into JP in the patch meh hooray for a new grind dunno why I even play WoW any more since I haven't even raided in cata...