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cullnean
March 13 2013, 08:23:33 AM
okies, we seem to have 4 or more rolling scenarios at any one time so i figured a thread on ship comps and fits would be a good idea, also with T2 being fairly cheap a separate pve ship could be decent investment.

so my thinking is-

fighter (command) res buffs/dmg buff
frigate (support) reppers
fighter (debuffer)
ceptor (ecm)

plasma weaps with needler mod when sheilds are down on the boss

thoughts?

RazoR
March 13 2013, 12:19:25 PM
Who's going to kill shit? :/

cullnean
March 13 2013, 12:21:20 PM
Who's going to kill shit? :/

Implying there is no fire power

Tapatalk 2

Miep
March 13 2013, 12:40:35 PM
You want a jericho Frig, fun to wipe all those npc swarms with a torp.

Lief Siddhe
March 13 2013, 12:41:06 PM
As resident carebear, here's my thoughts:

Enemies do all 3 types of damage, inties shoot plasma EM, fighters shoot railguns kinetic, frigates and Elite/Boss shoot lasers thermal, so fit good thermal resists at least

1st room - 3 waves dogfight - basically any 4 ships can do this, you just gotta watch out for enemy elite frigates (they got drones, lazors and smartbombs, and can hurt if they all focus fire on one of ya, which they have a tendency to do). Also one or two NPC inties, I think, will use one of those mods that shut down and disable your active mods for a couple of seconds, so watch out and don't get caught with your pants down (almost died a couple of times before I realized my shit was turned off).
This is the goofball stage, very fun to fly if you're in an inty/fighter cause it's just a massive furball and doog tiems with shit exploding everywhere.
Enemies get thermal resists (only in this room) so if you're using lasers go with EM mod.

2nd room - destroying the 3 Nav Stations - same as above, more or less. Flak Turrets shoot kinetic, and I think when you attack the second tower it will start spawning Elites. Also as long as you don't destroy the Nav Stations enemies will keep spawning.

3rd room - Punisher boss fight - Boss is a bitch in a Cyclone with OVER 9000 hitpoints!?!?!?!?!?!?! He shoots lazors, drones and a smartbomb - when you hear the WARNING and see FRIENDLY RUSSIAN LETTERS it's time to get out of Line of Sight. After a bit of practice it's easy. The problem is getting caught in the open cause that fucking smartbomb (thermal) hurts, especially if he also hits you with drones and lasers if you get the aggro.

Twice during this fight an enemy squad will spawn, consisting of about 5 Elite Frigs and one Veteran Frig. The Veteran can shoot a Torpedo and all use lasers, so fit thermal resists plx. The tactic is to move and start ganking the ELites as soon as they appear, focus fire is the key.

Interceptor debuffing/lockdown wont work with baws, we tried to shut down his smartbomb, those disabling mods dont seem to work on NPCs so no go on that idea (someone may try to test a bit more).

In short, Occam's Razor:

Get 2 support frigs with spider reps (Hydra masterrace imo) just in case you get separated. Easier to be in range of at least one spidertank.
Other 2 ships should be Command Fighters (resist buffs) or Protection Frigs (dmg buffs and other protection shit).
4 lazor Hydras > all, imho. Although some railgun/plasma action might be cool for Nav Stations and Bawsfite.

1. Focus fire on elites
2. move as group and blitz the Nav Stations clockwise
3. learn to lose LoS in boss fight and see 1.

PvE is on farmmode as far as I am concerned, helped FHC m8s last 2 days get greens for t2 ships, purples drop about almost never but there's a small chance. PvE is cool when you get a new ship so you have at least some cool mods, it also boosts your synergy so you can do a couple PvE's and get your ship sauced up for PvP.

FURTHERMORE

Zilulil
March 13 2013, 12:53:18 PM
That's not entirely accurate. The bosses and elites alternate between thermal and em damage on all of their abilities in T2. This is easily verified by flying a raid fighter and watching the boss wail away on you with lasers and not getting the damage buff until you swap to EM.

Caldrion Dosto
March 13 2013, 12:55:44 PM
As resident carebear, here's my thoughts:

Enemies do all 3 types of damage, inties shoot plasma EM, fighters shoot railguns kinetic, frigates and Elite/Boss shoot lasers thermal, so fit good thermal resists at least

1st room - 3 waves dogfight - basically any 4 ships can do this, you just gotta watch out for enemy elite frigates (they got drones, lazors and smartbombs, and can hurt if they all focus fire on one of ya, which they have a tendency to do). Also one or two NPC inties, I think, will use one of those mods that shut down and disable your active mods for a couple of seconds, so watch out and don't get caught with your pants down (almost died a couple of times before I realized my shit was turned off).
This is the goofball stage, very fun to fly if you're in an inty/fighter cause it's just a massive furball and doog tiems with shit exploding everywhere.
Enemies get thermal resists (only in this room) so if you're using lasers go with EM mod.

2nd room - destroying the 3 Nav Stations - same as above, more or less. Flak Turrets shoot kinetic, and I think when you attack the second tower it will start spawning Elites. Also as long as you don't destroy the Nav Stations enemies will keep spawning.

3rd room - Punisher boss fight - Boss is a bitch in a Cyclone with OVER 9000 hitpoints!?!?!?!?!?!?! He shoots lazors, drones and a smartbomb - when you hear the WARNING and see FRIENDLY RUSSIAN LETTERS it's time to get out of Line of Sight. After a bit of practice it's easy. The problem is getting caught in the open cause that fucking smartbomb (thermal) hurts, especially if he also hits you with drones and lasers if you get the aggro.

Twice during this fight an enemy squad will spawn, consisting of about 5 Elite Frigs and one Veteran Frig. The Veteran can shoot a Torpedo and all use lasers, so fit thermal resists plx. The tactic is to move and start ganking the ELites as soon as they appear, focus fire is the key.

Interceptor debuffing/lockdown wont work with baws, we tried to shut down his smartbomb, those disabling mods dont seem to work on NPCs so no go on that idea (someone may try to test a bit more).

In short, Occam's Razor:

Get 2 support frigs with spider reps (Hydra masterrace imo) just in case you get separated. Easier to be in range of at least one spidertank.
Other 2 ships should be Command Fighters (resist buffs) or Protection Frigs (dmg buffs and other protection shit).
4 lazor Hydras > all, imho. Although some railgun/plasma action might be cool for Nav Stations and Bawsfite.

1. Focus fire on elites
2. move as group and blitz the Nav Stations clockwise
3. learn to lose LoS in boss fight and see 1.

PvE is on farmmode as far as I am concerned, helped FHC m8s last 2 days get greens for t2 ships, purples drop about almost never but there's a small chance. PvE is cool when you get a new ship so you have at least some cool mods, it also boosts your synergy so you can do a couple PvE's and get your ship sauced up for PvP.

FURTHERMORE

I second this.

As said i tried ecm ceptor on boss, worked about 40 sec till the smartbomb came on, 4 hits then you go boom in a ceptor.... And u cant turn his smarty of.

Varcaus
March 13 2013, 11:46:53 PM
Just go quad rr jericho frigs and blap the boss from behind cover 20k every 30 or so seconds.

Zilulil
March 14 2013, 12:16:20 AM
The boss's drones appear to be the same one as the Armada faction frigs and shoot down incoming missiles. I'm not sure what the CD is on it so you might be able to get some through if you fire enough at once.

Varcaus
March 14 2013, 12:18:27 AM
Really welp. but does the boss Spawn in the same place everytime for dropping mine fields on?

Caldrion Dosto
March 14 2013, 12:44:40 AM
Really welp. but does the boss Spawn in the same place everytime for dropping mine fields on?

Have you tried the boss Varacus? He has huge HP.


8 minefields wouldn´t even take out the shields.

Varcaus
March 14 2013, 01:04:49 AM
Really welp. but does the boss Spawn in the same place everytime for dropping mine fields on?

Have you tried the boss Varacus? He has huge HP.


8 minefields wouldn´t even take out the shields.
That's why I'm asking and you can shoot after you mine mate. Isn't this suppose to be :theorycrafting:?

Lief Siddhe
March 14 2013, 02:07:06 AM
Yes, he spawns in the same place everytime, but he's about 5km away at the very start. He will focus on one of ya (I'd say there is "aggro", I just dunno if it's LoS based or dmg/hate based) and follow ya around so minefields are viable, but they won't do much except maybe destroy his drones.

It takes OVER 9000 dmg to lower his shields/armor by 1 measly block, at least (literally). Probably several times more than 9000, jokes aside, for 1 measly healthbar to drop on that fuck.

Oh yeah, destroying his drones lowers his dps, so I kinda try to shoot them whenever I am close enough. I'd say it has the CD of a "normal" full synergy frig.

He's also using some purple ray type a thingy that kinda reminds me of Plasma Web or similar ability aside from his lasers, drones and smartbomb.

Lief Siddhe
March 14 2013, 02:52:47 AM
FRONT PAGE MOTHERFUCKERS

http://i.imgur.com/tSaIoVS.jpg

well, almost

Varcaus
March 14 2013, 02:53:33 AM
:| for pve

Zilulil
March 14 2013, 03:11:13 AM
The purple ray is a Target Painter because the boss apparently has a fighter hiding inside his frigate.

pratell
March 14 2013, 06:12:51 AM
:| for pve

varc mate did you not hear about lief's insidious plot to get FHC top listed in PVE so everyone will call us carebears?

Minion
March 14 2013, 07:39:41 AM
The boss's drones appear to be the same one as the Armada faction frigs and shoot down incoming missiles. I'm not sure what the CD is on it so you might be able to get some through if you fire enough at once.

The cooldown is long enough that he'll shoot down one of each volley, so you'd need to send at least two for even one to get through (n-1 torps make it). Spamming torpedoes in the T2+ PvE is generally suboptimal since it takes more than one torp to kill the small ships and Agents with the missile laser drones are everywhere.

On the other hand, using mass torps to one shot everything in T1 PvE 1/3 is hilarious if you memorize spawn positions. Nice to get new players some quick green T1 gear.

Lief Siddhe
March 14 2013, 12:35:02 PM
:| for pve

varc mate did you not hear about lief's insidious plot to get FHC top listed in PVE so everyone will call us carebears?

http://24.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_ktc4ap4VLT1qas51uo1_400.png

Stige
March 14 2013, 01:03:25 PM
PVE so hard!




jk

Varcaus
March 14 2013, 01:25:04 PM
:| for pve

varc mate did you not hear about lief's insidious plot to get FHC top listed in PVE so everyone will call us carebears?

D: the horror

Dahak
March 15 2013, 02:34:16 PM
So I've only done a couple of these, both shipyard defense, but why not just bring four Jericho frigates? Put a shield generator on each one and regain 400-500 shield a second, and be able to volley fire the torpedoes and break through the anti-missile lasers of the enemy frigates. Or do the shield generators and team resist boosters not stack?

Stige
March 15 2013, 02:53:23 PM
So I've only done a couple of these, both shipyard defense, but why not just bring four Jericho frigates? Put a shield generator on each one and regain 400-500 shield a second, and be able to volley fire the torpedoes and break through the anti-missile lasers of the enemy frigates. Or do the shield generators and team resist boosters not stack?

I'm pretty sure the AOE Remote Reps don't stack.

pratell
March 16 2013, 09:52:25 PM
So I've only done a couple of these, both shipyard defense, but why not just bring four Jericho frigates? Put a shield generator on each one and regain 400-500 shield a second, and be able to volley fire the torpedoes and break through the anti-missile lasers of the enemy frigates. Or do the shield generators and team resist boosters not stack?

stacking mate

Minion
March 16 2013, 10:23:40 PM
There is no stacking of the SAME TYPE of effects and only the best available is chosen. This includes self effects, targeted effects, and gang links.

Example: Two remote shield rep ships sitting near each other is a waste since only one effect will be applied. If one has Mk1 and the other has Mk3, the Mk3 will always override when he is in range.

Note that if one has remote armor and the other has remote shield, both effects ARE applied since they're not the same thing. Remote rep + remote resists is also valid.

Example 2: Two ships trying to target paint the same enemy with painters of the same effectiveness results in the second painter simply not activating (and with no error message, so don't get confused). If the first painter is Mk1 and the second painter is Mk3, the second painter will activate but shut off the first painter.

or tl;dr talk to your squad mates and make sure you're not running (too many) duplicate mods, especially in PvE where you're going to be shooting one target most of the time.

Entity
March 18 2013, 08:02:05 PM
This is probably close to optimal for T2/T3 shipyard:

Stage 1: (EM/Thermal tanks)
1x Any Fighter (T3/T4) with Valkyrie (required), and the hull/shield resist thingies. Target Painter could help vs the elites but not required.
3x Grizzly-M (T4) using Lasers and Pulsar (2100m range, 7k total dmg, lol)

Stage 2 & 3: (pure Thermal tanks)
1x Any Fighter (T3/T4) with Target Painter (on boss, required), Valkyrie (required), and the hull/shield resist thingies.
3x Ginger Centaur (T4) with Plasma or Rail (crit build for either), Pulsar (every bit of dps helps), and Attack drones

Of course at least one of the frigs should have the Hull/Shield generator thingers.

Grizzly-M: its ship bonus of +50% range to protection modules is awesome because it makes pulsars hit up to 2100m. Combined with the +25% module effectiveness implant means the thing can murder those packs of shitty small ships extremely efficiently. Cycling cooldowns over those 3 frigs should end stage one really fast.

Ginger Centaur: +10% weapon damage, +15% (!!) Crit chance (this is a fucking massive bonus). Of all ships in the game, this one easily has the greatest sustained DPS potential.

T4 ships because of their 170% reward bonus. The fighter is ideally someone in a Desert Eagle or any T4 R12 fighter of their choice.

gfldex
March 20 2013, 03:59:35 AM
Grizzly-M: its ship bonus of +50% range to protection modules is awesome because it makes pulsars hit up to 2100m.

My dear Entityfriend. There is a tiny little wee bit of a problem with your theory. Pulsar are tactical, not protection. However you are quite right to propose the use of a smartbomb ... err ... pulsar (the game calls that thing smartbomb internally). As it happens my dropbox (http://dl.dropbox.com/u/110045216/fast-run.webm) got something in it to show how it's done.

Given that I recorded a random party with random noobs I can't show off with finishing the T2 scenario in 5:14. The T3/4 variation can be done in 6 minutes. Ohh, and laz0rs ain't no good. This is no EVE after all.

If I have 4 pilots with proper empire standing I would go for 1 Ginger Centaur and 3 King Kastors. Simply because overdrive is horrendously overpowered. Remove the shields, then switch to needle and drop into overdrive. Boss down in 30 seconds.

Stige
March 20 2013, 09:03:19 AM
That 6:27 is pretty decent time but we have done it faster than that.

Waiting on the video of that 5min run...

Minion
March 20 2013, 10:35:31 AM
Grizzly-M: its ship bonus of +50% range to protection modules is awesome because it makes pulsars hit up to 2100m.

Pulsar are tactical, not protection.


http://i.snag.gy/rUYkh.jpg

gfldex
March 20 2013, 11:41:24 AM
I stand corrected ... until they fix it.

Stige
March 20 2013, 12:33:27 PM
I stand corrected ... until they fix it.

Butthurt much?

Entity
March 20 2013, 03:43:43 PM
After more theorycrafting, the rapid fire plasma and heavy plasma have about the same sustained DPS, and the Ginger Centaur can get 10k dps with either easily.


If I have 4 pilots with proper empire standing I would go for 1 Ginger Centaur and 3 King Kastors. Simply because overdrive is horrendously overpowered. Remove the shields, then switch to needle and drop into overdrive. Boss down in 30 seconds.

My gut instinct says if you put the Ginger up against the KK in Overdrive, they will come out about equal, and in that case the Ginger wins because its damage output doesn't rely on a 10 second burst (of which you spend ~2 cooling down guns for 2nd burst)
KK + Heavy Plasma in overdrive is obscene though :D

The lasers for stage 1 suggestion was just for the hitscan so you don't have to lead and don't have missed shots, and those small ships die fast anyway. They should come out about equal in performance. Lasers, however, do suck in the dps department.

Varcaus
March 20 2013, 03:59:07 PM
Pulse laser have 340 base no?

Stige
March 20 2013, 04:23:37 PM
Pulse laser have 340 base no?

Pulse Lasers wont even hit a brick wall though, Assault Lasers are win for killing the small pesky things.

shoki
April 3 2013, 12:50:20 AM
ok, a question. That boosting fighter that's supposed to be with frigs: what would his style of play be? Sit with frigs and snipe? medium range? Run around with a shotgun?
Running around with mediums 'makes sense' to me, but what do i know?

also: general consensus is that fed frigs are superior for pve? C/D?
thanks

Lief Siddhe
April 3 2013, 03:41:36 AM
Frigs with assault lasers are best cause they can hit small shit from afar.

The support fighter is imo best off with plasma dogfighting it to hell and back. Just watch out not to overextend when elites appear :)

shoki
April 3 2013, 09:16:52 AM
Then, Command ship it is.
thanks.

btw is the FHC corp active?

Tajidan
April 3 2013, 12:41:04 PM
Then, Command ship it is.
thanks.

btw is the FHC corp active?

kind of. im usually on, squadding with my brother or sometimes if im lucky getting the honoures of doing glorious pve with entity and bek (lief?)

Takon Orlani
April 3 2013, 12:50:06 PM
There's been a HUGE drop off in activity since it hit steam.

shoki
April 3 2013, 01:53:51 PM
well, shit
my nake is fatshoki, so hit me up if you remember, i want to play this with people.
I usually also play with my brother, but we're so green we leave green stains wherever we go, so a knowledgeable benevolent leader would be a godsend.

shoki
April 4 2013, 07:52:57 PM
whose frig to take for PvE?

Lief Siddhe
April 7 2013, 01:39:50 AM
Im not bek, i'm dobrique

Re: frigs - armortanking Hydra was my choice with remote armor and shield reps and the armor resist thingy if i got primaried in a bad place

Tajidan
April 8 2013, 11:01:08 AM
Im not bek, i'm dobrique

Re: frigs - armortanking Hydra was my choice with remote armor and shield reps and the armor resist thingy if i got primaried in a bad place

ah my fault.

i just bought an acid hydra yesterday because of paintjob and gimmicky warpgate lol. would hydra2 been the better choice for pve? i felt like it doesn't matter much but i haven't been looking at the stats to closely.

Stige
April 9 2013, 08:40:35 PM
Acid Hydra has better resists, Hydra 2 has slightly more Hull HP.